Shielded cat6 cable

stevep

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Hi, i have availability of cat6 shielded awg23 solid copper cable from a family member. If i use the correct rj45 plugs is this ok to use for running to my cameras? I understand the basics of grounding, so if both ends are terminated correctly do i need to do anything else or buy special routers etc....?? Thanks in advance

Steve
 

fenderman

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Hi, i have availability of cat6 shielded awg23 solid copper cable from a family member. If i use the correct rj45 plugs is this ok to use for running to my cameras? I understand the basics of grounding, so if both ends are terminated correctly do i need to do anything else or buy special routers etc....?? Thanks in advance

Steve
If you intend to power via ethernet and you should, you will need a poe switch...ensure the cable is NOT CCA.
 

stevep

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Thanks for the swift reply fenderman cable is solid copper.... ok I have a POE NVR on its way from Andy, I am more concerned if i can use shielded ftp cat6 cable? will i have problems or can i use it like normal cat6 cable? I have the metal rj45 plugs but an getting lost with grounding etc do i wrap the foils and ground wire under the plug at both ends?....do i need special router with grounding plugs? I hope i am making sense?
 

fenderman

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Thanks for the swift reply fenderman cable is solid copper.... ok I have a POE NVR on its way from Andy, I am more concerned if i can use shielded ftp cat6 cable? will i have problems or can i use it like normal cat6 cable? I have the metal rj45 plugs but an getting lost with grounding etc do i wrap the foils and ground wire under the plug at both ends?....do i need special router with grounding plugs? I hope i am making sense?
remember that when cable is labeled solid it means the wire core is solid vs stranded....what brand is the cable? cable is the cheapest component in the install but most labor intensive and difficult to diagnose if there are issues...use known good quality stuff...
you are better off using standard cat6 and not messing with this..
 

stevep

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This is the cable below, what are the issues i will find? I am in the uk. If used just for normal runs to cameras should it be ok to use ?

Our kenable Cat6 FTP outdoor cable is designed with FULL COPPER 23AWG twisted pairs and is Foil Shielded to ensure any interference is kept under control, it also has a drain wire so can be earthed! Our cat 6 FTP cables also have a divider to separate the twisted pairs reducing cross talk.

Its inner film enhances the already weatherproof UV Resistant PE sheath and keeps away any condensation that may build up. Suitable for burying underground mounting to buildings or installing indoors the 7mm copper cable is durable and easy to install delivering gigabit speeds (subject to your network).

Supplied in 50m 100m and 305m Lengths.


RoHS Compliant
CAT 6 Solid Roll of Ethernet Cable - BLACK
Foil Shielded
Drain Wire
305 metres long
4 x pairs (8 wire)
Conforms to ISO/IEC 11801, ANSI/TIA/EIA-568A
Approximately 7mm thick
UV resistant
4x2x0.50 Copper
0.95HDPE+Aluminium foil+1x0.5 CCA drain+5.5PE
 

fenderman

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improperly grounding the cable can increase interference....also being that the cable is burial rated it will be thick and hard to work with indoors...it is complete overkill..
 

stevep

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Ok, the main reason for asking is that my brother has lots available, I plan to run all cables externally along walls and plan to bring them into house through external wall straight into NVR... There is no electrical cables near by to interfere with so i understand the overkill thought but as i said i do not have to buy this, its free if i can use it..... if i use the correct jacks do you think i can use or do you still think i should buy normal cat6 ?
 

ChooChooman74

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I just used direct burial Cat 6 for a camera where I buried the wire to the remote building. It is not easy to terminate. Prefer regular cat5e or cat6 any day.
 

Benak

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Sheilded cable should only drain at one side of the run, I think this is what was being asked? For your application I would land the drain at the end the NVR is near and bond that to the NVR ground.

But really the best answer is what everyone is saying, use different cable.
 

TonyR

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Sheilded cable should only drain at one side of the run, I think this is what was being asked? For your application I would land the drain at the end the NVR is near and bond that to the NVR ground.
Regarding grounding the drain wire on shielded Ethernet cable....

So you are saying that you know better than a well known manufacturer (Ubiquiti) that recommends when using an outdoor Ethernet surge protector to install one near the CPE (radio, IP camera, etc.) where it's grounded and one near the entrance to building where it is also grounded and BOTH ends of the shielded cable with shielded RJ-45 connectors are grounded when plugged into the grounded surge arrestors?

They are grounding BOTH ends of the shield and drain wire, contrary to your suggestion.

Have you informed Ubiquiti of their error? :facepalm:

Ubiquiti_ESD_Protection.jpg
 

STGMavrick

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Terminating both sides creates a ground loop and traps magnetic flux which defeats the purpose. I think you're reading that diagram wrong. Grounding the device is not the same as grounding the shield. Which doesn't even matter in a home setting and STP is entirely unnecessary.
 

Benak

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So you are saying that you know better than a well known manufacturer (Ubiquiti) that recommends when using an outdoor Ethernet surge protector to install one near the CPE (radio, IP camera, etc.) where it's grounded and one near the entrance to building where it is also grounded and BOTH ends of the shielded cable with shielded RJ-45 connectors are grounded when plugged into the grounded surge arrestors?

Have you informed Ubiquiti of their error? :facepalm:

View attachment 28449
I wasn't aware the OP was using the cable with the gear you outlined, in which case yeah, always do whatever the manufacturer tells you too.

I'm not thaf familiar with ubiquity gear (I do have two switches from them, maybe I should look closer). My limited understanding of the 802.3 standards is that devices "shall" have isolated power supplies so in that case, you're correct, terminate the shield everywhere if your stuff is 100% compliant and has isolated power supplies and you'll be fine but pay attention to you grounding at those devices. If you have a different setup/not purely 802.3 compliant I would look closer but I'm not looking to argue with you.

In the end, with the OP using this from his POE port to a camera (I think?) this doesn't matter. The port he plugs into at the switch/hub/injector/etc. will need to provide a path to ground to drain the shield. Does anyone make an IP camera that has uses a shielded female RJ45 port? If so how does that device accommodate grounding? Industrial cameras probably do I suppose?

Thanks
 

TonyR

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I think you're reading that diagram wrong. Grounding the device is not the same as grounding the shield.
So I'm reading the diagram wrong? Then how about a picture (below) ? It's all metal and it's all tied together, mechanically and electrically...the one-piece grounding tab and bezel that surrounds and connects mechanically and electrically to the two metal RJ-45 female jacks. Of course, the shielded RJ-45 male plugs that plug into those jacks are metal, too. And they have a place to tie the drain wire in the shielded cable to.

ubnt_surge_metal.jpg

Which doesn't even matter in a home setting and STP is entirely unnecessary.
Apparently you have not witnessed nearby lightning strikes in the SE portion of the U.S. (AL, GA, FL, MS, TN, SC).

Also: Are you saying only factories, plants and commercial buildings have EMI, RFI and induced static and it's not an issue in a residential setting? Come on, man....
 

Benak

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I think the point is that incorrect grounding is more likely to cause problems then trying to implement shielded Ethernet cable where it isn't needed... I can't speak for others here and what someone deems nessecary in their own home is definitely up to them.
 

STGMavrick

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So I'm reading the diagram wrong? Then how about a picture (below) ? It's all metal and it's all tied together, mechanically and electrically...the one-piece grounding tab and bezel that surrounds and connects mechanically and electrically to the two metal RJ-45 female jacks. Of course, the shielded RJ-45 male plugs that plug into those jacks are metal, too. And they have a place to tie the drain wire in the shielded cable to.

View attachment 28450
Nice picture. Ground loop. Do some research then think about why that AP might have a shield grounded jack.

Apparently you have not witnessed nearby lightning strikes in the SE portion of the U.S. (AL, GA, FL, MS, TN, SC).
Lightning strikes have nothing to do with shielding. That's the job of the TVSS in line device that should be installed on each run with a proper earth ground.

Also: Are you saying only factories, plants and commercial buildings have EMI, RFI and induced static and it's not an issue in a residential setting? Come on, man....
Nope, I'm saying it's rare regardless of location, especially if the electrician running the cabling does his job, and especially in a home setting. Well, unless you live right next to a radar station, that can do some shit...

But what do I know? I'm just some guy with a keyboard on the internet. Though I will attach a picture of what I do for a living. Excuse the Ethernet mess though, the electrician's drawings showed the cat5 going into my main control panel instead of my network rack that my contract specs called for. I had to get creative and keep my startup on schedule with daisy chaining what switches I had in my bag until the change order to add one went through.

Side note, want to guess how much of this plant with all it's big 3 phase 480 several hundred horse motors, analog transmitters, vfds, 120 signals, etc is STP? I'll give you a hint. It's the same amount of 99.9%(there might have been one exception or two over the years that's slipped my mind.) of every plant project I've been on over my career.
 

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TonyR

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Wow.

You're bringing up electricians, lightning strikes, in-line power surge arresting, etc....basically your 300 word diatribe has nothing to do with any of this so at this point I think I'll stop arguing with someone who prefers to cite what all he knows.

Instead of a lengthy rebuttal I'll go get that root canal I've always wanted.

BTW, be sure to let Ubiquiti know they are wrong, too.
 
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TonyR

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I think the point is that incorrect grounding is more likely to cause problems then trying to implement shielded Ethernet cable where it isn't needed... I can't speak for others here and what someone deems nessecary in their own home is definitely up to them.
No, as long as STP is properly installed and grounded it will only cost more, it won't cause problems. It may be overkill for where it's to be deployed but that should be decided on a case-by-case basis, not by a one-size-fits-all policy.
 

STGMavrick

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Wow.

You're bringing up electricians, lightning strikes, in-line power surge arresting, etc....basically your 300 word diatribe has nothing to do with any of this so at this point I think I'll stop arguing with someone who prefers to cite what all he knows.

Instead of a lengthy rebuttal I'll go get that root canal I've always wanted.

BTW, be sure to let Ubiquiti know they are wrong, too.
Lol. Again, look up ground loops. The reason why the APs have shielded connectors is so that the end user has a choice as to where they want the shield side grounded.

I didn't bring up lightning strikes...you did. And you referenced it to STP. I corrected you by saying grounding a shield isn't going to protect equipment, a TVSS will.

Hope that root canal works out. Though something tells me you'd argue about how it's supposed to be done with the surgeon because you happened to see a diagram of it on Google. Also, sorry you had to read about my experience. I wrote it so the rest of the readers looking for the correct information know not to listen to yours.
 

Deff

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Hi, i have availability of cat6 shielded awg23 solid copper cable from a family member. If i use the correct rj45 plugs is this ok to use for running to my cameras? I understand the basics of grounding, so if both ends are terminated correctly do i need to do anything else or buy special routers etc....?? Thanks in advance

Steve
Hi Steve,
The cable you have is of an excellent quality.
If you have in mind to use Ethernet Surge protectors, yes, it makes absolutely sense to use an STP (Shielded Twisted Pairs) Ethernet cable, possibly cat 6+ or cat 7 if the cameras are PoE (Power over Ethernet). The cable you have, is even better than an STP, it's an SFTP (Shielded Foiled Twisted Pairs) cable, that on top of the Screen (a metal braid around the whole cable...) also has each Twisted Pair wrapped (screened) with foil, so even better quality. The problem with your cable is that is a 'trunking cable' with solid copper conductors (very stiff), which is normally used to connect (almost linearly) Ethernet patch panels with a certain type or RJ45 connectors; most of times 'keystone' RJ45 connectors which accept solid metal conductors, and require a tool to insert the solid wires in the Pairs into the RJ45 connector, so using the cable you have to CRIMP screened RJ45 PLUGS on it: good luck with that...RJ45 plugs (even the screened good quality ones) do not accept solid wires and the crimps tool struggle with them. By the way, if somehow you can sort out the problem, good for you.
About the Screen connection. You're right, screens should always be connected on both ends to be "effective", since:
  • a screen connected to BOTH ENDS, protects against MAGNETIC FIELDS and ELECTRIC FIELDS
  • a screen connected to ONE END only, protects against ELECTRIC FIELDS only.
Connecting one end of the screen only, is rather a legacy thing, and was used in very harsh environments (like Railways), where ground loops were a thing...they aren't so much anymore, but still happens to find signal equipment with the cable screen connected to one end only, when entering a Signal Room...that cable is probably there since 20+ years...
About the scheme that you've published, it's correct, everything in the scheme with a "blue shield" on it, is shielded and therefore protected by lightnings, including the Ethernet cable of course)...with exception of the RJ45 connector on the Camera. They haven't a screened RJ45 connector, since they have no ground connection and therefore a screen can't be connected anywhere. In event of a lightning that strikes the metal pole where the camera is installed, the camera is normally in a plastic box and its internal circuitry SHOULD be of the "double insulation" type, so the camera is protected, together with the wires in the Twisted Pairs connected to its RJ45 connector.
The problem is when the lightning strikes the Ethernet cable or the metal pole, in which case there are chances that it could indirectly couple into the Twisted Pairs of the Ethernet cable in form of a Surge, which has a VERY high energy and could possibly lead to disruption of equipment connected inside your house. In such case the screen around the Ethernet cable, and those Surge suppressors do the job. The first thing that the lightning would strike, would be the screen around the Ethernet cable, which is connected to ground to both ends by means of those suppressors.
Least but not last:
1) make sure to use screened RJ45 PLUGS on all of the Ethernet cables from the Camera until the router NVR, DVR or wherever you connect the Ethernet cables coming from the cameras outside in your house. Also make sure that on top of screened RJ45 ports (they're normally equipped with them...) the router, or wherever you connect your cameras, has a good connection to ground (a dedicated earth stud or a wire in the mains/power supply, or both...).
 
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