Expand Avigilon Licenses or move to Hikvision

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n3wb
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Hi,

After my post n the Newbies section I thought Id see what peoples opinions are on my current dilema.. Slightly long read...

My current CCTV system consists of Avigilon Software running on a server and 12TB NAS storage, coupled to a mix of Hikvision and Avigilon cameras.

I have an 8 camera license for the Avigilon, currently version 5.

Im now at the stage where Im looking to add more cameras to cover different parts of the building and an outbuilding. I think I may need to go beyond 12 cameras, so would need another 4+1 camera licenses for the avigilon server (if they still sell them in groups of 4 or 1 only).

Whilst I really like the Avigilon software and have stuck with it for a few years, Im getting a bit sick of the whole smoke and mirrors pricing with Avigion software and licenses whenever Ive had the need to upgrade or expand. So I am now considering moving the whole lot to a Hikvision NVR. I actually prefer the Hikvision cameras I have to the Avigilon ones, especially when comparing the Hikvision Turrets to the Avigilon Domes. Low lying sun can sometimes catch the domes and all but wipes the picture out (probably not the most appropriate camera type for the location, my fault).

All of my cameras are currently powered by POE, the vast majority of the wired network in the home is gigabit, and there is always a gigabit link back to the server room where the NVR would be housed. Not all cameras are connected directly back to the server room, they may connect into a POE switch at one point in the house and then there is a single gigabit backhaul from that switch to a switch in the server room.

So, Im either now going to get another few camera licenses for Avigilon, at which point Im no doubt going to be told I need to upgrade to version 6 in order to ad more channels, and whatever that costs. Or I go for the 16 channel Hikvision NVR and reuse the Avigilon Cameras that I can via ONVIF. Hopefully I can still employ motion detection this way too.

What are peoples thoughts? Stick with the Avigilon software and add the necessary channel licenses or start again and go with a Hikvision NVR, and then Im good for up to 16 channels before more expense at the NVR end?

Is my current network/wiring up to the job, or do I really need to get every camera back to the NVR individually?

Id also like to have the ability to monitor remotely, and perhas even have a permanent monitor set up in one room/outbuilding.

Grateful for any input or opinion...
 
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fenderman

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Hi,

After my post n the Newbies section I thought Id see what peoples opinions are on my current dilema.. Slightly long read...

My current CCTV system consists of Avigilon Software running on a sever and 12TB NAS storage, copupled to a mix of Hikvision and Avigilon cameras.

I have an 8 camera license for the Avigilon, currently version 5.

Im now at the stage where Im looking to add more cameras to cover different parts of the building and an outbuilding. I think I may need to go beyond 12 cameras, so would need another 4+1 camera licenses for the avigilon server (if they still sell them in groups of 4 or 1 only).

Whilst I really like the Avigilon software and have stuck with it for a few years, Im getting a bit sick of the whole smoke and mirrors pricing with Avigion software and licenses whenever Ive had the need to upgrade or expand. So I am now considering moving the whole lot to a Hikvision NVR. I actually prefer the Hikvision cameras I have to the Avigilon ones, especially when comparing the Hikvision Turrets to the Avigilon Domes. Low lying sun can sometimes catch the domes and all but wipes the picture out (probably not the most appropriate camera type for the location, my fault).

All of my cameras are currently powered by POE, the vast majority of the wired network in the home is gigabit, and there is always a gigabit link back to the server room where the NVR would be housed. Not all cameras are connected directly back to the server room, they may connect into a POE switch at one point in the house and then there is a single gigabit backhaul from that switch to a switch in the server room.

So, Im either now going to get another few camera licenses for Avigilon, at which point Im no doubt going to be told I need to upgrade to version 6 in order to ad more channels, and whatever that costs. Or I go for the 16 channel Hikvision NVR and reuse the Avigilon Cameras that I can via ONVIF. Hopefully I can still employ motion detection this way too.

What are peoples thoughts? Stick with the Avigilon software and add the necessary channel licenses or start again and go with a Hikvision NVR, and then Im good for up to 16 channels before more expense at the NVR end?

Is my current network/wiring up to the job, or do I really need to get every camera back to the NVR individually?

Id also like to have the ability to monitor remotely, and perhas even have a permanent monitor set up in one room/outbuilding.

Grateful for any input or opinion...
You will not be happy with a hikvision NVR. Consider DW ipvms - which is NX witness outside north america - 70 bux a license and lifetime updates. Also consider blue iris.
 

GCoco

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My $0.02.

Get a Hik NVR or Blue Iris. I personally prefer the NVR.

If you are looking at going 12 or more cameras, go with a 32 channel machine. Generally as you get close to the maximum number of cameras, you run into bandwith problems. But the biggest issue is you always find a reason to keep adding cameras.

The bigger NVRs do not have POE ports but rather just 2 ports. One for the NVR LAN and one for external LAN. So you need POE switches and they can be located anywhere. You just daisy change the switches. The switch closest to the NVR would need to be gigabit switch since you would likely exceed 100 Mbps into the NVR. The other switches can be 100Mbps since a typical camera doesn’t exceed 10Mbps.

The NVR has two HDMI ports so you can have a dedicated monitor. The NVR also can be accessed using a Web GUI. The NVR has a virtual host feature that allows direct access to the camera if settings need changing.
 

Redball

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Many thanks for the input so far. Never heard of Networkoptix before. Just had a look and although it looks good, I cant find any pricing information anywhere. Is it one off payment and connect as many cameras as you want, or price per camera connection, and where can I find published prices, or even retailers? I really cant be doing with all this nonsense about "call for price"; Its whats turned me off the avigilon gear eventually.
 

fenderman

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Many thanks for the input so far. Never heard of Networkoptix before. Just had a look and although it looks good, I cant find any pricing information anywhere. Is it one off payment and connect as many cameras as you want, or price per camera connection, and where can I find published prices, or even retailers? I really cant be doing with all this nonsense about "call for price"; Its whats turned me off the avigilon gear eventually.
Its per camera. You need to contact them or a reseller. In north america it is distributed by DW and branded DW and sold for 70 dollars per camera.
 

tangent

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Im now at the stage where Im looking to add more cameras to cover different parts of the building and an outbuilding. I think I may need to go beyond 12 cameras, so would need another 4+1 camera licenses for the avigilon server (if they still sell them in groups of 4 or 1 only).
What kind of building is this? Residential? Commercial?
 

Redball

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What kind of building is this? Residential? Commercial?
Hi, it's my home. Residential.

Its per camera. You need to contact them or a reseller. In north america it is distributed by DW and branded DW and sold for 70 dollars per camera.
I believe pricing on Networkoptix to be about the same in pounds in the UK. Unless some US distributor will sell it to me in the UK.

Even then at £55 per camera, to take my current 12 license to 17 would be £935. Which is more than just adding the extra 5 to Avigilon and sticking with the same system.

Cheapest option appears to be a 16 or possibly 32 channel Hikvision NVR, and use some 4TB drives I already have here. But I'm conscious that I may lose some quality of interface between avigilon and Hikvision.

Is their free software the same interface as on the NVRs themselves?

If so I could set that up and trial it with my Hikvision cameras (as I know the software from Hikvision doesn't allow adding of non Hikvision cameras unlike the hardware NVRs).

Thanks again for input.
 

fenderman

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Hi, it's my home. Residential.



I believe pricing on Networkoptix to be about the same in pounds in the UK. Unless some US distributor will sell it to me in the UK.

Even then at £55 per camera, to take my current 12 license to 17 would be £935. Which is more than just adding the extra 5 to Avigilon and sticking with the same system.

Cheapest option appears to be a 16 or possibly 32 channel Hikvision NVR, and use some 4TB drives I already have here. But I'm conscious that I may lose some quality of interface between avigilon and Hikvision.

Is their free software the same interface as on the NVRs themselves?

If so I could set that up and trial it with my Hikvision cameras (as I know the software from Hikvision doesn't allow adding of non Hikvision cameras unlike the hardware NVRs).

Thanks again for input.
You will not be happy with an NVR after using avigilon. But sometimes you need to learn the hard way.
Nx might be a bit more expensive now, but remember it includes free future upgrades to new versions.
 

Redball

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In what way dont you think i would be happy? Functionality?

The free upgrades is true and a good point, but then to me it looks like I'm just swapping one 'pay per camera' system for another, but saving the £100 or so every couple of years when I want or need to upgrade.

Ideally I'd like to know if the iVMS software from Hikvision is the same interface as on the NVR, in which case I can try out hikvision (on my Hikvision cameras at least) to see whether the NVR option would meet my needs. Does anyone know?
 

fenderman

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In what way dont you think i would be happy? Functionality?

The free upgrades is true and a good point, but then to me it looks like I'm just swapping one 'pay per camera' system for another, but saving the £100 or so every couple of years when I want or need to upgrade.

Ideally I'd like to know if the iVMS software from Hikvision is the same interface as on the NVR, in which case I can try out hikvision (on my Hikvision cameras at least) to see whether the NVR option would meet my needs. Does anyone know?
It costs more than 100 dollars to upgrade 17 avigilon licenses.
 

Redball

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Last time it worked out that if you bought one new camera license for the latest version, it automatically upgraded the rest of the estate. I've sent off for quotes on how to achieve the number of camera channels on avigilon and shall see what the price is. At least then I can compare without guessing.

That's the main thing that annoys me, I can't just get a price online, it's all hidden and up to dealers to charge what they like, special pricing for corporates etc etc. Hikvision at least it's no secret and I can see prices online without having to ask several places to give me a price.
 

fenderman

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Last time it worked out that if you bought one new camera license for the latest version, it automatically upgraded the rest of the estate. I've sent off for quotes on how to achieve the number of camera channels on avigilon and shall see what the price is. At least then I can compare without guessing.

That's the main thing that annoys me, I can't just get a price online, it's all hidden and up to dealers to charge what they like, special pricing for corporates etc etc. Hikvision at least it's no secret and I can see prices online without having to ask several places to give me a price.
Most hikvision dealers dont post pricing online. There is special pricing for volume buyers/installers. You just dont get to see it.
You can also use blue iris you many need a powerful machine for 17 cams if they are high res.
 

Redball

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No problem on the machine front, I've got ex servers or i7 desktops lying around. Perks of being in charge of the IT at work lol.

Shall see what the cost of simply upgrading the avigilon is and then at least have a baseline to compare other options against.
 

tangent

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Ideally I'd like to know if the iVMS software from Hikvision is the same interface as on the NVR, in which case I can try out hikvision (on my Hikvision cameras at least) to see whether the NVR option would meet my needs. Does anyone know?
iVMS isn't the same as the interface on the NVR, but iVMS can be used to interface with an NVR.
NVRs are generally much more limiting that VMS software running on a PC. Based on what you've been using, it's hard to imagine you'd be happy with an NVR.

You've got the hardware, it's easy enough to try different VMS software. As linked above there are lots of options with free trials or limited versions that work with a small number of cameras. Blue Iris is a pretty capable and cheap option, but there are certainly plenty of other things you could try.
 

Redball

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Hi, another update - i may have the opportunity to purchase a used Avigilon NVR with 8 core camera licenses. Is there any way that these channel licenses could be transferred over to my current system? My current system is standard, but I dont now need the functionality of standard over core because core includes remote access, wheras back on version 4 this was only possible with standard, hence why Im on standard as thats what I purchased several years ago in order to get remote access.

Is it possible to upgrade a used core NVR to standard licenses and then transfer over to my system, or downgrade my system to core and then transfer the licenses over?

Any way to take my standard 12 channel setup and a core 8 channel setup and end up with a single 20 channel setup, and what would this require?

Again, all input appreciated.
 

Thorvald

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First you can’t mix and match Core and Standard (or Enterprise) licenses on the same “site” or NVR. Yes you can upgrade the Core to Standard, there is a specific part number for that. I guess you could great a parent child site and mix licenses but never played with that.

As for moving the licenses I’ve found you can normally deactivate the licenses and re-activate on a new system. You do this all from the Avigilon Control Center Admin Tool if it is running ACC4 or ACC5. Otherwise ACC6 you use the client software. If you have done this too many times the licenses may be locked out and you will need to call tech support (it’s free) and get them to reset the counter to allow moving the licenses again.

There is a huge benefit of core, upgrades are free always. So you can move to ACC Version 6 (and whatever is next) and start using ACC Mobile 3. Standard required an upgrade to move to version 6 but the licenses are very cheap to upgrade from ACC5 to ACC6 (moving from core to standard or enterprise however isn’t cheap)... all depends on how nice the dealer is to you.

Yes you can combine/use the two licenses once you have upgraded the core to standard. Using ACC6 licenses are site wide so you can have multiple NVRs and the licenses are spread around as needed.

The cost to upgrade from core to standard could cost upwards of $1000 if you have a dealer that charges full price.
 
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knighty

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any news/updates here / anything new? what did you do op?

I've used a bunch of different software over the years (from back before IP cameras were a thing)

running dahua cameras right now, and the dahue smartpss software... which is ok... ish... tends to crash during playback :-(

I tried the 30 days free of Avigilon and LOVED it.... it's so much better than anything else I've tried - I tried a load of different free trials etc. - nothing else comes close.... but damn it's expensive

about £7500 in camera licenses for me when I priced it up :-o

I don't want anything fancy, just 24/7 recording and fast/efficient playback - give me a slider so I can scroll through that days recordings... and have lots of cameras playback smoothly all at once (Avigilon is awesome at this)

but,.... I can't afford Avigilon, so I'm a bit stuck :-(
 

fenderman

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any news/updates here / anything new? what did you do op?

I've used a bunch of different software over the years (from back before IP cameras were a thing)

running dahua cameras right now, and the dahue smartpss software... which is ok... ish... tends to crash during playback :-(

I tried the 30 days free of Avigilon and LOVED it.... it's so much better than anything else I've tried - I tried a load of different free trials etc. - nothing else comes close.... but damn it's expensive

about £7500 in camera licenses for me when I priced it up :-o

I don't want anything fancy, just 24/7 recording and fast/efficient playback - give me a slider so I can scroll through that days recordings... and have lots of cameras playback smoothly all at once (Avigilon is awesome at this)

but,.... I can't afford Avigilon, so I'm a bit stuck :-(
take a look at nxwitness
 
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