Dahua camera phoning home to China

I love the irony of spending money for security surveillance equipment only to not trust it... I have been a longtime lurker and have not spent a single penny on anything camera related. I'm starting to think I'm better off. Can anyone convince me why I should get a security camera setup for my house? It seems that buying one will make me less secure (you can't even trust the devices).

Are there any trustworthy sources for cameras? buying from a china-sourced website (Ali) doesn't seem like the way to go anymore.

I like having a security camera system to deter thieves, and its been useful capturing workmen who damaged property who didn't own up to it. Its generally been useful to have eyes on things.
There are cameras which can be trusted, but they aren't cheap and typically dont come from China, for example, my Avigilon cameras have been silent and made no attempts to instigate traffic anywhere, a marked difference to my Dahua and Hikvisions.

legend1011 said:

I love the irony of spending money for security surveillance equipment only to not trust it... I have been a longtime lurker and have not spent a single penny on anything camera related. I'm starting to think I'm better off. Can anyone convince me why I should get a security camera setup for my house? It seems that buying one will make me less secure (you can't even trust the devices).

Are there any trustworthy sources for cameras? buying from a china-sourced website (Ali) doesn't seem like the way to go anymore.

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You purchased a home in what is likely a safe neighborhood. Oh the irony of having to put locks on your door.
They are not security cameras, they are surveillance cameras. If you are not skilled enough to block internet access to the camera and cant spend more than 5 minuets to do the research then by all means dont get any cameras. Interesting that you trust your cell phone and pc tough. Probably a lot more sensitive info on those devices. Its literally takes 5 minuets to make this a non-issue. For some like you, that is too much time and there is no convincing you otherwise.
There are non-china manufactures like avigilon. Be prepared to spend.

Its all good, you will eventually buy the cams when something happens and you wished you had some info on who and how.

legend1011 said:

I love the irony of spending money for security surveillance equipment only to not trust it... I have been a longtime lurker and have not spent a single penny on anything camera related. I'm starting to think I'm better off. Can anyone convince me why I should get a security camera setup for my house? It seems that buying one will make me less secure (you can't even trust the devices).

Are there any trustworthy sources for cameras? buying from a china-sourced website (Ali) doesn't seem like the way to go anymore.

Click to expand...

Such is the software that runs any device or piece of machinary, whether it be a camera, car, TV, or factory equipment etc. Knowing these things aren't 100% full proof is the key to being security conscience & knowing to lock stuff down appropriately. I still have WindowsXP PC that I use occasionally, but I certainly don't use it anymore to access the internet. That's just asking for trouble .

legend1011 said:

<Snip>... Can anyone convince me why I should get a security camera setup for my house? It seems that buying one will make me less secure (you can't even trust the devices).

Are there any trustworthy sources for cameras? buying from a china-sourced website (Ali) doesn't seem like the way to go anymore.

Click to expand...

Only you can convince yourself whether or not a camera system is right for you. For me it is a little bit of piece of mind for when no one is home. It's more a deterrent than anything else. Whilst it doesn't guarantee safety, it does give me the ability to capture any unscrupulous person(s) performing any malicious activities against my property and increases the likelihood of that person or persons being caught and brought to justice.

Every man made device has a flaw. One needs to educate ones self in knowing how to protect against those flaws.

@user54t45t

where did you buy your cameras ? Where they international models or Chinese model hacked to English ?

What are the model numbers on the cameras ?

Personally would recommend delving into Mikrotik routers if you want to play around with VLANs, although would recommend using a Mikrotik router just for routing, not as a VLAN switch. Smart switch for that.

legend1011 said:

I love the irony of spending money for security surveillance equipment only to not trust it... I have been a longtime lurker and have not spent a single penny on anything camera related. I'm starting to think I'm better off. Can anyone convince me why I should get a security camera setup for my house? It seems that buying one will make me less secure (you can't even trust the devices).

Are there any trustworthy sources for cameras? buying from a china-sourced website (Ali) doesn't seem like the way to go anymore.

Click to expand...

As already noted, a camera system is not for security. If you are worried about home security, then you need to invest in a monitored alarm system.

I like Fenderman's response that a camera system is for surveillance, not security. It's quite possible that you don't have a reason to need cameras. However many of us feel that the cost of good quality CCTV cameras have dropped to the point where it makes sense to spend a little money to help avoid a larger financial loss - by theft, fraud, etc.

As a long time lurker, you should know that you don't want to buy camera's from Chinese sources like Ali because the firmware will not be English and they cannot generally be upgraded to the right firmware. It's not a problem to buy Chinese CCTV cameras from more legitimate sources (including reputable sellers on Ali) as long as you take a few steps to prevent them from having access to the internet. If this is beyond your capabilities, then it is time to call in a professional to help.

SouthernYankee said:

@user54t45t

where did you buy your cameras ? Where they international models or Chinese model hacked to English ?

What are the model numbers on the cameras ?

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Mine were just ebay/aliexpress with the specs I wanted - specifically Mic & PIR for indoor cameras, and zoom dome cameras for outside. Much harder to find vandal proof dome cameras, with PIR and audio. Vandal proof domes with audio and PIR would be SO nice, since most of what I film is shadows dancing

So what about those of us who bought the cameras purely to be able to open an app on the phone when we are not home, and check out what is happening at home?
I have a security system...but I want to be the one who responds to an incident. I get notification of any movement and then want to log into the cameras and see what the next step is.
This isn't the USA...this is South Africa. We do things differently here.
So I have 8 cameras linked to an NVR, and access the cameras via iDMSS Plus.
Which means the NVR needs internet access and is linked to the router.
What fairly simple steps do I need to take to minimize risk? I'm no expert on networks etc, so need suggestions that are simple and logical. Thanks in advance.

Try to get a static IP address for you mobile phone (this is a extra feature from many network providers) and only allow access from/to this IP to the NVR on your internet modem.
If static IP is not possible, find out IP range(s) from your provider and do same for this. If you have this setup, at least you can be sure that the NVR does not send data to china/usa.

Not possible here. Plus the phone uses wifi from many, many places...would not be feasible.
I would have expected most people use their cameras this way. Seems odd to only want to view footage afterwards. In most cases they are going to be taking your nvr or pc setup anyways.
So live viewing on mobile isn't the main use?

Off course I do this as well. I've 9 ip cams, all of them chinese brands with blocked internet access. I use Synology's SurveillanceStation and DScam app on my mobile.
There is no cloud service,etc. involved, I access my NAS directly.

Chaos said:

So I have 8 cameras linked to an NVR, and access the cameras via iDMSS Plus.
Which means the NVR needs internet access and is linked to the router.
What fairly simple steps do I need to take to minimize risk? I'm no expert on networks etc, so need suggestions that are simple and logical. Thanks in advance.

Click to expand...

I would advise setting it up with vpn server on your router, and blocking nvr and cameras from connecting to outside via firewall. Asus routers with Merlin firmware should provide both funcionalities, at least consumer mid level and upwards. I do it this way at home. Asus router with OpenVPN server. If you don't have static IP address or that location, then you would also need to setup dynamic dns service which would provide updating your external IP address when it changes. For versatile firewall on Asus routers with Merlin firmware I would advise Skynet addon/script. Skynet has builtin option for blocking your home IOT devices via IP addresses from conecting to anything outside of your home network, and at the same time it allows for contacting and viewing your cameras through VPN from any outside network.
Setting up a vpn and dynamic dns has been discussed multiple times and there are many tutorials so there is no need to to write it all here. Can easily be found via google. But if you encounter some specific issues in setting it up feel free to ask for advice.
Steps for setting it up:
1. router with vpn ability (openvpn preferably)
2. set dynamic dns service on router if you don't have static ip (WAN) external address, verify that dynamic dns service updates your external IP address when it changes
3. setup vpn server on router, generate and export config for clients to connect to
4. install vpn client software on any device that needs to access cameras from outside (mobile phone, laptop etc...)
5. import vpn configuration to that vpn client, with special care regarding dynamic dns hostname
6. connect to your home network from outside network via vpn from remote device (mobile phone, laptop...)
7. connect to your nvr/cameras via their local IP addresses via DMSS

VPN connection needs to be established or you to be able to access your home network and devices.

For blocking cameras and NVR from contacting internet on Asus routers, I recommend having Merlin firmware, adding USB stick to its usb port permanently and installing AMTM script to it, which then enables you to easily install Skynet firewall and few other neat addons.
In Skynet you can then go to settings and there is submenu or blocking IOT devices. There you add ip addresses of your nvr and cameras.

Of course, you can do many of similar things on other routers and firmwares, but I'm somewhat familiar with Asus and Skynet, also Tomato and Advanced Tomato, and consider it rather well documented on internet, with plenty of guides. And it's rather simple to do, with most of the steps doable via graphical user interface.

Chaos said:

So what about those of us who bought the cameras purely to be able to open an app on the phone when we are not home, and check out what is happening at home?
I have a security system...but I want to be the one who responds to an incident. I get notification of any movement and then want to log into the cameras and see what the next step is.
This isn't the USA...this is South Africa. We do things differently here.
So I have 8 cameras linked to an NVR, and access the cameras via iDMSS Plus.
Which means the NVR needs internet access and is linked to the router.
What fairly simple steps do I need to take to minimize risk? I'm no expert on networks etc, so need suggestions that are simple and logical. Thanks in advance.

Click to expand...

Sure you can allow your cameras access to the web if you want, I would just have them on a seperate network to my LAN if you don't trust them. For me.. That means a VLAN for the cameras which is trunked through to my POE switch. Not something you can even do on a consumer router usually.. hence the above mikrotik recommendation. You could even use a hAP lite... Router OS is really awesome (note it took some time before I understood firewall configuration etc, which while simple can easily be incorrectly configured)

Another hardware option for VLANs and VPN access is the 'Prosumer' Ubiquiti brand. Their USG, managed switches and APs would get the job done, too.

DLONG2 said:

Another hardware option for VLANs and VPN access is the 'Prosumer' Ubiquiti brand. Their USG, managed switches and APs would get the job done, too.

Click to expand...

Or EdgeRouter X Best $59 I ever spent.