Can I truly achieve 30fps record

Discussion in 'Blue Iris' started by ulterior_motive, Jan 9, 2019.

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  1. ulterior_motive

    ulterior_motive n3wb

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    I NEED 30 FPS RECORDING AND VIEWING LIVE IN CONSOLE, I need to be able to capture slight of hand or pocketing of merchandise.

    I have 5 x Hikvision DS-2CD2143G0-I 4MP BNIB and will expand when cables are routed and stock at retailer is available. I need 10-12 cameras in my store to capture potentially all necessary angles.

    The resolution I would like to run at is 2688x1520 OR 2560x1440 OR 2304x1296. Any one of those resolutions are capable on my purchased camera.
    I would love to take advantage of the H265 codec.
    Why include or pay for specifications if I can't use them?

    This personactually posted a screen grab of 30 cameras running at LQ 10fps on a Xeon.
    This personmentions 10-15 fps on a 9700k.
    This personis running a Xeon at 10fps.

    I have been in and out of 100s of BI threads for the last year or two on multiple forums, I jumped the gun and bought the first 5 IP cameras from B&H. I don't own BI yet, but, I've read potentially every setting that I should enable and disable in BI to get a proper experience.

    I've narrowed the CPU to i7 8700k w. 16gb of ram,

    Everybody mentions used merchandise, I would much rather buy new and not worry than buy used and have a part failure. I've built countless computers for family and friends, I known my way around the internals of a PC, I would much rather build one.

    Is this achievable? Is megapixels in a IP camera a scam? What am I missing?

    I attached a screenshot of the 3 builds i found on the blue iris performance statistic's database. I was basing my PC build loosely off of those; console on @ 30fps, I7's, 10+ camera, PC consuming around 10gb of memory.
    Screenshot_20190109-023637.png
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
  2. nbstl68

    nbstl68 Getting comfortable

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    I thought I've seen some cameras offering even 60 FPS...but again why? I'd think even slight of hand quick grabs could be detected with a camera capturing 15-20 frames in a second.
     
  3. ulterior_motive

    ulterior_motive n3wb

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    I've gone through 3 systems in my store overtime:
    - from coax to VHS
    - from coax to geovision pc capture card
    - from coax to a dahua like DVR (current)
    which all captured 30fps.

    i figured 30fps was standard practice amongst all surveillance systems.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
  4. Q™

    Q™ IPCT Contributor

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    More is not necessarily better: you should be aiming for clarity and detail IMO, and not assume that running the highest available spec will give you the results you need. It appears you need to study and learn more before spending any more money.
     
  5. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    Yes, Blue Iris can handle 30 FPS and higher, as long as the system is fast enough. Personally I would go with a 9th gen CPU if buying new since the cost difference won't be too much and you do get 2 more real cores with 9th gen. i7-8700K is known to work for around 1500 MP/s (megapixels per second) of H.264 video through the use of Quick Sync hardware acceleration. I don't have any numbers for 9th gen but it should be a little higher.

    H.265 is not recommended since the Quick Sync hardware acceleration doesn't work properly with that codec. To accelerate H.265 decoding you need a high-end Nvidia card and that would cost a lot and likely more-than-double the power consumption of the PC. The slightly better compression ratio isn't worth it when you aren't keeping the video forever or constantly sending it over the internet.

    Anyway one 4MP camera at 30 FPS is 120 megapixels per second. 12 of those is 1440 megapixels per second and I wouldn't try to go over that. I can't guarantee it would run smoothly either, since 30 FPS streams give Blue Iris half as much time to process each frame as 15 FPS streams. If you can live with greatly impaired live viewing and motion detection performance, you can use BI's "Limit decoding" feature to drastically reduce the amount of processing that is done on each camera, which would basically guarantee that your system runs well even on lesser hardware.
     
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  6. looney2ns

    looney2ns IPCT Contributor

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    A lot of them use 5fps or less.
     
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  7. Q™

    Q™ IPCT Contributor

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    At my place of business I run 27 cameras which are running frame rates of 4fps (Hikvision) and 5fps (Dahua) all with a 3,072 bitrate; the resulting video is fine...I don't miss anything.

    At my home I run 12 cameras, all of which are running at 10fps (Dahua all with a 4,096 bitrate); the resulting video is fine...I don't miss anything.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2019
  8. ulterior_motive

    ulterior_motive n3wb

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    I'm coming at this with a different mindset, i just watched a comparison video from some website showing 1 fps vs 10 fps vs 30 fps, 10-20 fps is acceptable for my needs.
    I have been reading...
    6 gen cpu and greater, check, the savings here in Canada for a used 6th gen plus are not worth it, at some point, the research can only take me so far, i have to just do.
    I Definitely want this.
    Seems to be that way, i would have never figured.
    I would have loved to use 265, but (next quote)
    good call, like you said not worth it, Id rather keep that in my gaming PC =)
    I'll have to do more research to calculate MP/s per camera and figure threshold of CPU's

    I thank everybody so far for the information, I'll have to order some short run patch cables and unbox this switch thats been collecting, and implement this setup on my gaming rig without my video card to see some numbers.
     
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  9. Q™

    Q™ IPCT Contributor

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    Avoid CCA (Copper Clad Aluminum...aka CCAW) cables. Get solid copper 23 or 24 AWG cable.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
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  10. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    Just don't enable Nvidia CUDA acceleration and it will be basically the same as if you didn't have the card. Do note that if you run the BI trial version, direct to disk recording will not work and therefore CPU usage will be much higher.
     
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  11. quest100

    quest100 n3wb

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    A lot will probably depend on how you view the video. My system has an Intel Core i7-8700 CPU @ 3.20GHz with 1x12MP and 14x2MP cameras, all running at 20 fps and continuous recording plus motion detection. This results in around 840 MP/s through put. All interaction/viewing is done through the BI window. I normally have 2 cameras displayed full time on a 2160
    display. My CPU usage runs around 30-35%. This has been stable so I have not tried to reduce the cameras to a lower fps.

    If I try to watch all 15 cameras at once the CPU usage shots up to around 80%, which works fine for a while. At some point, the 12 MP camera will drop down to 1-5 fps and motion detection is erratic. None of the other camera have ever been affected. Once that happens I have to restart the camera to get it back to normal. If I were you I would start out with a lower fps camera rate while leaving the cameras displayed as needed. Then adjust the fps up or down, trying to keep the CPU usage below 50%.

    One thing I did not notice until now when I was looking at the BI Tools report page is "Live Preview FPS". My system is running at 10 FPS, but other systems are running at different rates. I never knew about the preview rate and need to see how (if?) to adjust it and what effect it has on CPU usage.
     
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  12. ulterior_motive

    ulterior_motive n3wb

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    knowing what i know now, with the help of forum members, what you mentioned in the quote is my ideal goal, but with 4mp cameras.
    question for you Quest100, how much ram did you end up installing? I'm still sticking to 16gb's.
    yea, i'm just going to buy it, no need to do a trial. Thanks again for your help.
     
  13. Parley

    Parley Getting comfortable

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    I just upped one of my Hikvision cameras to 25fps to see how that would work. Something did not like it as the picture would stop for a second or two then continue for a little bit, then stop again for a second or two. So I changed it to 22fps and things settled down. I was just experimenting. Normally I run between 10-15fps depending on the camera and its location. By the way this was through a Hikvision NVR.
     
  14. quest100

    quest100 n3wb

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    I have 16 Gig and use about half of that. I would go for 16 again.
     
  15. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    If this is on a 4K monitor it would be beneficial to you to install an Nvidia GT 1030 card to plug the monitor into. This will offload a very significant amount of CPU time required to render the video in Blue Iris's local console, and won't be too heavy on power consumption just doing that duty.
     
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  16. quest100

    quest100 n3wb

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    I had not realized a graphic card would help. I am going to look into this. Thanks.
     
  17. nbstl68

    nbstl68 Getting comfortable

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    I though I read somewhere here you could not use hardware acceleration if using a video card or it would not work or something like that. I could not find the reference to the topic. I have a video card but have my monitor connected to the video port on my MB so I could use the acceleration. Is this incorrect \ Am I misunderstanding?
     
  18. SouthernYankee

    SouthernYankee IPCT Contributor

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    the video card off loads the CPU when displaying locally. The video card does NOT do hardware acceleration. Hardware acceleration is used in motion detection and displaying video remotely. It is best to use the intel processor for hardware acceleration.
     
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  19. quest100

    quest100 n3wb

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    How do I use the Nvidia 1030 card for display and the Intel graphics for hardware acceleration?

    I installed the 1030 card and am using it for driving the display but can not get the Intel graphics to be used. I go into BI --> Camera Properties --> Video, tell it to use the intel, click OK, the camera resets, but instead of Intel its back to none.

    Do I need to change something else in BI or is there a Windows control panel that I need to use? In the Task manager both GPUs show up. Intel is showing zero usage. Nvidia is showing around 60% 3D usage. Zero under decoding. This is with 3-4 camera set to use the Nvidia card. Before the graphics card the Intel GPU usage was around 40% for 3D and 50% for decoding.
     
  20. quest100

    quest100 n3wb

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    Ignore my previous message - I restarted (again) and it seems to be working correctly. Now I want to see how many cameras I can put back onto the Intel graphics before it chokes.