Don't Flame Me -- first cam recommendation

[jchall80]

Hello,

I have been a stalker here for roughly a year and admittedly so, I do have a couple of RING devices. Most noteworthy, I have the floodlight cam over my garage door and it can go pound sand. In brief summary, my long term objective is to have camera visibility at all entrances (drive-way/garage, front-door entry and rear patio entries), followed by broader coverage of rear and side yards (I think in that rough order). My back yard is adjacent to common areas with a community park to the North and green-belt to the East. These can provide for quite a bit of pedestrian traffic. My block wall is relatively short with a view-fence on top. To give you some context, my 6 yr old son hops the wall to go to/from the park to play. My house faces West/South-West and from the front of my garage, I have a clear path of the streets going West and South.

I have read enough to understand that there is no one-size fits-all approach to any scenario and I have to put in the effort to figure out what works best for me and most notably, my plan is likely to be ever evolving and changing. I've read the cliff-notes and know of the wiki page and remain overwhelmed with the amount of information available on this site, but comforted in that there is a very supportive audience of users here helping others.

A little more about me first. I am an experienced network engineer by trade with much of my experience in the data center space since ~2009. I've jumped out of it however and now run IT for another organization. Point being, there are a few things we can check off up-front and technically speaking, I'm not intimidated by the cabling that will be required, networking or hardware selection for the Blue Iris system I will build for my purpose. What I know very little about is camera technology.

So that brings me back to the first stage of my plan which I think is ditching my floodlight cam over my garage door (but I welcome feedback if I should be considering something else first). Assuming this plan sticks as step 1, I want to experiment with a camera suitable for the locations I am thinking which I believe to be turret style cameras placed at locations approximate to the exterior lights on either side of the garage door (marked). These exterior lights are mounted at 6'6" and I am estimating a camera height of approximately 8'. The camera on the right-hand side could be positioned to view the drive-way towards yard and entry way and the camera on the left-hand side will view the south-side of the driveway including where I typically park my car in front of an RV gate.

This of course if what I want to test and I'm looking to buy one camera that would seemingly be suitable. I am not really dealing with low-light conditions. My exterior lights are automated and are on from dusk-to-dawn. They emit pretty decent light. Also, I have a street light immediately across the street in my neighbors yard on the corner (marked on the picture). Lastly, if I really want to light things up, I can put my LED motion light back in place of the ring floodlight cam which would be installed at 9' on center over the garage door.

If you're reading this, you're probably tired of me rambling on. So I am considering a 4MP varifocal camera since I am not dealing with super low-light conditions. Would this make sense to test with? Anything specific? I will try to attach night time pictures from my existing camera to provide context regarding the light conditions.

Thanks for listening!

PS -- in the night-time picture, all of the light is being provided by my exterior lights as well as my neighbors exterior garage light (not the floodlight cam). The street lamp across the street is disabled right now because my neighbors run a pretty extravagant Halloween display and we disabled the lamp-post through Halloween or you would notice much more light in the background covering the roadway. This floodlight camera is mounted at 7ft centered over the garage door.
PSS -- I added a street view for more context

 

[sebastiantombs]

The best way to go about determining what camera goes where is to get one varifocal and test each location. 8ft high is getting too high for good identification, try, very hard, to get them at 6-7 feet max. When I say test, make a test rig with a bucket of sand or stones and a 2x4-8 and put the camera up at 8 feet and walk by it, at night, wearing a ball cap or hoodie. Bet you can't identify yourself. Then lower the camera to 7 feet, or 6'6", and test again to see what I mean.

For a camera, an inexpensive, relatively speaking, one is the Dahua 2231T-ZS. It's a 2MP with a 12mm (actually 13mm) varifocal lens and good night vision. A more expensive alternative would be a Dahua 5442T-ZS, or maybe ZE can't remember, 4MP with a 12mm varifocal lens and excellent night vision. Plan on a camera on either side of the garage door just to provide good coverage of the driveway and any vehicles parked there.

 

[samplenhold]

^ What @sebastiantombs said.

A few additional things. I have the Dahua IPC-T2231T-ZS-S2 that he mentioned. It provides a look across my front porch. I am very happy with this cam. It is a 2MP on a 1/2.8" sensor, varifocal 2.7-13.5mm. I have a lot of light on that porch. Three spots at 1000 lumens each and 5000k temp. But a person quickly moving at night can still get a little motion blur.



I always say don't buy all of your cams at once. Make a plan and get one varifocal cam to test and revise your plan using fit-for-purpose cams. But you have already stated that was your plan above, so that is good.

I would say that it is always the right move to get the best low light cam you can afford. Right now in the Dahua prosumer line this is the 5442 series. I have two of the fixed lens turrets. These are 4MP cams on a 1/1.8" sensor and have great low light color performance. You may believe that you have a lot of light, but the only way to really know is to test it. Get one of the HDW5442T-ZE varifocals and use the test rig. That is a 2.7-12mm lens. You can always use that cam somewhere. It is a great cam.

Placing the cams near the coach lights on your driveway can be problematic. You can get glare from the lights. Again, using a test rig will help you decide on exact placement. In general, as long as the cams are not pointed across the light, the glare is minimal. I have two cams in a crossing pattern covering my driveway. They are close to the coach lights that have two 1000 lumen 5000k bulbs in each.



Height is important. You want to get as low an angle to the face as possible. Otherwise you get the top of the head and not the face. If you have to mount high, then you have to place the focal area out a ways. See diagram.

 

[mat200]

Hello,
..

This of course if what I want to test and I'm looking to buy one camera that would seemingly be suitable. I am not really dealing with low-light conditions. My exterior lights are automated and are on from dusk-to-dawn. They emit pretty decent light. Also, I have a street light immediately across the street in my neighbors yard on the corner (marked on the picture). Lastly, if I really want to light things up, I can put my LED motion light back in place of the ring floodlight cam which would be installed at 9' on center over the garage door.
.. So I am considering a 4MP varifocal camera since I am not dealing with super low-light conditions

Welcome @jchall80

Indeed a 4MP varifocal w/a 1/1.8" would make a very good first camera to learn with.

 

[aristobrat]

I am not really dealing with low-light conditions.

I have a lot of light on that porch. Three spots at 1000 lumens each and 5000k temp. But a person quickly moving at night can still get a little motion blur.

@jchall80, looks like you're on the right path, but I did want to reemphasis what @samplenhold mentioned... often times to get video of motion where the details of the object moving are blurred the least, the cameras shutter speed has to be increased, which has the side effect of making the image darker. Even though you have some good lighting at night, I think most folks here would still recommend that you get low-light cameras for the areas where you hope to identify anyone that you don't recognize. As great as the current generation of low-light cameras that folks here use are (esp ones with the 4MP 1/1.8" image sensor), it can still be a challenge in many low-light situations to not get not-overly blurry images of motion, especially as the speed of the motion increases.

 

[Old Timer]

Hello,


This of course if what I want to test and I'm looking to buy one camera that would seemingly be suitable. I am not really dealing with low-light conditions. My exterior lights are automated and are on from dusk-to-dawn. They emit pretty decent light. Also, I have a street light immediately across the street in my neighbors yard on the corner (marked on the picture). Lastly, if I really want to light things up, I can put my LED motion light back in place of the ring floodlight cam which would be installed at 9' on center over the garage door.

If you're reading this, you're probably tired of me rambling on. So I am considering a 4MP varifocal camera since I am not dealing with super low-light conditions. Would this make sense to test with? Anything specific? I will try to attach night time pictures from my existing camera to provide context regarding the light conditions.

I would get one variable (zoom) lens camera to test with, if you want, try one with the smaller image sensor, but I would get one with the 1/1.8 " sensor to see the difference. Volinteer your wife to walk around both day and night to see how well the cameras work. Trade with here and she will see the difference in cameras (mine increased my budget after seeing what the difference was).
I have several of the 2Mp cameras, and they work wonders, then the 4Mp comes along and it blows the 2Mp away. Even the Amcrest (re-badged Dahua), 4Mp is good at night. You can buy them from this site. It will have a fixed lens so you will use your variable lens to figure what lens you want.

4MP Starlight Turret IP Camera - IP Cam Talk Store

Dahua re-branded StarLight 4MP IP Camera, turret style.

store.ipcamtalk.com

Once you figure out what places work the best, and what lens you need for each, then make the big purchase from Andy (Empire Tech).
With an IT background you would do great with a Blue Iris machine to collect the video. I would separate the LAN used for cameras from having network access. I use a PFsense router and using VLAN for my cameras and other devices I want to block. If you need a cheap switch for split your tagged VLAN back out, check out the TP link TL-SG108E There is one security drawback I have found on this switch, but it does not come up in a home network ( you can log in from any IP), I would not use it for commercial use. Change the password.

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00K4DS5KU/

As far as your Ring flood camera, you can leave it where it's at if you want until you find a better place for it. I have a couple OLD cameras that are used just for an overview to keep me centered where the motion is and what camera to look at. I have mounted them up higher for a larger area. 2 of them are at 40'.

As far as getting a good face shot for identification, you can't move your cameras down, I have installed a second camera down about 4-5' on a couple pinch locations to get a different view. Between my 8' and a 5', you get a good shot almost all of the time.

 

[looney2ns]

Review-OEM Loryta IPC-T5442T-ZE Varifocal 4mp camera (Dahua) | IP Cam Talk
Buy once, cry once.

 

[jchall80]

Thank you everyone for the responses. I appreciate it, really. I think I'll proceed with one of the recommendations and start playing!

 

[jchall80]

With an IT background you would do great with a Blue Iris machine to collect the video. I would separate the LAN used for cameras from having network access. I use a PFsense router and using VLAN for my cameras and other devices I want to block. If you need a cheap switch for split your tagged VLAN back out, check out the TP link TL-SG108E There is one security drawback I have found on this switch, but it does not come up in a home network ( you can log in from any IP), I would not use it for commercial use. Change the password.

Thanks @Old Timer. I am good in this space. I have a number of commercial grade Cisco and Brocade PoE switches deployed around already and a good Ubiquiti wireless network throughout. Funny you should mention pfSense. I have been using it for years at home and in past production environments. It serves as my gateway firewall as a virtualized instance running on a linux KVM with openvswitch. I have a number of VLANs in place for various purposes as well.

All good suggestions. Thanks.

 

[Old Timer]

Thanks @Old Timer. I am good in this space. I have a number of commercial grade Cisco and Brocade PoE switches deployed around already and a good Ubiquiti wireless network throughout. Funny you should mention pfSense. I have been using it for years at home and in past production environments. It serves as my gateway firewall as a virtualized instance running on a linux KVM with openvswitch. I have a number of VLANs in place for various purposes as well.

All good suggestions. Thanks.

I figured you might have heard about it. We have it running at 10-12 locations, and are pushing it for all out customers. Love it!
The protectilli mini fan less celeron with 4G and 32G works great even with failover sites. HP mini server works well for a larger
package, for those who thinks size means everything.
We ran it virtual at first, but if you have a power outage, the fan less uses a lot less backup power to keep a little data flowing.
Open VPN is just the cherry on top.

 

[Rob2020]

I am new here but I followed the often repeated advice and bought one of the Dahua 2 MP Starlight Varifocals. I have it temporarily mounted on a small plywood board with a two foot 2 x 4 attached. I can easily clamp it to an eight foot 2 x 4 or other things as needed.

I have been enjoying trying different focal lengths in different areas around the house and yard working towards a final plan. I am 100% happy with the cam I bought.