Enclosure and solid IR filter questions

[frankred]

I went to install this Dahua IPC-HF5421E (specs) as an LPR and I ran into two issues.
1. It doesn't fit the enclosure by 1/4" :sad:. (See pic)
2. The enclosures have an IR lens (see dark circle in pic). I had a hard time adjusting the image settings to get a usable image.


So, I need to get a new enclosure that I can either mount directly to the pole or maybe I can cut off the old perch. I see them available all over, does anyone have a favorite? Based on the specs of the camera, I would guess I don't need to get a fan (60c is 140f, Dallas)
Also, do I need to go back with a IR lens or just a clear lens? The old camera was black and white only.

TIA for any help!
John

 

[nayr]

I made a birdhouse for mine, I used an IR filter to cover up my IR spotlight but you dont need to cover the video lens with it.. especially if you want color imagery.

I dont think you want to be as discrete as me, Look at AmazonReviews: http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=cctv+enclosure

 

[frankred]

Thanks for the quick reply @nyar !

You are right, this one doesn't need to be discrete. I will just go with Amazon options then. Not sure if I want to add 12v back to power a fan, but I guess I can get an enclosure that includes it just in case.

My final question is IR. This camera doesn't have IR. Since it is intended to capture license plates, rear plates should have tag lights at night. Front plates will have headlights beside them. I am thinking I am okay without adding IR but I do want to make sure I get the best image that I can. What are your experiences with your IR spotlight on and off?

 

[nayr]

you need IR, at adequate shutter speeds to capture plates.. it needs light.

I am reading plates ~160-180ft away, without the IR I dont see jack shit..

the IR Spotlight I have could easially be bolted to the outside of one of these enclosures on Amazon, has 3 mounting holes on either side you can see in the photo.. just drill through the closure and bolt it down, then bring the power line inside.. I had to add a bunch of ventelation holes to run the IR inside, outside it'd work alot better and you could seal the enclosure up so no bugs can get inside.. im going to have to cut some screen mesh to shove into my vent holes before it turns into a wasps nest.

 

[pal251]

Lucky your a 2 plate state Nayr, I hate it in KS with only one plate...

 

[pozzello]

Cali is also supposedly a 2-plate state, but a lot of folks don't have front plates (or have it up on the their dash),
so I've got LPR cams looking in both directions. That also helps if/when one cam misses the motion capture
for whatever reason (usually due to me twiddling with BI's settings...)

but yeah, you definitely need IR (and lots of it) to grab plates at night.

Also need to crank the exposure down to to 1/500+ (I run 1/1000) to minimize motion blur,
depending on how fast cars are zipping by and your viewing angle (I'm about 40 degrees
off in both directions)

 

[nayr]

Lucky your a 2 plate state Nayr, I hate it in KS with only one plate...

Good for LPR, bad for cars.. heh when I moved from KS to Colorado I refused to drill holes in the front bumper of my race car.. so I cant park it anywhere in town or it'll get a big fat ticket, luckily they wont pull you over for it.

Here they enforce it pretty well, I took the front plate off my Audi RS6 and put a europlate on it for a carshow.. I forgot to switch it back and drove it to work the next day; it lasted about an hour on the street before I got nailed with a ~$200 ticket for not having a front plate... the legal front plate was in my window still, didnt matter at all.

however because of emissions and the dual plate thing we have a larger quantity than is typical of out of state plates.. people whom move here want to keep there vehicles registered out of the area to avoid all the trouble of getting colorado plates.. (wish I had Kansas plates on when visiting my family in KS, cops give me far too much scrutiny)

 

[frankred]

I think I am going with this enclosure: http://www.amazon.com/Evertech-Security-Surveillance-Heater-Blower-Weatherproof/dp/B00LU2NLIA/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1463411789&sr=8-3&keywords=camera+enclosure
The product page I found says it is 4.5" wide. The Dahua I want to put in it is 3" wide. I can't find internal dimensions though.

And this IR Illuminator: http://www.amazon.com/Univivi-U06R-WideAngle-Lights-Illuminator/dp/B00M3O5ERK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1463408862&sr=8-1&keywords=ir+illuminator
Looks like it should provide good light and has a daylight sensor. I will mount it vertically so I can aim it left/right.

 

[nayr]

let us know how it goes, how far away is your target area?

 

[pozzello]

that illuminator has too wide an angle of dispersal for your application, i think.
Cheap enuf to just give it a try, i suppose, but I think you'll get better LPR results
with a more focused IR beam, like this one (on sale again):
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Surveillance-cameras-night-vision-fill-light-850nm-Zoom-IR-LED-Array-3800mW-Light-15-90m-Angle/1875583826.html
(beam is adjustable also, can do ~6 degrees if needed, and it's quite bright and uniformly lit in the focused area.
they also have fixed ones a tad cheaper if you know just the beam width you need)

keep in mind that for LPR at night, you pretty much need to outshine the headlights with IR,
and an IR cannon like these does that pretty well...

 

[frankred]

I agree with all of your comments. I settled on the one I linked because I have a bunch of solutions to come up with asap. I cancelled it just now. I can see the one you linked will be much better. Nyar's would be better as well, but I was only seeing the type I linked before...

Do you have experience with it? I see it is rated for 2A at 12v. I have a 3A power supply I would like to use for the IR and housing (I will have to look at the enclosure specs when I get back to my laptop).

that illuminator has too wide an angle of dispersal for your application, i think.
Cheap enuf to just give it a try, i suppose, but I think you'll get better LPR results
with a more focused IR beam, like this one (on sale again):
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Surveillance-cameras-night-vision-fill-light-850nm-Zoom-IR-LED-Array-3800mW-Light-15-90m-Angle/1875583826.html
(beam is adjustable also, can do ~6 degrees if needed, and it's quite bright and uniformly lit in the focused area.
they also have fixed ones a tad cheaper if you know just the beam width you need)

keep in mind that for LPR at night, you pretty much need to outshine the headlights with IR,
and an IR cannon like these does that pretty well...

 

[pozzello]

that PS should workfor both cam + IR. Nayr and I both use the same IR bullet I linked to for LPR, so yes, we have experience with it.
He's using it to light up plates at over 150ft, my setup is a bit closer ~60ft. Never too much light...

 

[pal251]

Good for LPR, bad for cars.. heh when I moved from KS to Colorado I refused to drill holes in the front bumper of my race car.. so I cant park it anywhere in town or it'll get a big fat ticket, luckily they wont pull you over for it.

Here they enforce it pretty well, I took the front plate off my Audi RS6 and put a europlate on it for a carshow.. I forgot to switch it back and drove it to work the next day; it lasted about an hour on the street before I got nailed with a ~$200 ticket for not having a front plate... the legal front plate was in my window still, didnt matter at all.

however because of emissions and the dual plate thing we have a larger quantity than is typical of out of state plates.. people whom move here want to keep there vehicles registered out of the area to avoid all the trouble of getting colorado plates.. (wish I had Kansas plates on when visiting my family in KS, cops give me far too much scrutiny)

Well you guys do have a different possession law for certain green plants lol.

 

[nayr]

The Green Badge of Courage, lol: http://www.timescall.com/opinion/editorial/ci_25900442/colorado-license-plate-profiling-is-over-line

 

[frankred]

What is the mounting point on that IR cannon? I can see a raised area on it that makes me think it will have a couple of bolt holes like the Dahua has. Right? If so, I am hoping to find a spot in the enclosure where I can drill a hole or two.

 

[pozzello]

yes, there are 3 shallow (~1/4 deep) mounting holes for the regular 'camera-mount-style' 1/4-20 bolt
(or maybe its 6mm?) that should hold it in place, maybe with a little lock-tight for good measure...

alternatively, one could use a hose clamp of the appropriate size to strap it to the enclosure:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Everbilt-4-in-Stainless-Steel-Clamp-6756595/202309381bt

see first shot here for what the narrow-angle spot can do at 50-60 ft...
https://www.ipcamtalk.com/showthread.php/9449-What-IR-illuminator-would-be-best?p=86401&viewfull=1#post86401

 

[nayr]

What is the mounting point on that IR cannon? I can see a raised area on it that makes me think it will have a couple of bolt holes like the Dahua has. Right? If so, I am hoping to find a spot in the enclosure where I can drill a hole or two.

blowing up the photo I already attached:

 

[frankred]

The Ir lens you are using was making me think that you were using a different product that had only one emitter. Thanks for your extra effort to make that clear to me!!
To answer your earlier question, I'd say the target distance is about 60'. Good info on the IR illuminator thread too. I need to spend some time in the Accessories sub forum...

 

[nayr]

60' you should be able to run @ 1/1000 like @pozzello if needed with this IR.. at double that I have to run 1/500 max.. but I am catching vehicles going around a corner and the relative motion is little.. if I had 60mph traffic and a steeper angle id need 1/1000 at night.

since its got adjustable focus, if you find its too bright you can just widen the angle to diffuse it.. I cant think of a better light on the market for LPR, if you watch them they go on sale from time to time.. we both got our 4500mW ones for $55-60 on sale

it does come with a pair of mounting screws with nice big heads on them (the one you see attached to my camera) so it should be easy to mount to the outside of that housing you choose.

attached is my wiring harness w/PoE Splitter and Powered Mic, since mine is sealed up I am using the alarm output on the camera to turn the IR on/off.. but the spotlight has its own sensor that will work if you dont enclose the sensor.

 

[frankred]

I ordered the IR light you all recommended. Thanks again!!

The list of helpful suggestions goes on! Great pic! I would have never considered a POE splitter to use 12v. I did just buy some 12v barrel splitters today though. I just ran a shielded burial cat6 cable up to the pole where this camera is mounted. I connected it to a TP Link TL-SF1008P to power the Dahua (6.5w) and a Panasonic NW502S (7.6W) I used the old coax cable as a pull string. I am left with a 10/2 (I think) line that was powering the old cam. I cut at the bottom of the pole :/ . I was planning to reconnect that and use the 12v 3A psu for IR and the enclosure fan/heater. After seeing your use of a poe splitter, I am wondering if it makes any difference in terms of points of failure. I am thinking that the safest and cheapest way to power the IR and enclosure is to split the 12v wire.

As far as your angle comments, this cam is by an intersection, so traffic may be going 20mph. The pole has the camera at 8ft and it is by the stop sign so it is closer to a front plate than a rear plate.

60' you should be able to run @ 1/1000 like @pozzello if needed with this IR.. at double that I have to run 1/500 max.. but I am catching vehicles going around a corner and the relative motion is little.. if I had 60mph traffic and a steeper angle id need 1/1000 at night.

since its got adjustable focus, if you find its too bright you can just widen the angle to diffuse it.. I cant think of a better light on the market for LPR, if you watch them they go on sale from time to time.. we both got our 4500mW ones for $55-60 on sale

it does come with a pair of mounting screws with nice big heads on them (the one you see attached to my camera) so it should be easy to mount to the outside of that housing you choose.

attached is my wiring harness w/PoE Splitter and Powered Mic, since mine is sealed up I am using the alarm output on the camera to turn the IR on/off.. but the spotlight has its own sensor that will work if you dont enclose the sensor.