Need help with 32ish dahua camera install in a Church

Discussion in 'Camera Installation Questions' started by Kinchyle, Feb 12, 2018.

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  1. Kinchyle

    Kinchyle n3wb

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    I'm working with someone else on this forum to do a ground up install to help monitor a large Church. Objective being having historical footage if an incident but also for triggering during and after Church with someone on duty to "eagle eye" suspicion.

    Last thread I saw went into ip systems vs. coax and another in Hikvision vs. Dahua
    surveillance for my church

    Just to help the conversation we are looking for ip based and dahua(ordering from Andy).

    I used the storage calculator on Western Digital (purple drive) and based on 16 cameras (max) with 1080, and 10 days of history it was around 23TB. I'd assume at 24-32 we might need 40ish TB ? Anyone with this large camera deployment to know storage for a 7-10 days with 24/7 recording?
    Also anyone know a dahua NVR chassis that supports this camera size and storage (and has some parity, mirror, raid 5, etc).
    I'm familiar with a 5216 chassis and 2mp starlights at home but open to other design.
    This will be for around 32 cameras. Any recommendations for a monitor size to have "eyes on glass" to watch over the cameras?

    Some of the hallways are long maybe like 30-40 years. I'd think we'd need something with less field of vision like 45 degree for hallways?

    If we put a camera in the main auditorium that holds 700 people and pretty wide. Any recommendations for a ptz type camera that is not buzzing like a robot and looking like robocop starring someone down?
    It would need a zoom that could go out 30-40 yards to maybe a body size view.

    Most of the cameras are going to be all time light available. Starlight cameras still seem good in dark or light but if a dahua camera that excels in light over a starlight it would be helpful.

    We do have a couple locations that could be dark and light. It still seems the 2mp is dominating is there a 4mp+ starlight that is better?

    Thanks for the insight.
     
  2. tangent

    tangent Known around here

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    I don't think a system of that size is the easiest to DIY, though there could be talent in the congregation you aren't aware of. If you end up going that path, take it very slow and learn from your mistakes. Sometimes you're better off with 2 computers or nvrs than 1 when dealing with lots of cameras. VMS on a computer can be a lot more powerful and pleasant to use than an NVR. You should definitely play with demos and free starter editions of some VMS software to get a sense of the differences.

    I'd suggest you get detailed bids from several companies. Pay close attention to the differences even if you don't use them you'll still learn something.

    There's a large church around me that I think took the 'diy' approach with in house talent and the end result is a little tacky as they just kept adding more and more cameras to compensate for the mistakes they made at first (at least that's the impression I get). They did a lot of smart things in the end, and have some very good in-house talent helping now but didn't realize it at first.

    I suggest playing with IPVM Camera Calculator V3 as well as https://www.vivotek.com/ip-video-system-design-tool/#overview which is a limited free version of jvsg that only contains vivotek camera models, but it's still very useful.

    Hallways that are so long they would take 30-40 years to traverse sound like something out of a physics text :p. You're probably looking at something in the 6-12mm range for hallways. Varifocal cameras can help you figure out what size lens fixed camera is appropriate.

    Don't forget about other security measures like access control / alarm systems and actual motion and door sensors. You can also use things like electromagnetic doorstops that you can release remotely or on a schedule to close off part of the building.
     
  3. Mr_D

    Mr_D Pulling my weight

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    That storage requirement sounds high. Was the calculator on WD's site? You know, a company that wants to sell you as many hard drives as possible. Using H.265 instead of H.264 as well as VBR instead of CBR can save lots of space.
     
  4. Kinchyle

    Kinchyle n3wb

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    thanks tagent and Mr D.
    Ya 30-40 years I meant yards :)
    I feel pretty comfortable around Dahua NVR to set it up and get it where someone can use for the basic (hope I'm not underestimating).
    Thanks for the design software, pretty cool. The church has other access controls so wanted to fill in with a video. The way the building is utilized there isn't really a "cut off" at certain times though I think IVS/tripwire will come in handy for "shouldn't happen".

    What are the pro/cons for 265 vs. 264. I thought I read with Dahua the 265 was still unstable or something and 264 was sort of "classic".

    Anyone have any NVR models or camera models they suggest for Dahua?

    I'm thinking
    NVR5832
    Aliexpress.com : Buy NVR5208 8P 1080P NVR 16ch 1080P NVR NVR5216 8P 32ch 1080P NVR NVR5232 8P with Onvif NVR with 8POE ports from Reliable nvr 16ch suppliers on Empire Technology Co., Ltd

    It supports 32 cameras. 8 drive bays for 32tb max.

    IPC-HDW5231R-ZE 2mp Starlight
    Aliexpress.com : Buy IPC HDW5231R ZE 2MP WDR IR Eyeball Network Camera IPC HDW5231R ZE ,free DHL shipping from Reliable network camera suppliers on Empire Technology Co., Ltd

    for places that need complete dark and night.


    SD52C230T-HN 2mp 30x zoom
    Aliexpress.com : Buy SD52C230T HN Camera 2Mp FULL HD 30x Ultra high Speed Network PTZ Camera Support PoE+ IK10 SD52C230T HN free shipping from Reliable ptz camera suppliers on Empire Technology Co., Ltd

    this looks like it has pan/tilt/zoom. Is this is a good choice for in a large auditorium for moving the camera around with remote viewing if any concerning behaviors. This area is light up at all times

    Or does someone have recommendation in this category for PTZ
    --PTZ Speed Dome camera - Shop Cheap --PTZ Speed Dome camera from China --PTZ Speed Dome camera Suppliers at Empire Technology Co., Ltd on Aliexpress.com


    IPC-HDW5830R-Z 8mp eyeball
    Aliexpress.com : Buy IPC HDW5830R Z 8MP IR Eyeball Network Camera ,free DHL shipping from Reliable network camera suppliers on Empire Technology Co., Ltd

    Would this be good for long hallways. It says it can do 300ft observe

    What is the difference between eyeball and dome?
    This seems to be the dome version but not sure advantage or disadvantage
    Aliexpress.com : Buy Security IP Camera CCTV 8MP IR Dome Network Camera with POE IP67 IK10 IPC HDBW5830R Z free DHL shipping from Reliable ip camera suppliers on Empire Technology Co., Ltd
     
  5. pcunite

    pcunite Young grasshopper

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    I'm in a similar position as the OP. Needing to install a 24'ish camera system for two buildings (fiber connected). I suggest full PTZ cameras so that installation is a snap because you can always adjust things later. For inside, I will be testing with the SD1A203T-GN. The SD59225U-HNI will be a consideration for the outside. Lots of PTZ models to choose from, some with IR and some without, etc.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2018
  6. tangent

    tangent Known around here

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    The NVR608-32-4KS2 | Dahua Technology might make more sense than the NVR5832. Some of the extra features like people counting could come in handy.
    **your link is to the 5232 which can only accommodate 2 hdd.

    4HDD might be enough, I'm not sure you'd need more than 4x8tb. So the NVR5432 is an option as are 2x NVR5216. 2 smaller NVRs actually yields more incoming bandwidth.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2018
  7. tangent

    tangent Known around here

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    You may want to look into integration with the access control system.
     
  8. Kinchyle

    Kinchyle n3wb

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    NVR608-32-4KS looks like the right choice. More than likely it will be a 20ish camera install but I'd like to get 32 to scale. If bandwidth issues we could always go to another NVR after the 608. People counting is nice and a feature I was looking to try out. Today it's manual and requires someone to walk around.....

    pcunite those PTZ where along the lines for what I was looking for in the auditorium. It looks like they are 2mp. Why not do a 4mp or higher so you can get a birds eye at distance then hone in. Is it price or does 4 or 6mp not really matter with video at a distance?

    pcunite do your buildings have hallways have you sorted out camer type? The bullets look like they have smaller point of view but the ceilings are about 7 feet in the hallways. Having one of those monsters coming out of the wall at 6 feet would be odd looking to visitors... Hoping to get something less aggressive looking like a dome. I have the eyes at home and people don't even seem to notice them walking to the door.