New home owner - do I have options?

[MicahJames]

Hi everyone. This is my first home and I have been mentally figuring out how to have a clean install here. Unfortunately, my attic is very small and tight. How would you guys do this?
Originally I wanted to run the cable from the eaves into the attic and down into a server room but I’m 6’4” and pretty sure I’ll loathe an attempt.
What would you all do? I’m also considering hiring installers if it requires more professional touch.

 

[mat200]

Hi everyone. This is my first home and I have been mentally figuring out how to have a clean install here. Unfortunately, my attic is very small and tight. How would you guys do this?
Originally I wanted to run the cable from the eaves into the attic and down into a server room but I’m 6’4” and pretty sure I’ll loathe an attempt.
What would you all do? I’m also considering hiring installers if it requires more professional touch.

Hi @MicahJames

Looks like you can DIY before it gets too hot in the attic.

I've used 3/4" PVC schedule 40 conduit to help reach the lower sections of the attic which I could not crawl to. Worked well by pushing the conduit to the corners I needed to hit.

Remember to test potential placements before crawling too much in the attic.

 

[area651]

Its up to you. If my fatass can crawl through there like a squirrel then I'd guess yours could too. The difference is if you want to spend the money on having someone pull cables for you. Its odd to see your eaves open like that. Its just common to have them closed where I am and its a real PIA to deal with. Imho, you're lucky. I'd consider running your wires and then closing them in but that's just an idea.

 

[Riclyo]

You're 6' 4" I'd be more worried about cracking the sheetrock seeing those are 2x4 trusses with no hat channel.

 

[DRZmaui]

Here is some advice, (I’m up to 32 cameras now. Spent loads of time up in the attic crawl space)
Expect that you will want to add more cameras later. Consider running additional cat cable for later use.
This is the BIGGY! Remember to use only SOLID COPPER CABLE! Made the mistake of running CCW cable the first time. Had to do it all over again.
Do it when the weather is cool. Sucks being in the attaic when its warm. Gets really hot and stuffy up there.
Wear a mask. The fiberglass insulation will play hell on your lungs.
Learn to spice your own RJ45 connections. And don’t forget to use the pass thru connectors. [Practice make perfect]. The Kline tool is the industry standard. Plenty of you tube videos to show you how.
Easier to run you cable together. Tape them together then run it thru your attic.
When running the cable, give yourself plenty of extra cable. Suck to run the cable, then come up short to the switch.
Probably the most import, get yourself the longest glow stick or Gide stick available. Make guiding the wire soo much easier.

Just a few ideas, maybe other

 

[DRZmaui]

one last thing, mount you camera as low as possible. Make a HUGE DIFFERENCE.

 

[Holbs]

I can not fit in my attic. Less than 24" space up there. Here is how I ran network cabling: drilled 1/4" hole where my camera (or PIR, or coaxial, etc) would be in the ceiling into the attic area. Stick all your metal/fiberglass fishing tape/snake up into the hole (well..a good 20-30 feet worth). I have a small attic entrance hole for maintenance. I opened the hole up. With a 10' stick of 1/2" PVC conduit with hook at end (clothes hanger hook wrapped many times with duct or electrical tape works too).... reach the conduit hook over to the fishing tape and pull towards you. Whalla. This also applies to how I ran network cable to the 2nd floor outside roof eaves where I have 3 camera's up high as overwatch.
Granted, as a network cable installer...I like to use pull string and my 24' collapsible gopher fishing pole. But not everyone has these cool toys

 

[MicahJames]

Wow, I have to say thank you all so much for the responses! I didn't expect so much input. I really really appreciate each of you taking the time to share your experiences and recommendations.

So you all know, I've never owned a home so I had to actually look up a lot of home owner verbiage to understand what a lot of these things are. I'm not afraid of getting my hands dirty, we just always lived in apartments or buildings without much access so I'm excited to learn.

I think I've dumbed down all the input you provided and I believe what I need to do is drill a hole big enough for my cable run in the eave above where my camera goes. Then, stuff about 20-30' of that cable into the hole and hope that it sticks up and overflows into some corner of the attic. Then, using a 10' or similar pipe with a hook or something fashioned at the end, pull the wires toward me and from there I can run it into my server closet. I THINK that's what I've gathered here.

A couple follow up questions if you all don't mind:

A) this is the cable I purchased, do you think this will do for a <100' POE connection?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06ZZ4QZWT/

B) DRZmaui. - what do you mean keep the camera as low as possible? Ive always had cameras installed about 10' high or wherever the ceiling is and point them kind of down. Can you elaborate on your recommendation? PS I do splice my own cable so I'm good to go there!

C) Riclyo - I have no idea what a hat channel is. The only thing I know that scares the crap out of me is my dad told me DO NOT step on anything except the beams in the floor or I will fall through the house. hence why I'm a bit paranoid of messing around up there

D) Area651 you made my wife and I laugh out loud. she's pretty petite so if I need to get further in the attic I can always send her up lol

E) Mat200 what do you mean by testing potential placements?

Again, I appreciate everyones help tremendously!!!!

 

[mat200]

Wow, I have to say thank you all so much for the responses! I didn't expect so much input. I really really appreciate each of you taking the time to share your experiences and recommendations.

So you all know, I've never owned a home so I had to actually look up a lot of home owner verbiage to understand what a lot of these things are. I'm not afraid of getting my hands dirty, we just always lived in apartments or buildings without much access so I'm excited to learn.

I think I've dumbed down all the input you provided and I believe what I need to do is drill a hole big enough for my cable run in the eave above where my camera goes. Then, stuff about 20-30' of that cable into the hole and hope that it sticks up and overflows into some corner of the attic. Then, using a 10' or similar pipe with a hook or something fashioned at the end, pull the wires toward me and from there I can run it into my server closet. I THINK that's what I've gathered here.

A couple follow up questions if you all don't mind:

A) this is the cable I purchased, do you think this will do for a <100' POE connection?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06ZZ4QZWT/

B) DRZmaui. - what do you mean keep the camera as low as possible? Ive always had cameras installed about 10' high or wherever the ceiling is and point them kind of down. Can you elaborate on your recommendation? PS I do splice my own cable so I'm good to go there!

C) Riclyo - I have no idea what a hat channel is. The only thing I know that scares the crap out of me is my dad told me DO NOT step on anything except the beams in the floor or I will fall through the house. hence why I'm a bit paranoid of messing around up there

D) Area651 you made my wife and I laugh out loud. she's pretty petite so if I need to get further in the attic I can always send her up lol

E) Mat200 what do you mean by testing potential placements?

Again, I appreciate everyones help tremendously!!!!

Hi @MicahJames

Cable looks good.

Search for test rig here at ipcamtalk - sometimes you really want to test the view before finalizing locations as a couple feet can make a difference.

 

[windguy]

@MicahJames - Congrats on your new home!
You can do this project. It will be a good experience. You've already gotten some solid advice but I'll throw in some thoughts.

I'm 6'-2" and sometimes height can be an advantage doing attic work when you need to straddle sections of roof truss and find a good footing.
Don't send your wife up there. The payback isn't worth it. Let her be your below deck assistant to feed cable to you or get the half dozen things you forgot to bring with you.
Just plan out your layout as much as you can in advance to minimize your attic time. Good time of year to do this type of work.

Since you have blown in insulation, as mentioned, protect yourself. Eyes too. I keep a separate pair of gloves, hat, shoes in the garage, bagged up, and marked for attic work only.
Once you're done, all clothes go right into the washer. Take a shower. I use a large drop cloth or old bed sheet under the attic access hatch. While you're up there, check for termites, rats, bee nests.

Nice that you already have a light up there but you may need to drag a work light and or use a headlamp. If you don't have either one, buy them. You'll use it many times over.
I would also invest in a pair of knee pads. I have an indoor pair and an outdoor pair. I have no knee problems. Great for gardening as well.

Your last image #95B5 - is this over a garage? The insulation isn't blown into this area, just overspray. The ceiling joists seem to only be 2x4's and 24" centers. I'd be extra careful working in this area. Lastly, I like to bring a few sections of 5/8" or better plywood boards with me as I traverse the attic to straddle ceiling joists and to also kneel on. With two or three boards you can easily work up there. If you're bring up tools or supplies, a bucket or tool tray helps a lot too. Good luck!

I rotated your two portrait images for easier viewing.

 

[Holbs]

Another word of advice about running network cabling or any cabling through attic spaces. Before you pull the cable take a look and ensure the pathway is viable. Remember you may have other vendors or yourself up there doing other things and you do not want to cable to be in the way. In a pinch you can use a drywall screw into a stud and have the cable sit on top of the screw. That way it is held off the ground or off the insulation and out of the way. Many times I have seen people run cable that is stepped on and crushed because they did not organize it very well.

 

[zero-degrees]

@MicahJames

You've gotten some good advice above - let me add a few more thoughts.

1. As noted cable is good - you over paid though - sorry In the future always keep monoprice in mind for your cable needs. BULK NETWORKING CABLES - HDMI Cable, Home Theater Accessories, HDMI Products, Cables, Adapters, Video/Audio Switch, Networking, USB, Firewire, Printer Toner, and more!

2. Your attic isn't to bad and I am impressed that your house has a sprinkler system - least I think it does based on one of your pics and the appearance of orange pipe (looks like Blazemaster) in your attic. One thing that can help termendously due to your size is trying to simply work from the middle area around the main support walls that the trusses cross. This won't be terribly hard with the proper tools and prep.

1. Drill from the outside in/up at an angle. Start SMALL - Drill something like a 5/16 hole into the soffit up and at an angle towards the center of your home. You start small so you can easily patch or calk the hole if it isn't the correct place. If it is the correct place, go back and drill the proper size hole for what ever mounting solution you are using.
2. Now that you have that hole, easily find it in the attic. Get yourself a set of Push Rods and push those in and up from the outside. Here is an inexpensive set that will help. These look decent and come with a good amount of sections and accessories. Me personally, I have a few nice sets that glow in the dark that make life easier, but for something you only need a few times and since your attic appears well lite - these don't look to bad. This will also help you work from more of the center of the attic vs. having to crawl out to grab cable.
   1. SWANLAKE 33' Fiberglass Running Wire Cable Coaxial Electrical Fish Tape Pull Push Kit - - Amazon.com
3. Your soffits are deeper and angled than what we have in the midwest. Typically in the midwest you would have a sheet of finish board on the bottom of those 2/4's making the base of your soffit flat. Makes it easy to install the camera directly to that, of if you need to drop it down a bit below the trim line or gutters you simply use a camera junction box to do so. In your case, I would recomend most likely mounting the camera to your stuco/walls about 1.5' - 2' down from that soffit, mount a camera junction box to the house, run a piece of small conduit up from the junction box to under the soffit that the cable can go inside and follow up. (this can be determined as others noted using an easy test rig (bucket filled with sand and something like a 10' 2x4 in it.) If you have extra stucko paint this method will blend easy, just paint the conduit the stucco color once it's all mounted and it will disappear.
4. Keep in mind that end soffit is going to be inaccessible from your attic easily - most likely. Traditionally your end overhang is a box/closed soffit and is not "easily" accessible. To often people try to put a camera right on the corner but it's a closed void and requires multiple cuts to access - and is difficult if you don't know what you are doing. So unless you know for a fact it opens to the attic I would stay away from it - attached pic as reference.

You got this - the fact you are here, already bought some cable, and knew enough to get your big ass up into the attic - don't hire this out

 

[bigredfish]

Three simple words:

12yo neighbor kid

 

[DRZmaui]

B) DRZmaui. - what do you mean keep the camera as low as possible? Ive always had cameras installed about 10' high or wherever the ceiling is and point them kind of down. Can you elaborate on your recommendation? PS I do splice my own cable so I'm good to go there!

I'll try and send you some examples. Lower allows for better facial recognition. 6 inchs can make a huge difference.

 

[MicahJames]

@MicahJames

You've gotten some good advice above - let me add a few more thoughts.

1. As noted cable is good - you over paid though - sorry In the future always keep monoprice in mind for your cable needs. BULK NETWORKING CABLES - HDMI Cable, Home Theater Accessories, HDMI Products, Cables, Adapters, Video/Audio Switch, Networking, USB, Firewire, Printer Toner, and more!

2. Your attic isn't to bad and I am impressed that your house has a sprinkler system - least I think it does based on one of your pics and the appearance of orange pipe (looks like Blazemaster) in your attic. One thing that can help termendously due to your size is trying to simply work from the middle area around the main support walls that the trusses cross. This won't be terribly hard with the proper tools and prep.

1. Drill from the outside in/up at an angle. Start SMALL - Drill something like a 5/16 hole into the soffit up and at an angle towards the center of your home. You start small so you can easily patch or calk the hole if it isn't the correct place. If it is the correct place, go back and drill the proper size hole for what ever mounting solution you are using.
2. Now that you have that hole, easily find it in the attic. Get yourself a set of Push Rods and push those in and up from the outside. Here is an inexpensive set that will help. These look decent and come with a good amount of sections and accessories. Me personally, I have a few nice sets that glow in the dark that make life easier, but for something you only need a few times and since your attic appears well lite - these don't look to bad. This will also help you work from more of the center of the attic vs. having to crawl out to grab cable.
   1. SWANLAKE 33' Fiberglass Running Wire Cable Coaxial Electrical Fish Tape Pull Push Kit - - Amazon.com
3. Your soffits are deeper and angled than what we have in the midwest. Typically in the midwest you would have a sheet of finish board on the bottom of those 2/4's making the base of your soffit flat. Makes it easy to install the camera directly to that, of if you need to drop it down a bit below the trim line or gutters you simply use a camera junction box to do so. In your case, I would recomend most likely mounting the camera to your stuco/walls about 1.5' - 2' down from that soffit, mount a camera junction box to the house, run a piece of small conduit up from the junction box to under the soffit that the cable can go inside and follow up. (this can be determined as others noted using an easy test rig (bucket filled with sand and something like a 10' 2x4 in it.) If you have extra stucko paint this method will blend easy, just paint the conduit the stucco color once it's all mounted and it will disappear.
4. Keep in mind that end soffit is going to be inaccessible from your attic easily - most likely. Traditionally your end overhang is a box/closed soffit and is not "easily" accessible. To often people try to put a camera right on the corner but it's a closed void and requires multiple cuts to access - and is difficult if you don't know what you are doing. So unless you know for a fact it opens to the attic I would stay away from it - attached pic as reference.

You got this - the fact you are here, already bought some cable, and knew enough to get your big ass up into the attic - don't hire this out

Thank you! This is fantastic info. I have also purchase the tool set you recommended I think this will help a lot. One more quick question- what is the purpose of this "test rig" you both quoted? is that just to mount the camera to in order to make sure i like the line of sight?

Thank you again this is invaluable info!

 

[MicahJames]

Three simple words:

12yo neighbor kid

This one went over my head. lol whats the joke here?

 

[MicahJames]

B) DRZmaui. - what do you mean keep the camera as low as possible? Ive always had cameras installed about 10' high or wherever the ceiling is and point them kind of down. Can you elaborate on your recommendation? PS I do splice my own cable so I'm good to go there!

I'll try and send you some examples. Lower allows for better facial recognition. 6 inchs can make a huge difference.

Makes sense, I'll keep that in mind when positioning

 

[looney2ns]

B) DRZmaui. - what do you mean keep the camera as low as possible? Ive always had cameras installed about 10' high or wherever the ceiling is and point them kind of down. Can you elaborate on your recommendation? PS I do splice my own cable so I'm good to go there!

I'll try and send you some examples. Lower allows for better facial recognition. 6 inchs can make a huge difference.

Any cam higher than 8ft, will struggle to get a face ID. 6-8ft is a better, other wise you see tops of heads.

 

[looney2ns]

This one went over my head. lol whats the joke here?

Hire him to help in the attic...if you can find a 12yr old you can pry the game controller out of his hand long enough.

 

[MicahJames]

Hire him to help in the attic...if you can find a 12yr old you can pry the game controller out of his hand long enough.

OHHH LOL. Makes sense. My kid is too young otherwise that wouldn't be a bad idea. Im really impressed with the solutions people have brought up. I thought this was way above my head but im excited to give it a go. If anything im sure ill learn a lot.

I will be add some pics as things unfold, i appreciate everyone's time and input thanks