New member, trying to sort this out.

[Travis798]

Hello everyone. New member here from Oklahoma. As I'm sure a lot of people got their start in security cameras, I recently had my truck rummaged through that has sent me on a camera journey. I am currently running some Swann 5mp cameras that were free to me. It's a 16 channel dvr with 8 cameras, of which I have 4 installed. I'm having a heck of a time with reliable remote monitoring, so I'm looking to upgrade to something better. I typically work on the road for long periods of time, and am sometimes gone with my home unattended for months at a time, so I'm needing something as reliable as possible. Additional lighting in front and back of my house shouldn't be an issue, but I have a side area where tractor implements are stored (approximately 70 feet from the house) that I would like to have something with decent night vision.

I'm comfortable with cable runs and camera installation, along with purchasing and setting up a Blue Iris server if the knowledgeable people here feel that would be as or more reliable than a NVR, but as stated, uptime and reliability are more important in my application than an increased feature set. I had a reolink system ordered until I started reading on this forum, but I've emailed them asking to cancel that order since it hasn't shipped yet.

A rather large issue for me is that I may (or may not) be going back to work within the next couple of weeks, so I'm searching for a system that I can receive rather quickly, instead of waiting for it to ship from China or Hong Kong or whatever. There is a semi-local place that apparently installs HikVision cameras, but they state they do not sell DIY systems and if I can save some money with a quality system and do it myself I would prefer that route. There seems to be a ton of false or misleading information in the CCTV world when looking for cameras to purchase, so I'm hoping to lean on the experience here for a system that may be right for me.

Thanks for your time reading this, and I will be happy to answer any questions anyone might have to help get me going in the right direction.

 

[SouthernYankee]

One of the forum member Andy is a Dahua supplier from Asia. He ships fast.

Please provide a detailed explanation of what your problem is with the Swann system.
How are you trying to remote monitor ?
Provide model number of the equipment.

Read Study Plan before spending money
===========================================================

My standard welcome to the forum message.

Read Study Plan before spending money
Cameras are for surveillance to get information for after the fact.

Please read the IP Cam Talk Cliff Notes and other items in the IP Cam Talk Wiki. (read on a real computer, not a phone). The wiki is in the blue bar at the top of the page.

Read How to Secure Your Network (Don't Get Hacked!) in the wiki also.

Quick start
1) If you do not have a wired monitored alarm system, get that first
2) Use Dahua starlight cameras or Hikvision darkfighter cameras if you need good low light cameras.
3) use a VPN to access home network (openVPN)
4) Do not use wifi cameras.
5) Do not use cloud storage
6) Do Not use uPNP, P2P, QR, do not open ports,
7) More megapixel is not necessarily better.
8) Avoid chinese hacked cameras (most ebay, amazon, aliexpress cameras(not all, but most))
9) Do not use reolink, ring, nest, Arlo cameras (they are junk), no cloud cameras
10) If possible use a turret camera , bullet collect spiders, dome collect dirt and reflect light (IR)
11) Use only solid copper, AWG 23 or 24 ethernet wire. , no CCA (Copper Clad Aluminum)
12) use a test mount to verify the camera mount location. My test rig: rev.2
13) (Looney2ns)If you want to be able to ID faces, don't mount cams higher than 7ft. You want to know who did it, not just what happened.
14) Use a router that has openVPN built in (Most ASUS, Some NetGear....)
15) camera placement use the calculator... IPVM Camera Calculator V3
16) POE list PoE Switch Suggestion List
17) Camera Sensor size, bigger is general better Sensor Size Chart
18) Camera lens size, a bigger number give more range but less field of view. Which Security Camera Lens Size Should I Buy?


Cameras to look at
IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED . Review IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED (Full Color, Starlight+) - 4MP starlight
.................... Dahua IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED review
IPC-T5442TM-AS ..... Review-OEM 4mp AI Cam IPC-T5442TM-AS Starlight+ - 4MP starlight+
IPC-B5442E-ZE ...... Review - OEM IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP AI Varifocal Bullet Camera With Starlight+
IPC-T2347G-LU ...... Review of the Hikvision OEM model IPC-T2347G-LU 'ColorVu' IP CCTV camera. (DS-2CD2347G1-LU)
IPC-HDW2231R-ZS .... Review-Dahua IPC-HDW2231RP-ZS Starlight Camera-Varifocal
IPC-HDW2231T-ZS-S2 . Review-OEM IPC-T2231T-ZS 2mp Varifocal Starlight Camera
IPC-HDW5231R-ZE .... Review-Dahua Starlight IPC-HDW5231R-ZE 800 meter capable ePOE
IPC-HFW4239T-ASE ... IPC-HFW4239T-ASE
IPCT-HDW5431RE-I ... Review - IP Cam Talk 4 MP IR Fixed Turret Network Camera
IPC-T5241H-AS-PV ... Review-OEM IPC-T5241H-AS-PV 2mp AI active deterrence cam
IPC-T3241-ZAS ...... Review-OEM IPC-T3241-ZAS 2mp AI Lite series Varifocal -- 2mp AI Lite series Varifocal
IPC-HFW2831T-ZS ... Review-Dahua IPC-HFW2831T-ZS 8MP WDR IR Bullet Network Camera -- 8MP Bullet 1/1.8” sensor variable focus.
DS-2CD2325FWD-I
N22AL12 ............ New Dahua N22AL12 Budget Cam w/Starlight -- low cost entry
IPC-T2347G-LU....... Review-Loryta OEM 4MP IPC-T2347G-LU ColorVu Fixed Turret Network 4mm lens & Junction Box -- 4MP ColorVu
.................... Review of the Hikvision OEM model IPC-T2347G-LU 'ColorVu' IP CCTV camera.

Other dahua 4MP starlight Dahua 4MP Starlight Lineup

My preferred indoor cameras
DS-2CD2442FWD-IW
IPC-K35A

https://ipcamtalk.com/threads/review-dahua-ipc-k35a-3mp-cube-camera.37581/#post-373517

If interested in Blue Iris and other setup items see the following post

Newbie Starter Guide to IP Cam System – VPN setup – Computer Hardware – Blue Iris – Dahua Cameras

This is an intermediate / newbie guide for people just starting out looking for a surveillance setup. I know this setup might not be for everyone and there are many options. You can find a lot of this information in the Wiki: IP Cam Talk Wiki | IP Cam Talk A great place to start in the Wiki...

ipcamtalk.com

Before asking a question search the forum first...
The best way to search the forum is to use Google
In the google search window enter.. site:ipcamtalk.com ?????? ..where ?????? is the items/terms you are interested in.
Example site:ipcamtalk.com PALE MOON BROWSER

Read,study,plan before spending money ..... plan plan plan
Test do not guess

 

[SouthernYankee]

if you are interested in International Dahua cameras, a forum member sells dahua (and some Hikvision) and ships world wide. You can read some of the members recommendations on his service. He also provides cameras to other forum member for evaluation and reviews.
You can email him for a quote, or purchase from his Aliexpress store or his Amazon store. The cameras are fully upgradable, he posts upgrade software when available.

Current supply may be limited do to the Covid-19. Do to Covid-19 shipping has also gotten a little slow. I recommend email andy

Andy
@EMPIRETECANDY
kingsecurity2014@163.com
Andy's ipcamtalk vendor forum: EmpireTech Andy
Andy's AliExpress store: Empire Technology Co., Ltd - Amazing prodcuts with exclusive discounts on AliExpress
Andy's Amazon store: Amazon.com

 

[bigredfish]

Im a fan of the Dahua NVR's. Have a number of them and have installed them for friends. They have been very reliable and trouble free

The 5000 series is the sweet spot. Those with built-in PoE switch are easiest to setup. This one is often recommended (8 or 16 channels)

NVR5208/16-8P-4KS2E - Dahua Technology

NVR5208/16-8P-4KS2E

www.dahuasecurity.com

 

[aristobrat]

There is a semi-local place that apparently installs HikVision cameras, but they state they do not sell DIY systems

Dahua is mostly like that too... Their model is to sell their cameras to businesses like above who then design, install and support the product for the end-user. Cutting out the middle man and doing it yourself is a great way to save money IMO.

I think Dahua is currently a better value than Hik because Dahua has more affordable models that use the great 4MP 1/1.8" image sensor. IMO, that image sensor is about the best bang for the buck when it comes to low-light image quality, which is usually one the more important "wants" for people setting up security cameras. In terms of low-light image quality, it outperforms every 4K/8MP image sensor that has been discussed here, which is why folks will say "don't chase megapixels if you're looking for low-light image quality". Even as good as cameras that use the 4MP 1/1.8" image sensor are in low-light, if the light level is really low, it can be a struggle to get video of something in motion that doesn't have details <i.e. facial features> blurred. 4K/8MP cameras are almost always worse when it comes to that. This is why it's important to see a night-time video clip that contains motion when you read a camera review. It's easy to adjust the camera settings of just about any camera to get a beautiful night-time picture when nothing in the scene is moving. But you don't want beautiful night time pictures of your truck sitting there... you want as many details of the guy moving around your truck (if he comes back). Check out the Cliff Notes on PPF. Besides getting a camera that does well in low-light, you also need to the model with a lens (2.8mm, 3.6mm, 6mm .. .or varifocal) that gets enough PPF (pixels per foot) in the area you care about. Cameras with 2.8mm lens get you a nice and wide image, but unless the person is relatively close to the camera it won't have enough PPF to ID someone. Sometimes they have to be within 10-15 feet of the camera. If your camera isn't that close, that's when you need to choose a different lens (3.6mm, 6mm).

For whatever reason, Dahua's US branch (and the few authorized resellers they have that sell directly to the public, like B&H Photo) doesn't carry many of the popular Dahua models that use the 4MP 1/1.8" image sensor. The forum member mentioned in the posts above (Andy, @EMPIRETECANDY) sells from Dahua's International lineup which contains a ton more models that Dahua US has available. Like folks mentioned, he ships via DHL so stuff arrives pretty quick.

Off of @SouthernYankee's list, this model is probably the most popular. For the last three or four years, the best affordable low-light cameras have been 2MP models. The model below is the first time the tech has increased in MP and also increased in terms of better low-light performance:
Review-OEM 4mp AI Cam IPC-T5442TM-AS Starlight+

 

[Travis798]

Thank you everyone for the replies. I had previously checked out Andy's amazon store but saw no Dahua cameras there, and I was unsure about shipping time since I want to have a new system installed before I have to leave for work.

SouthernYankee, my main issue with my Swann setup is that they have a multitude of apps to view the cameras, but none of them reliably connect. Sometimes I can bring up the live view, sometimes it says no camera's connected, despite the fact that I will get movement alerts for cameras I can't view. Sometimes it wants me to connect a camera, but when I try it will say the camera is already connected, but refuses to show me any view and just goes back to the "connect a camera". I have also been unable to have any type of playback work, even when live view is working fine. Playback from the DVR works fine. I don't know why I said I had a 16 channel DVR, information overload from my research I guess. It's a Swann SWDVK-849808 system. It's a 8 channel, 8 camera CCTV system with 5MP cameras. It's mostly fine although I do think I would like to step up to 4k quality for a little better distance vision.

My town is very small with about 300 people, and after it had been noticed I installed these cameras the trouble makers won't even walk by my house, so it's effective in that regard, but full remote monitoring with the ability to playback, screenshot and control my cameras while in another state is an absolute must have for me. I have people to kind of keep an eye on my place that could alert me if something seemed off so I could check my cameras, but nobody has inside access to check the NVR themselves.

A flood light outside my front door keeps the night vision off on one of my cameras, and I need to change a bulb in my street light out back and light shouldn't be a problem there either. I can install a solar motion light by the tractor implements, but I'm not sure how effective that would be from a camera standpoint.

 

[SouthernYankee]

Because of the Amazon rules, Andy cameras have different names, but the numbers are similar to the dahua numbers.

your current system appears to be analog and uses coax cables, Please confirm.

When you are on your local home network, can you use a browser to access the DVR to look at your cameras ?
Do you want to access the cameras video from your phone or a laptop / PC / MAC ?

On lights, if the lights are on a motion sensor, when the light comes on it will blind the camera.
More megapixels will not improve your distance vision. look at Camera lens size, a bigger number give more range but less field of view. Which Security Camera Lens Size Should I Buy?


vocabulary
NVR - network video recorder, uses ethernet cables (RJ45) and IP cameras
DVR - Digital video recorder, an analog to digital recorder, mostly uses coax cables to cameras.

 

[Travis798]

Yes, my current system is an analog system using coax cables. I still have about 900 foot of siamese cable that will go in a closet I guess when I move to IP Cameras. Access to the cameras is via a Swann app on either mobile or desktop. At the moment, with my research and estimated arrival times on Amazon, I'm leaning towards an Amcrest system. My front light is a motion light, but I have it set on constant on. The light in back is a street lamp, so it's always on from dusk to dawn. The light is currently out of it, but when it was working the area that I need to watch was very clear at night via my little blink camera I had set up there.

If I'm understanding correctly, I think this camera will be much better for me in areas that will have less light?

https://www.amazon.com/Amcrest-3840x2160-NightVision-Weatherproof-IP8M-2496EB-40MM/dp/B07W158WQS/ref=sr_1_34?dchild=1&keywords=amcrest+varifocal&qid=1593131697&sr=8-34

It has a 4.0mm narrow lense with an 88 degree viewing angle. Or would I be saving myself frustration by going with one like this Amazon.com : Amcrest 4K Optical Zoom IP Camera, Varifocal 8MP Outdoor POE Camera Bullet, 4X Optical Zoom Security Camera, 2.7mm~12mm Lens, IP67 Weatherproof, IK10 Resistant, MicroSD Recording, (IP8M-MB2546EW) : Camera & Photo with the varifocal 2.7-12mm lens for that purpose?

 

[SouthernYankee]

my opinion.
More Megapixel is not necessary better. The most important thing is the sensor size. The bigger the sensor the more light.
Simple math an 8MP camera has twice as many pixels as a 4MP camera, so if the sensor size is the same, the 4MP camera has twice as much light per pixel as the 8MP camera.

The IP8M-2496EB-40MM has a 1/2.5 sensor
the IP8M-MB2546EW has a 1/2.5 sensor

The IP8M-MB2546EW is variable focus so it can be configured better to fit your space.

You are comparing a $99.00 camera to a $254.99 camera.

How about a couple of pictures of the space you are trying to cover would help.

15) camera placement use the calculator... IPVM Camera Calculator V3 ... it is free for three cameras i think....
7) More megapixel is not necessarily better.
10) If possible use a turret camera , bullet collect spiders, dome collect dirt and reflect light (IR)

I would look at the amcrest 8mp 1/2.5 sensor turret

Amazon.com: Amcrest UltraHD 4K POE Camera, 8MP Outdoor Security Turret PoE IP Camera, 3840x2160, 164ft NightVision, 4mm Lens, IP67 Weatherproof, MicroSD Recording (128GB), White (IP8M-T2499EW-40MM): Electronics

Amazon.com: Amcrest UltraHD 4K POE Camera, 8MP Outdoor Security Turret PoE IP Camera, 3840x2160, 164ft NightVision, 4mm Lens, IP67 Weatherproof, MicroSD Recording (128GB), White (IP8M-T2499EW-40MM): Electronics

www.amazon.com

The best camera out there is a 4MP 1/1.8 sensor. This is a camera from Andy, this camera is used by a lot of members, read the camera reviews on the forum.

Amazon.com: Loryta IPC-T5442TM-AS 2.8mm Fixed Lens 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Eyeball AI Network Camera English Version: Home Improvement

Amazon.com: Loryta IPC-T5442TM-AS 2.8mm Fixed Lens 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Eyeball AI Network Camera English Version: Home Improvement

www.amazon.com

Review-OEM 4mp AI Cam IPC-T5442TM-AS Starlight+

Dahua OEM IPC-T5442TM-AS from EMPIRETECANDY 4MP WDR Turret AI Network Camera Review unit courtesy of Andy (@EMPIRETECANDY) in exchange for a fair and honest review. Andy's ipcamtalk store: link Andy's AliExpress store: link Andy's Amazon store: link Price Approximately US $160 Link to camera...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[Travis798]

SouthernYankee, you just made my day. I've been having issues with spiders already with this system, and I've been wondering what I could do about that if I wasn't here. The little blink camera I had outside for a year never had spider issues. Turret camera's it is! I'll have to buy or build a bracket for them but that's no biggie at all.

My Swann app wanted to work so I grabbed some screen shots, unfortunately it was as the sun was setting which plays havoc with one of my cameras for a little while. I'll try to remember to grab some screen shots once it gets completely dark as well.

In the first image, labeled front gate, the IR never even kicks on with that camera while the outside light is on. I have a very good image of anyone coming though my front gate at anytime. I get a bit of light wash to the side of the camera, but it's nothing I'm overly concerned with.

The second image, labeled just front, is the one the sunset messes with. Night vision is actually pretty good with it too, with my front light providing light without glare, and a street light at the intersection behind it.

The third image, the side yard, is the area I thought I might need the varifocal camera. There's not much for ambient light there, and there are things I want to keep an eye on.

In the last image of the garage, you can see the street light type light that I just need to change a bulb in, and lighting for that area shouldn't be an issue.

I believe I could tweak my camera angles a bit here and there, and possibly add an additional one or two to cover the 2% area not currently on screen, but I think mostly there's nothing overall too complicated about my needs, unless I'm missing something?

 

[Travis798]

Now that it's good and dark, here is my night view with the current system

 

[samplenhold]

Realize that if someone was robbing your truck or the garage area, with those wide FOV shots, you would never get a good enough face shot for an ID. The face would be too small. Don't get me wrong, overview cams have their place. But they need to be combined with cams that are zoomed in enough to get many pixels on face.

You don't say how long you have. I just got another shipment of cams from @EMPIRETECANDY (Andy) and it took a week from my email to him asking for price and availability until I received the package. By far the easiest way to order from him is email. You pay through PayPal. Just remember that Hong Kong is 12 hours ahead of CDT. Andy can get you cams and an NVR. @bigredfish is very knowledgeable and if you would rather go the NVR route, his recommendation should be considered great. If you are short on time, it might be quicker to go the NVR route than the BI Server route. I use BI and am partial to it. Andy also does have an Amazon storefront. @SouthernYankee posted a link to it on post #3.

I got into this hobby since I too am away from home for weeks at a time. Being able to check things out from afar is great. I have all Dahua cams (19) and bought every one of them from Andy over a period of about 18 months.

Both @SouthernYankee and @aristobrat are also top knowledgeable members. Their recommendations are also top notch. We usually tell folks to go slow, get a good varifocal cam and use it to test out positions and what focal length is needed so that one can get proper sized fixed lens cams. You may not have the time to do that.

 

[Travis798]

Thank you everyone. You've all given me some things to consider.

Samplenhold, my time issue is that I just don't know. The likelihood of going back to work before July 4th is extremely low, but after that, I just don't know. I could get a call next week or I may be home for months. I'm hoping to have something set up and "good enough" by next week, and then I can configure and tweak it from there if I have the time. I might be going way overboard, but I'm considering getting a PTZ camera and installing on the front corner of my house, which would cover the same area I have 3 cameras covering now, plus giving me the ability for the 12x optical zoom. I haven't seen any NVR with POE+, but I'm assuming I'd just have to get a POE+ switch for it, with a few additional cameras still also covering the areas I need, and I would have an excellent starting point. Or am I just being my usual self and thinking way overboard and crazy and spending money I don't need to be spending?

 

[Old Timer]

You can also use Nelly's security.

Nelly's Security

The webs top source for new security cameras & surveillance systems.

ipcamtalk.com

I have bought cameras from them, quick shipping and good product.
They are in Tulsa if you need to pick up your order.

 

[bigredfish]

Nellys are good folks, but I don’t think they sell Dahua anymore.

 

[samplenhold]

I might be going way overboard, but I'm considering getting a PTZ camera and installing on the front corner of my house

Probably going overboard. PTZ cams in the prosumer price range are neat, but unless you are at your desk looking at it to be able to control it, it is just a another cam. Do not expect it to quickly find a perp and zoom in on him like in the movies. If you set it on a schedule to patrol, chances are that it will be looking in the wrong direction when needed. Now some folks have had good luck with having some fixed position cams that when triggered, send a command to the PTZ to go to that area. But all that takes time and focus. At night it is even less quick.

The most reliable set up is to cover your bases with quality fixed cams that are zoomed in enough to get good face shots.

 

[bp2008]

@Travis798 First, I apologize for only skimming this thread before replying.

If you need cameras fast, a lot of Andy's listings on Amazon have "Prime" delivery (dunno if you are a prime subscriber). Anyway here they are: Amazon.com

Some particular model numbers to search for:

IPC-HFW1831E - This is an 8MP cam with decent night vision. No microphone. These don't have as good of night vision as 4MP or 2MP starlights, but they aren't really bad either. The key is the 1/1.8” sensor. Beware of 8MP / 4K cams with smaller sensors (1/2.5", 1/2.7", etc) that have worse night vision. Also this listing has all 3 lens sizes in stock -- 2.8mm is the widest, 6mm is the narrowest.

IPC-T2231T-ZS - This is an older 2MP starlight model with no microphone but with a varifocal lens so you can zoom it in and out through the camera's web interface. Also a good price here.

IPC-T5442TM-AS - 4MP starlight cam as described by others above. Has microphone. This listing is for fixed-focus versions so you must pick the lenses you want when you buy them.

 

[Holbs]

And to toss in another wrench....camera's and notifications occur during/after someone has already rummaged in your truck or house. You could get a immediate notification with picture while you are not near your smartphone to hear/see said notification (bathroom break, in line at Burger King, etc).
I would add in monitored home alarm system with PIR and door/window sensors for additional security. Could toss in outdoor PIR motion sensors. I'm running 3 Bosch PIR for the last month to test if shadows, window heat, pets give any false alarms. 0 so far. I have an outdoor Bosch PIR motion sensor to yet install (dang thing is like $90) once I am satisfied with the inside of house ones.

 

[bp2008]

If you want a PTZ, you might have trouble getting a "big" one like SD49225T-HN quickly (also note that would require a PoE+ power supply), but here's a small one I've used in a few places and it is pretty nice and works on standard PoE. Amazon.com: EmpireTech SD1A203T-GN IP Camera 2MP 3X Starlight IR PTZ Network Camera Support PoE English Version: Home Improvement

 

[bp2008]

Speaking of alarm systems, @fenderman says the Ring alarm systems are good and they have relatively cheap monitoring service. Just avoid Ring cameras because those are wifi trash.