New to NVR request direction

[rbc1225]

Hello all, I am new to this NVR equipment and there is so much out there it's difficult to pick and choose what I need. I would like a 16 channel NVR just so I don't run out of channels. I am thinking I would like 8 to be POE and 8 to be WIFI. I would also like to add a License Plate reader and of course would like to be able to use the LPR software to read and store license plates.

That's the basics of what I would like to start with. I am thinking of just starting with the NVR box itself and add cameras as needed. I found this on Amazon and curious if it would be a good starting point? If there is something you would recommend that may work better, or better quality, please speak up.

Amazon.com : Lorex 16-Channel (8 Wired and 8 Wi-Fi ) Fusion 4K Security Camera NVR IP Recorder with 2TB : Electronics

Thanks

 

[Flintstone61]

You can get more flexibility for adding mixed bags of cameras with The Dahua NVR's available from Empiretech or "Andy" on the IPCAMtalk store.

 

[rbc1225]

You can get more flexibility for adding mixed bags of cameras with The Dahua NVR's available from Empiretech or "Andy" on the IPCAMtalk store.

I looked there before I asked the question, and maybe I am overlooking something, but I didn't see any NVRs there that had both POE and WIFI inputs?

 

[jarrow]

WiFi camera's are rarely a good idea which I why you don't see many professional brands advertise with this, so I'd personally rethink that.
For the NVR, I'd recommend a Dahua 5 series like NVR5216-16P-4KS2. This will give you 16 channels and the same amount of POE ports on the back. If you want you can record other cameras on the same network (WiFi or connected via a POE switch/injector), as long as they are either Dahua or Onvif capable and you stay within the 16 channels.
This series NVR also has the ability to intregrate actual ANPR cameras (so the cam has the smart features) although a lot here use a HFW5241E-Z12E as a diy NPR.

Another option would be to look into Blue Iris, which is software that runs on a dedicated Windows PC and has a lot of options in regards of ANPR and customizability.

 

[rbc1225]

WiFi camera's are rarely a good idea which I why you don't see many professional brands advertise with this, so I'd personally rethink that.
For the NVR, I'd recommend a Dahua 5 series like NVR5216-16P-4KS2. This will give you 16 channels and the same amount of POE ports on the back. If you want you can record other cameras on the same network (WiFi or connected via a POE switch/injector), as long as they are either Dahua or Onvif capable and you stay within the 16 channels.
This series NVR also has the ability to intregrate actual ANPR cameras (so the cam has the smart features) although a lot here use a HFW5241E-Z12E as a diy NPR.

Another option would be to look into Blue Iris, which is software that runs on a dedicated Windows PC and has a lot of options in regards of ANPR and customizability.

Ahhhh maybe that's the part I am missing. I didn't realize you could record other cameras on the same network, be it WiFi or POE. I just thought you would be limited by the number of channels dedicated to POE and WiFi.

The only reason I would like some WiFi is the fact I live in a 50 year old house and it is multiple stories and difficult to get another cable to. I figure I could use some of my existing motion detection lights to power them with without having to run an ethernet cable to them.

Can you point me in the right direction to learn on the recording of the WiFi cameras on the NVR5216-16P-4KS2? I looked at that and I like it. If you could just point me to a website I can work with that on how that would work. I normally don't need to be handfed.

Thanks

 

[SouthernYankee]

The WIFI will come from your home network, not the NVR. The video data will flow from the WIFI camera to an access point or a Router, then on to the wired network, then to your NVR.

===========================
I have posted this before.
I did a WIFI test a while back with multiple 2MP cameras each camera was set to VBR, 15 FPS, 15 Iframe, 3072kbs, h.264. Using a WIFI analyzer I selected the least busy channel (1,6,11) on the 2.4 GHZ band and set up a separate access point. With 3 cameras in direct line of sight of the AP about 25 feet away I was able to maintain a reasonable stable network with only intermittent signal drops from the cameras. Added a 4th camera and the network became totally unstable. Also add a lot of motion to the 3 cameras caused some more network instability. More data more instability.
The cameras are nearly continuously transmitting. So any lost packet causes a retry, which cause more traffic, which causes more lost packets.
WIFI does not have a flow control, or a token to transmit. So your devices transmit any time they want, more devices more collisions.
As a side note, it is very easy to jam a WIFI network. WIFI is fine for watching the bird feed but not for home surveillance and security.
The problem is like standing in a room, with multiple people talking to you at the same time about different subjects. You need to answer each person or they repeat the question.

Test do not guess.

For a 802.11G 2.4 GHZ WIFI network the Theoretical Speed is 54Mbps (6.7MBs) real word speed is nearer to 10-29Mbps (1.25-3.6 MBs) for a single channel

 

[rbc1225]

The WIFI will come from your home network, not the NVR. The video data will flow from the WIFI camera to an access point or a Router, then on to the wired network, then to your NVR.

===========================
I have posted this before.
I did a WIFI test a while back with multiple 2MP cameras each camera was set to VBR, 15 FPS, 15 Iframe, 3072kbs, h.264. Using a WIFI analyzer I selected the least busy channel (1,6,11) on the 2.4 GHZ band and set up a separate access point. With 3 cameras in direct line of sight of the AP about 25 feet away I was able to maintain a reasonable stable network with only intermittent signal drops from the cameras. Added a 4th camera and the network became totally unstable. Also add a lot of motion to the 3 cameras caused some more network instability. More data more instability.
The cameras are nearly continuously transmitting. So any lost packet causes a retry, which cause more traffic, which causes more lost packets.
WIFI does not have a flow control, or a token to transmit. So your devices transmit any time they want, more devices more collisions.
As a side note, it is very easy to jam a WIFI network. WIFI is fine for watching the bird feed but not for home surveillance and security.
The problem is like standing in a room, with multiple people talking to you at the same time about different subjects. You need to answer each person or they repeat the question.

Test do not guess.

For a 802.11G 2.4 GHZ WIFI network the Theoretical Speed is 54Mbps (6.7MBs) real word speed is nearer to 10-29Mbps (1.25-3.6 MBs) for a single channel

Perfect answer, so the NVR can record (I assume based on IP) the cameras off the network. That makes perfect sense to me. I fully agree with you on the jamming of the signals, thus the reason I have searched high and low for a good POE system. The WiFi cameras will be used more as confirmation or backup if you will for places I can't get wiring too. Thank you so much for your help. Off to Amazon or the IPCamtalk Store to pickup an NVR.

 

[jarrow]

Another option, which is more stable than wifi, would be to use Power Line Adapters. These will use your exsisting AC wiring for the data. YMMV but I've had good results using them on different installations where wiring was nearly impossible.

 

[rbc1225]

Another option, which is more stable than wifi, would be to use Power Line Adapters. These will use your exsisting AC wiring for the data. YMMV but I've had good results using them on different installations where wiring was nearly impossible.

Oh yeah, I forgot about those. Do you have a specific model you prefer that seem to work well for you?

 

[looney2ns]

Wifi cams will cause issues, usually right at the time you need the camera feed.
There is almost always a way to get cable to a location.
Electricians do it every day.

 

[rbc1225]

Wifi cams will cause issues, usually right at the time you need the camera feed.
There is almost always a way to get cable to a location.
Electricians do it every day.

I am not going to argue about this but I have a 4 story house that's 45 years old and 6000sq ft. To go from the bottom floor to the top would be a major pain in the rear.

 

[jarrow]

Oh yeah, I forgot about those. Do you have a specific model you prefer that seem to work well for you?

I usually go with TP-Link, because of the price-performance ratio. Also ones where the socket can be used for something else, this is where I plug the POE injector so I only need one socket and those without WiFi. Don't know what models are best available to you as I'm in Europe, TL-PA7017P worked for me.

 

[rbc1225]

I usually go with TP-Link, because of the price-performance ratio. Also ones where the socket can be used for something else, this is where I plug the POE injector so I only need one socket and those without WiFi. Don't know what models are best available to you as I'm in Europe, TL-PA7017P worked for me.

Awesome, thanks. I have used TP-Link before and they worked well. Thanks again all.

 

[rbc1225]

I bought a copy of Blue Iris, that is a cool program. This puts it all in perspective on how the pieces fit together. Again, thanks everyone.

 

[rbc1225]

Sorry guys, another newbie question. I got my camera ordered and was looking at this diagram and wondering why the POE switch is needed if the NVR has the POE built in. Or maybe the NVR shown does not have POE ports and that's why the POE switch is needed? Am I thinking straight?

 

[TonyR]

Sorry guys, another newbie question. I got my camera ordered and was looking at this diagram and wondering why the POE switch is needed if the NVR has the POE built in.

it doesn't.

Or maybe the NVR shown does not have POE ports and that's why the POE switch is needed?

Yes

Am I thinking straight?

You got it!

 

[rbc1225]

Awesome, thanks Tony.

 

[Dingoboy77]

Sorry guys, another newbie question. I got my camera ordered and was looking at this diagram and wondering why the POE switch is needed if the NVR has the POE built in.

The only times you would need a POE switch if the NVR has POE built in is:
1 - If the distance of your cable run exceeds the maximum distance POE would travel from your NVR, you would need to use a POE switch as a repeater to power your camera
2 - Redundancy in case the POE in the NVR port goes bad

 

[Dingoboy77]

The only times you would need a POE switch if the NVR has POE built in is:
1 - If the distance of your cable run exceeds the maximum distance POE would travel from your NVR, you would need to use a POE switch as a repeater to power your camera
2 - Redundancy in case the POE in the NVR port goes bad

I realized as soon as I clicked post that I didn't like my use of the term repeater. It is not repeating anything, but it is a good way to supply power on an extended camera run.

 

[rbc1225]

The only times you would need a POE switch if the NVR has POE built in is:
1 - If the distance of your cable run exceeds the maximum distance POE would travel from your NVR, you would need to use a POE switch as a repeater to power your camera
2 - Redundancy in case the POE in the NVR port goes bad

Seems to me I could buy a POE switch and a Non POE NVR and actually break up the two functions, is that not correct? Seems to me that an NVR with POE has a better chance of possible problems if the switch dies and you would have to replace the full NVR. Is there any advantage to having the POE included with the NVR? I mean maybe a speed advantage or something like that?