Running Blue Iris in Virtual Machine

bcr4977

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I thought I would share in case anyone else was interested. I didn't feel like setting up a dedicated computer and thought I would try Blue Iris on a Windows 2012 R2 VM.

I'm running Microsoft's Hyper-V on a Dell Precision T7500 workstation. They're relatively cheap on eBay and you can get them with a lot of memory for fairly cheap. For a little over $400 you get a dual L5640 Xeon processors (12 cores total @ 2.26ghz) and 48GB of ram. The Hyper-V host is running 6 servers for various things like domain controllers, Plex media server, exchange, smtp mail filter, etc. including the vm for Blue Iris.

The Windows 2012 R2 VM for Blue Iris has 6GB of RAM and 6 virtual processors assigned. I have two virtual disks on different physical disks assigned, one for live capture and the other for storage. The physical disks are nothing fancy, 1.5TB WD Blacks.

Blue Iris is connected to 3 x Hikvision camera's. All are gray market, 2 x 3mp and 1 x 4mp. Camera frame rate set to 10 fps. I'm very pleased with these camera's, one of them I've had for 2 years and has never skipped a beat. It's used outside in Texas where temperatures are below freezing and over 100+F in the summer.

CPU Utilization floats around 25-35% and RAM usage is 1.3GB inside the VM. If I push the frame rate on the cameras the CPU utilization will increase close to 50%. Looking at the CPU physical usage on the Hyper-V physical host is significantly less, 5-6% when the vm instance says 25-35%. This is no surprise with the light CPU utilization and only having 3 camera's. I do feel this will scale well, as I add camera's I can allocate more processors.

Overall the system performs really well. I'm using the Blue Iris mobile application on iOS and I couldn't be happier with the performance. I'm using Stunnel to encrypt remote access. My upload is limited to 1.5mbps, but the mobile app is very responsive. Retrieving camera feed and playing back video is instant. The Blue Iris Admin client is responsive through a RDP session.
 

fenderman

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@bcr4977T errible idea...that server is a power hog..you were ripped off bigtime...that is an 8 year old processor and a space heater....you will be paying significantly more in electric bills...to the tune of 200-400 per year depending on your rates and load....a modern i5 processor could run circles around that aging dual processor setup and cost less....100-300 for an entire system...@bcr4977
 
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fenderman

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I don't need to buy a dedicated machine, as I said I was getting rid of an old one so makes no sense to get a replacement. The desktop is my "file server" and has additional VMs that run 24/7 so for me it was a no brainer to put BlueIris onto it in a VM.

Oh, and it costs me $5/month to run that "8 year old power hog" and it was a self-built machine so I didn't buy it, or the parts, from fraudsters. I'll be saving ~$5/month by not having that old dedicated BlueIris machine on 24/7.

Thanks for the input but I'll continue to use BlueIris in a VM.
Your reading comprehension is lacking...the 8 year old system is that of the OP!! Not yours - you should know that your processor is not eight years old.....geez, public schools failed you. Your system is a more modern efficient system - third gen. Wow, you cant read. The fraudsters are the ones who sold the OP that garbage space heater. You really need to read the messages in context of the entire thread...
As far as running in a VM - its a terrible idea. Keep doing it, Ill be laughing when you have a failure and murphy's law bites you in the ass. I am not here to convince you of anything...just protecting my users from following stupid advice..
 
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bcr4977

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@bcr4977T errible idea...that server is a power hog..you were ripped off bigtime...that is an 8 year old processor and a space heater....you will be paying significantly more in electric bills...to the tune of 200-400 per year depending on your rates and load....a modern i5 processor could run circles around that aging dual processor setup and cost less....100-300 for an entire system...@bcr4977
Thanks for sharing, I didn't mean this as a suggestion to others and wanted to share my experience.

I needed something to setup multiple servers, not just for Blue Iris. I wanted quality components and 48-64GB of memory. The processors are low power versions at 60W TDP, compared to a modern i5-7400 at 65W TDP and has 15% higher CPU Passmark scores. I average $.08/kwh in my area, at $200-$400 that equates to 285-570W that this computer would have to pull over a modern desktop. Since TDP is just the heat coming off the processor, I'm not sure what the actual power draw will be. I didn't think it would be that significant, but maybe it is. I have a watt meter I'll have to put on to validate your statement. I will finally get to retire an old server running a Q6600 that pulls 130W, that will save me $91/year.
 

fenderman

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Thanks for sharing, I didn't mean this as a suggestion to others and wanted to share my experience.

I needed something to setup multiple servers, not just for Blue Iris. I wanted quality components and 48-64GB of memory. The processors are low power versions at 60W TDP, compared to a modern i5-7400 at 65W TDP and has 15% higher CPU Passmark scores. I average $.08/kwh in my area, at $200-$400 that equates to 285-570W that this computer would have to pull over a modern desktop. Since TDP is just the heat coming off the processor, I'm not sure what the actual power draw will be. I didn't think it would be that significant, but maybe it is. I have a watt meter I'll have to put on to validate your statement. I will finally get to retire an old server running a Q6600 that pulls 130W, that will save me $91/year.
tdp is not the measure of actual power consumption...also note that you have two...further note that with an i5-7400 you have intel hardware acceleration which boosts performance with respect to BI significantly. You will likely be drawing way more power than your q6600 under the same load...paying over 400 for an 8 year old system is highway robbery - there are many available running 3rd and fourth gen i7 procecssors or xeon equivalents for that price and less.
As far as cost, ensure that you are looking at the actual cost of the electricity including delivery, they are often separated.
You can easily find a much more modern server than that 8 year old powerhog...
 

bcr4977

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tdp is not the measure of actual power consumption...also note that you have two...further note that with an i5-7400 you have intel hardware acceleration which boosts performance with respect to BI significantly. You will likely be drawing way more power than your q6600 under the same load...paying over 400 for an 8 year old system is highway robbery - there are many available running 3rd and fourth gen i7 procecssors or xeon equivalents for that price and less.
As far as cost, ensure that you are looking at the actual cost of the electricity including delivery, they are often separated.
You can easily find a much more modern server than that 8 year old powerhog...
I understand TDP is not a measure of power consumption and specifically stated it in my post. I have it connected through a watt meter now. Operating load for all 6 virtual servers and Hyper-V host hovers right around 190 watts. I also have three spinning disks and a SSD for reference. Using a CPU benchmark with all the cores maxed out the power consumption peaks at 259 watts. My average power cost of $.08/kwh includes TDU, fees, and taxes. I take my bill and divide by the power used each month.

I'm not really sure how a modern computer would fair in power usage compared to something with similar processing power for multiple applications, not just Blue Iris. The least expensive single processor I could find with similar Passmark scores to dual Xeon L5640 is the i5-8600k. I would guess the power consumption would be somewhere around 80 watts at a similar operating load, and maybe 130 watts at max. I did a quick price on Amazon and it came to just under $1000 for the processor, motherboard, 32GB RAM, case, and power supply. The big killer is the price on memory, which mine has 48GB instead of the 32GB in the example configuration.

Considering what we've discussed I agree the power consumption is likely considerably more, maybe even more than double of a modern system. I don't think you're going to find a similar computer anywhere near that price range though. The time to recoup the additional cost through power savings would be significant.
 

fenderman

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I understand TDP is not a measure of power consumption and specifically stated it in my post. I have it connected through a watt meter now. Operating load for all 6 virtual servers and Hyper-V host hovers right around 190 watts. I also have three spinning disks and a SSD for reference. Using a CPU benchmark with all the cores maxed out the power consumption peaks at 259 watts. My average power cost of $.08/kwh includes TDU, fees, and taxes. I take my bill and divide by the power used each month.

I'm not really sure how a modern computer would fair in power usage compared to something with similar processing power for multiple applications, not just Blue Iris. The least expensive single processor I could find with similar Passmark scores to dual Xeon L5640 is the i5-8600k. I would guess the power consumption would be somewhere around 80 watts at a similar operating load, and maybe 130 watts at max. I did a quick price on Amazon and it came to just under $1000 for the processor, motherboard, 32GB RAM, case, and power supply. The big killer is the price on memory, which mine has 48GB instead of the 32GB in the example configuration.

Considering what we've discussed I agree the power consumption is likely considerably more, maybe even more than double of a modern system. I don't think you're going to find a similar computer anywhere near that price range though. The time to recoup the additional cost through power savings would be significant.
a modern server which would have cost you LESS than what you paid for this powerhog would run at 60w or less...
Not sure why you are comparing a USED 8 year old server to a very recent processor build...look at what used servers go for using 3-4th generation i7 or the xeon counterparts....add to that the 80+ dollars a year you will pay to your electric company and it makes no sense.
 

bcr4977

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a modern server which would have cost you LESS than what you paid for this powerhog would run at 60w or less...
Not sure why you are comparing a USED 8 year old server to a very recent processor build...look at what used servers go for using 3-4th generation i7 or the xeon counterparts....add to that the 80+ dollars a year you will pay to your electric company and it makes no sense.
I looked at several options and didn't find anything cheaper at the time. Where can I find a server that has at least 48GB of RAM, consumes less electricity, similar or better performance, and costs less than $430?
 

fenderman

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I looked at several options and didn't find anything cheaper at the time. Where can I find a server that has at least 48GB of RAM, consumes less electricity, similar or better performance, and costs less than $430?
you can buy a server with less than 48gb then add more, your memory is expensive because its old...ebay is FULL of workstations and servers with much more modern processors in that price range. At that price you can do the correct thing and run two separate machines...a dedicated BI machine and a vm for the rest of your stuff and still come out way ahead....I dont really care to convince you...just want to point others in the right direction before they waste money on someones old trash that will cost them way more in the long run..
 

bcr4977

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you can buy a server with less than 48gb then add more, your memory is expensive because its old...ebay is FULL of workstations and servers with much more modern processors in that price range. At that price you can do the correct thing and run two separate machines...a dedicated BI machine and a vm for the rest of your stuff and still come out way ahead....I dont really care to convince you...just want to point others in the right direction before they waste money on someones old trash that will cost them way more in the long run..
I appreciate the feedback. I saw another post where you suggested the HP 8300 with the i5-3570. It's a solid suggestion for someone getting started with a dedicated BI machine. I may end up doing one of those for my parents since they're interested in getting a camera security system.
 

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I appreciate the feedback. I sayew another post where you suggested the HP 8300 with the i5-3570. It's a solid suggestion for someone getting started with a dedicated BI machine. I may end up doing one of those for my parents since they're interested in getting a camera security system.
yes, I normally personally buy newer model elitedesks that often are a few months old (300 on average for i5-6500 based systems) , but I have a bunch of 8300's in service purring away..
 

Qlxpfive

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A twist on the VM topic, but has anyone had any success running BI in a VM on FreeNAS? I messed a bit with bhyve in older versions of FreeNAS, but once 11 arrived with VM support, I decided to give BI a go, since I had abundant unused resources on the box. I achieved what seemed to be a pretty stable Windows installation and installed BI; but, as soon as BI was initiated it crashed the VM. I'm not sure if FreeNAS has achieved better stability in the VM environment and/or if newer versions of BI have eliminated the snag, but I'm considering trying again. Before I do, does anyone have any success/failure stories in this arena?
Thanks,
 

bcr4977

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A twist on the VM topic, but has anyone had any success running BI in a VM on FreeNAS? I messed a bit with bhyve in older versions of FreeNAS, but once 11 arrived with VM support, I decided to give BI a go, since I had abundant unused resources on the box. I achieved what seemed to be a pretty stable Windows installation and installed BI; but, as soon as BI was initiated it crashed the VM. I'm not sure if FreeNAS has achieved better stability in the VM environment and/or if newer versions of BI have eliminated the snag, but I'm considering trying again. Before I do, does anyone have any success/failure stories in this arena?
Thanks,
What OS are you using? You might try running it with Windows 2012 R2. It's been around longer and has better VM support compared to something like Windows 10. I found an article of someone having similar issues to what you described. In addition to BI killing the Windows 10, they could also do it with a GPU utility leading them to believe it was video driver related.

FreeNAS 11 BHYVE Graphical drivers for Windows 10
 

Qlxpfive

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What OS are you using? You might try running it with Windows 2012 R2. It's been around longer and has better VM support compared to something like Windows 10. I found an article of someone having similar issues to what you described. In addition to BI killing the Windows 10, they could also do it with a GPU utility leading them to believe it was video driver related.

FreeNAS 11 BHYVE Graphical drivers for Windows 10
Thank you - I'll try that if I get a chance to start messing with it again. Seeing how BI does with CPU, though, I might be better keeping it separate. My BI has a newer CPU architecture.
 

vfrex

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I had issues running the 64-bit version of BI in a VM. No idea why, but reinstalled 32 bit version of BI and the issue disappeared. Granted this was Debian/KVM. I nuked my host and tried Proxmox (which is really Debian/KVM with a GUI), reinstalled the guest, and now I can launch/run 64-bit BI without crashing the guest.
 

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yes, I normally personally buy newer model elitedesks that often are a few months old (300 on average for i5-6500 based systems) , but I have a bunch of 8300's in service purring away..
Please let me know what models to look out for that are “a few months old”. I’m a Mac user that is interested in running BI and possibly PfSense too.

Thanks,

Rob
 

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FWIW, I just got my BI PC mostly setup. I bought a Dell Optiplex 3040 SFF from a refurbisher on eBay. It didn't come with any drives but that's fine because I had a spare SSD, and would have tossed whatever hard drive came with it in favor of a WD purple. The sticker shows the PC to be 18 months old and I ran the service tag to see the original configuration. It came with a Win10 license so the code is embedded in the UEFI.

It is an i5-6500 with 8 GB of RAM and I just did a clean install of Win10 1803. With the BI service running, task manager shows 11-13% CPU used by BI. The kill-a-watt shows 17-18w draw. WD says the 4 TB Purple drive will draw another 5w while reading/writing.

I have it continuously recording two 2 MP h.265 (VBR) starlights and creating motion alerts for one zone each. I also have it recording motion events from an old VGA Foscam I use as a baby monitor. I've recorded 8.4 GB of footage in 24 hours. One starlight uses a lot more data since it gets more motion events, causing the bit rate from the camera itself to increase.

Thanks to @fenderman for talking me out of an NVR to save power. The difference between a modern Intel CPU and an NVR isn't significant. Also, the cameras use less power on average than their specs would suggest. I'm seeing about 3w during the day and 6w with the IR on per camera. My BV tech 18 port switch draws 6w.
 

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Good deal. It is amazing what Dell's engineers can do to save power. I built a mini-itx box this year with an i7-8700K that idled at 31 watts. Could be that the bigger CPU idles higher or something, but I think it is more likely the fans and motherboard just draw more power than Dell's.
 

fenderman

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Good deal. It is amazing what Dell's engineers can do to save power. I built a mini-itx box this year with an i7-8700K that idled at 31 watts. Could be that the bigger CPU idles higher or something, but I think it is more likely the fans and motherboard just draw more power than Dell's.
are you using an efficient power supply?
 

bp2008

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are you using an efficient power supply?
Yeah, something 80plus gold rated, but it is seriously overpowered for the load it has because it is just hard to trust a cheap PSU and all the expensive ones have high watt ratings. It could be they're just really inefficient at a 5% load.

It is one of these: http://a.co/04BsdNe
 
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