Ryzen second gen for Blue Iris?

Discussion in 'Blue Iris' started by Swinub, May 23, 2018.

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  1. Swinub

    Swinub n3wb

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    Has anyone tested with Ryzen second gen?

    I'm really impressed with all the extremely favorable reviews of these CPUs, and the extremely high thread count, efficient power consumption, and most importantly cheaper cost compared to Intel.

    I'll be using direct-to-disc, likely 4 to 6 cameras, 6MP.

    Like to hear from people who ACTUALLY OWN ONE or have used one.
     
  2. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    they are more power hungry than intel as they also require a video card. blue iris needs intel hd for hardware acceleration. They also cost MORE than a compatible intel system purchased via the dell outlet/ebay. There are a bunch of threads on this topic. Just a silly move to use amd.
     
  3. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    In January I compared a first-gen Ryzen 1800x with Intel i7-8700K. The only way the Ryzen was on par with (not better than -- only equal to) the Intel was if I turned off the hardware acceleration that is available for the Intel platform. Otherwise Intel could process more video and do it with lower power consumption. AMD Versus Intel

    Now Ryzen 2700X is somewhat better than the 1800x but not enough better to outweight the benefit of hardware acceleration from Intel. Due to Intel's long-time CPU superiority and resulting popularity, that is the only platform where Blue Iris supports hardware acceleration. It also means you can get refurbished Intel PCs for several hundred $$$ less than an equivalent-performance Ryzen build. Choosing Hardware for Blue Iris | IP Cam Talk
     
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  4. Swinub

    Swinub n3wb

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    Thanks this is exactly what I want, someone whose actually used both.

    Is hardware acceleration/QS an issue if I am writing direct to disk? Ie no encoding?

    Do you remember what kind of cpu usage you were seeing with both? With and without QS would be great if you remember.

    How much of an improvement in percentage terms did you see when using QuickSynch?

    This is my thought/idea:
    I have an old nVidia card laying around, so no issue there. But the Ryzen 2 2600 is almost 40% cheaper than the 8400. Once I factor in the motherboards, the price differential increases even further in favour of Ryzen. Around 50-60% cheaper than the Intel equivalent. And yet in most cpu benchmarks it still matches or comes relatively (keyword relatively) close to the performance of the i7, at around 40% cheaper (!). In terms of value I'm really impressed.

    *Not really interested in buying an old refurb. I enjoy building my own system and controlling what components are used. I don't mind paying to build a new system because I have fun doing it, and I have some parts that I can reuse (video card, case, power supply).

    Sent from my Mi A1 using Tapatalk
     
  5. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    The refurbished systems are not old ...you are misinformed and confused...they are generally a few weeks to a month old....
    You can enjoy building but it is simply foolish to pay 300 more for that "joy"..
     
  6. aristobrat

    aristobrat IPCT Contributor

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    Do you ever plan to watch video as it streams from your cameras (or review clips/alerts written to disk)? IIRC, that's when the H.264 has to be processed and when the hardware acceleration helps.
     
  7. Swinub

    Swinub n3wb

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    Rarely, the PC will likely sit in the basement most of the time and I will only review occasionally if I need to see something. I won't be actively monitoring.

    Wondering, if I am watching a video that is ALREADY SAVED to the disc, there is no encoding happening, no? The file has already been saved. At that point it's simply DECODING to play the video back, which is not as CPU intensive anyway (plus many video playback apps like VLC, etc. can utilize Nvidia acceleration anyway if needed).
     
  8. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    Yes, Blue Iris is always decoding the incoming video and that is what the hardware acceleration / quick sync is used for.

    That is all covered in the post I linked at the end of my first paragraph. You probably didn't see the link.

    Check the power consumption on that card.

    Nope, hardware acceleration in Blue Iris is currently only implemented for decoding incoming H.264 streams, and that happens all the time.

    If you view via a mobile app or web interface then Blue Iris transcodes (decodes then re-encodes) the video as you watch it. If you view locally in Blue Iris's console though then it is only decoding and it CAN use hardware acceleration for this though I prefer for it not to because last I checked it created some issues with seeking through a clip.

    The best format to save video in is Blue Iris's proprietary BVR format because it lets you view a clip while it is still being recorded to. No other program knows how to play it, only Blue Iris.
     
  9. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    Where do you get that number? I see $190 for Ryzen 5 2600, $180 for i5-8400. Motherboard prices are very similar, and even donor graphics cards use power that someone has to pay for. I don't see Ryzen being cheaper at all. More expensive actually.
     
  10. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    Oh I should probably mention that i5-8400 wouldn't be a good choice for Blue Iris. Intel has driver issues which they refuse to acknowledge which cause steadily rising CPU usage when Blue Iris uses Quick Sync (it is bad to the point it will hit 100% usage within a day). There's a way to fix it for the i7-8700K by using files from an older driver, but people report it doesn't work on the i5-8400, and I'd be wary of the other i5-8xxx and i3-8xxx CPUs for the same reason. I don't even know if i7-8700 non-K is compatible. 3rd-7th gen Intel CPUs aren't a big deal since you just need to have a good driver version installed. 8th gen doesn't have that luxury since it is too new and all the official drivers have the bug.
     
  11. Swinub

    Swinub n3wb

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    Sorry meant 8700, not 8400. 8400 is only 6 threads, 8700 is 12 threads, like Ryzen 2600.

    Looking at Amazon Canada for prices, I usually get my PC stuff from there (relativly competitive pricing, and most importantly hassle-free returns if I have issues).
     
  12. Swinub

    Swinub n3wb

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    Wow, thank you I did not know this.

    So assuming I go Intel (not sure I will yet), which generations are "safest", or not affected by this bug? Should I be going 6xxx series?
     
  13. Swinub

    Swinub n3wb

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    I confirm if I save in Blue Iris format, it works. But why doesn't the other, more standard formats work? Tried mp4, AVI. Played in VLC, nothing.


    If I need to provide footage due to a legal matter that should arise, I would like to have a standard format, not something proprietary. And I anticipate needed to do that at soom point (cameras going up due to recurring trespassing from neighbors).
     
  14. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    You may need to install a codec pack on the BI server for it to handle the standard formats properly.
     
  15. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    All Intel CPU generations with quick sync can be affected by the bug, or not, depending on driver version.

    Memory Leak: Quick Sync (Hardware Acceleration) | IP Cam Talk

    8th gen is the only one without a good driver version for some CPUs, but i7-8700K is fine if you follow the instructions on the page above, and I imagine i7-8700 is okay too but I can't personally verify that.
     
  16. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    you can and should record to BVR as noted. You can then export the clip to mp4 or avi when you need to.
     
  17. therealdeal74

    therealdeal74 n3wb

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    AMD has the fastest integrated graphics with the Ryzen 5 APU 2400G. Would be interesting to see if this can be optimized for BI and how it compares because AMD's integrated graphics performance is on average 2-3x faster than Intel currently.
     
  18. bp2008

    bp2008 Staff Member

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    The speed of a graphics processor is basically irrelevant to Blue Iris. The GPU just happens to be where each vendor puts their fixed-function media decoding/encoding hardware. Intel calls theirs Quick Sync, AMD calls theirs VCE. Nvidia calls their's NVENC I think. I don't know which of them is best, but at this point it is irrelevant because Blue Iris only supports Quick Sync and indeed the Quick Sync situation has only gotten worse in the last couple years thanks to Intel's driver bugs. That's got to leave a sour taste for Quick Sync in the mouth of the BI developer if you know what I mean.
     
  19. nymphaeles

    nymphaeles Getting the hang of it

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    I have been using a Ryzen 7 1700, not-overclocked, recording full time on 10 cameras in the last 6 months. The average CPU is ~20-30%. I would assume that the second gen Ryzen will do better than mine.
    upload_2018-6-6_10-35-8.png upload_2018-6-6_10-38-12.png
     
  20. Pedro Tera

    Pedro Tera n3wb

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    @nymphaeles
    Would you mind sharing camera specs(mp, frame rate, codec) and average pc power consumption(if u have it)... Tia
     
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