Tried some boxed system but I think I need to build my own

[Sybertiger]

Howdy y'all,

Some of you may recall my intro thread I started regarding a LaView boxed system I was experimenting with. It was pretty clear that system was far from adequate based on my requirements but I didn't give up on the boxed systems so I moved onto the next boxed system which is THIS LOREX SYSTEM. It was on sale for $599.99 down from $799.99 when I bought it. It's considerably better than the LaView system I first tried out. It only came with bullet style camers and I'd rather have turret cams. Also some folks claim that Lorex NVRs only support Lorex branded cams...don't know if true or not but I don't want to be limited to Lorex if I want to buy more cameras.

Curious to know from anyone willing to take a quick glance of the Lorex system spec what might be cons of the system in your opinion.

Also, I was looking at a few threads here concerning Dahau NVRs and I wanted to find out which one specifically you'd recommend for 2018/2019. Whatever I get will need to support PTZ, IVS, varifocal cameras. I did look through the cliff notes but like to know which one you have and what you like or don't like about it. Thanks.

p.s. I'd probably get a 16 channel NVR with POE. I would assume that if I didn't mount 16 cams that some of the ports would be used to power IR flood lights.

 

[SouthernYankee]

What in detail did you not like about these systems ?

If you are not happy with box systems. I would look at going to blue Iris and use lorex cameras for a start, then add, replace with dahua starlights turret cameras If you want to do 16 cameras think about an 8th generation I7 processor.

Please read the cliff notes and other items in the wiki. The wiki is in the blue bar at the top of the page.

Read, study, plan before spending money.

 

[Sybertiger]

What in detail did you not like about these systems ?

If you are not happy with box systems. I would look at going to blue Iris and use lorex cameras for a start, then add, replace with dahua starlights turret cameras If you want to do 16 cameras think about an 8th generation I7 processor.

Please read the cliff notes and other items in the wiki. The wiki is in the blue bar at the top of the page.

Read, study, plan before spending money.

Thanks....good question....

The best thing I liked about boxed systems is the price and ease at getting them working.

For the LaView system I didn't like the user interface and felt that the UI was more in line with something you'd see in the 1990's. The dome cameras it came with I learned were completely inappropriate for outdoor use, the primary issue being at night and reflections.

For the Lorex system I feel it's a huge improvement over the LaView UI and the bullet cams are as good if not slightly better than the LaView cams. However, the Lorex cams are all bullet style and I've come to the conclusion that turret cams would be better in most areas. While the Lorex cams are decent they don't exactly "wow" me so I was thinking Dahau starlight cams would be better but until I try them I don't know for sure.

Blue Iris sounds like a great solution but I anticipate doing a lot of travelling for work (maybe away from home 4 to 6 weeks at a time) and I have concerns about reliability of a desktop used as a Blue Iris server. Specifically, in the summer time the thunderstorms are known to cause hickups in the power every now and then and if I'm 1,000 miles away I have concerns about being able to restart the system remotely. In addition, I don't know that I have time to fiddle with Blue Iris but as a electronics design engineer I feel I'm capable of dealing with it if I have time.

I'm hoping someone chimes in with some comments about their Dahau NVR to let me know what issues they've faced.

 

[SouthernYankee]

I do not travel, but I live with a lot of short power outtage, everything is on ups, this include all cametas and network items. I have had no PC failures.

The beauty of bi is that it has a top of the line web interface for remote viewing It also has a good Android, Iphone apps for remote viewing.

Blue Iris has a demo version. But the full version is only $50.00 now, a very good price for a very good application. The BI license is easily transfered between systems. So you can set it up on an old pic or laptop to try it out. Use your existing cameras. If you like it then get a good used PC and do a proper set up.

There is a lot of info in the wiki.

 

[fenderman]

Blue Iris sounds like a great solution but I anticipate doing a lot of travelling for work (maybe away from home 4 to 6 weeks at a time) and I have concerns about reliability of a desktop used as a Blue Iris server. Specifically, in the summer time the thunderstorms are known to cause hickups in the power every now and then and if I'm 1,000 miles away I have concerns about being able to restart the system remotely. In addition, I don't know that I have time to fiddle with Blue Iris but as a electronics design engineer I feel I'm capable of dealing with it if I have time.

I'm hoping someone chimes in with some comments about their Dahau NVR to let me know what issues they've faced.

You are confused. Blue iris takes no more "Fidding" than a dahua NVR to setup. Why do you think a pc would be any less reliable during thunderstorms than an NVR? Go to bios set it to auto reboot when power returns. The lorex NVR's are dahua you are just going in circles.

 

[mat200]

Howdy y'all,

Some of you may recall my intro thread I started regarding a LaView boxed system I was experimenting with. It was pretty clear that system was far from adequate based on my requirements but I didn't give up on the boxed systems so I moved onto the next boxed system which is THIS LOREX SYSTEM. It was on sale for $599.99 down from $799.99 when I bought it. I...

Thanks....good question....

The best thing I liked about boxed systems is the price and ease at getting them working.
..
I'm hoping someone chimes in with some comments about their Dahau NVR to let me know what issues they've faced.

HI Sybertiger,

FYI - that particular Lorex kit appears not to be a Dahua OEM, and we do not know the OEM of it. You may have some challenges finding deals on individual cameras for that kit.

Many other Lorex IP POE kits are Dahua OEM, however stripped of the Dahua IVS features. Lorex currently has some good deals on some of their kits right now. Their Dahua OEM products you can augment with the Dahua OEM 2MP starlight models which you can source from Andy - however the Lorex NVR's firmware is missing the IVS features - so you can not communicate those settings from the Lorex NVRs which are Dahua OEM products to the Dahua OEM starlights.

In general, you can find some nice deals on IP POE kits - however most buyers are looking at more affordable kits and thus making some significant compromises. It is harder to find kits which have exclusively turrets and harder to find kits which have nicer cameras.

There are some deals still going on after the BF-cyber week deals, and if you are willing to spend more you can still find some nice deals. The closest to Dahua OEM would be Montavue kits - iirc the still have some deals which will expire in the next 5 hours as I write this. ( they keep the IVS features in the Dahua OEM products which included them )

 

[Sybertiger]

I do not travel, but I live with a lot of short power outtage, everything is on ups, this include all cametas and network items. I have had no PC failures.

The beauty of bi is that it has a top of the line web interface for remote viewing It also has a good Android, Iphone apps for remote viewing.

Blue Iris has a demo version. But the full version is only $50.00 now, a very good price for a very good application. The BI license is easily transfered between systems. So you can set it up on an old pic or laptop to try it out. Use your existing cameras. If you like it then get a good used PC and do a proper set up.

There is a lot of info in the wiki.

I certainly agree that a UPS would be needed. If the PC has a hickup there will be no one around to reboot it. Blue Iris appears to give you the flexibility that a NVR would not.

 

[Sybertiger]

You are confused. Blue iris takes no more "Fidding" than a dahua NVR to setup. Why do you think a pc would be any less reliable during thunderstorms than an NVR? Go to bios set it to auto reboot when power returns. The lorex NVR's are dahua you are just going in circles.

I have no experience with Blue Iris which means I have no understanding of how much effort it takes to get it setup to run a similar feature set as an NVR. So far my experience with two NVRs is that you plug the cameras in and viola you've got a picture and it's recording but maybe BI is already set up with a basic config and you simply plug everything in and it does the same thing as the NVR but there's a lot more flexibility. I certainly like the what I've read about BI.

Is it fair to say that buying a Dahau NVR and separately purchasing cameras doesn't get you anything more that a boxed Lorex system which regard to feature set? I realize that hand selecting cameras is already providing an option for an improved system but as far as the NVR is it pretty much the same thing? I don't want to buy a Dahau NVR just to find out it's limited to the same thing I'm seeing with the Lorex NVR.

Much appreciate the comments....very helpful.

 

[Sybertiger]

HI Sybertiger,

FYI - that particular Lorex kit appears not to be a Dahua OEM, and we do not know the OEM of it. You may have some challenges finding deals on individual cameras for that kit.

Many other Lorex IP POE kits are Dahua OEM, however stripped of the Dahua IVS features. Lorex currently has some good deals on some of their kits right now. Their Dahua OEM products you can augment with the Dahua OEM 2MP starlight models which you can source from Andy - however the Lorex NVR's firmware is missing the IVS features - so you can not communicate those settings from the Lorex NVRs which are Dahua OEM products to the Dahua OEM starlights.

In general, you can find some nice deals on IP POE kits - however most buyers are looking at more affordable kits and thus making some significant compromises. It is harder to find kits which have exclusively turrets and harder to find kits which have nicer cameras.

There are some deals still going on after the BF-cyber week deals, and if you are willing to spend more you can still find some nice deals. The closest to Dahua OEM would be Montavue kits - iirc the still have some deals which will expire in the next 5 hours as I write this. ( they keep the IVS features in the Dahua OEM products which included them )

Thanks Mat200. You've pointed out that Lorex NVR's just don't have IVS features therefore I'm barking up the wrong tree and should look elsewhere so thanks for confirming that.

I had thought I read a thread somewhere where you had purchased a 16 channel Dahau NVR...is that correct, I haven't located that thread again and apologize if I have you confused with someone else. What kind of system do you have and what kind of cameras have you gone with if you don't mind me asking.

 

[mat200]

..
Is it fair to say that buying a Dahau NVR and separately purchasing cameras doesn't get you anything more that a boxed Lorex system which regard to feature set? ..

Hi Sybertiger,

Numerous ways to piece together a system, numerous options, ...

If you purchase Dahua OEM 2MP starlight cameras and the Dahua OEM NVR5216-16P-4KS2 from Andy they will have the Dahua IVS features.

You can also get that and more flexibility with a Blue Iris PC setup and good cameras.

You can also get that with some of the Montavue kits.

On the Hikvision OEM products - there are models which also have "IVS" features...

As I noted, numerous options and ways to build up a kit.

Up to you how you wish to do it, and what sort of compromises you wish to make based on your budget.

Best way to start imho is to pick up a nice 2MP Dahua OEM starlight varifocal from Andy and a POE switch and play with it, try different settings.

 

[fenderman]

I have no experience with Blue Iris which means I have no understanding of how much effort it takes to get it setup to run a similar feature set as an NVR. So far my experience with two NVRs is that you plug the cameras in and viola you've got a picture and it's recording but maybe BI is already set up with a basic config and you simply plug everything in and it does the same thing as the NVR but there's a lot more flexibility. I certainly like the what I've read about BI.

Is it fair to say that buying a Dahau NVR and separately purchasing cameras doesn't get you anything more that a boxed Lorex system which regard to feature set? I realize that hand selecting cameras is already providing an option for an improved system but as far as the NVR is it pretty much the same thing? I don't want to buy a Dahau NVR just to find out it's limited to the same thing I'm seeing with the Lorex NVR.

Much appreciate the comments....very helpful.

Did you buy your NVR's preconfigured? because it doesnt start recording "viola" - i guess it magically sets the schudule for you and motion/ivs regions based on some sort of smart analytic, ill have to check these new dahua NVR's out.. Regardless, I encourage you like many others to buy the dahua NVR. Then when you throw it against the wall you will appreciate blue iris more.

 

[Sybertiger]

Did you buy your NVR's preconfigured? because it doesnt start recording "viola" - i guess it magically sets the schudule for you and motion/ivs regions based on some sort of smart analytic, ill have to check these new dahua NVR's out.. Regardless, I encourage you like many others to buy the dahua NVR. Then when you throw it against the wall you will appreciate blue iris more.

I appreciate that you have taken the time to point out what is obvious to you; that is, Blue Iris is the way to go...it just wasn't obvious to me since I'm against the learning curve. Reading, asking questions and taking a look at videos on this topic is the low cost way to avoid making a potentially costly and unfulfilling decision. Thank you, I will look more into Blue Iris...but I am still curious to understand a bit more about the limitations of certain NVRs deemed as reasonably good by some on this forum.

 

[fenderman]

I appreciate that you have taken the time to point out what is obvious to you; that is, Blue Iris is the way to go...it just wasn't obvious to me since I'm against the learning curve. Reading, asking questions and taking a look at videos on this topic is the low cost way to avoid making a potentially costly and unfulfilling decision. Thank you, I will look more into Blue Iris...but I am still curious to understand a bit more about the limitations of certain NVRs deemed as reasonably good by some on this forum.

the differences are discussed in detail in many posts. But i wont waste my breath, NVR is the correct path for you.

 

[Sybertiger]

Hi Sybertiger,

Numerous ways to piece together a system, numerous options, ...

If you purchase Dahua OEM 2MP starlight cameras and the Dahua OEM NVR5216-16P-4KS2 from Andy they will have the Dahua IVS features.

You can also get that and more flexibility with a Blue Iris PC setup and good cameras.

You can also get that with some of the Montavue kits.

On the Hikvision OEM products - there are models which also have "IVS" features...

As I noted, numerous options and ways to build up a kit.

Up to you how you wish to do it, and what sort of compromises you wish to make based on your budget.

Best way to start imho is to pick up a nice 2MP Dahua OEM starlight varifocal from Andy and a POE switch and play with it, try different settings.

Since you own a Dahua NVR5216-16P-4KS2 NVR and have had time to play with it I'm curious to know what you have learned are the pros and more importantly me the limitations that wish the NVR had. Maybe it can't do something that Blue Iris can or perhaps the user interface is an issue or maybe it just isn't very efficient when it comes time to review stored video. The one thing I learned about the LaView and Lorex systems is that without IVS it would appear that trying to locate video on a certain event is not easy. I was surprised how long it would take for me to get the video segment I was looking for and this is primarily because the motion triggers were not versatile enough such that I could pinpoint the action segment quickly. That is to say that tree branches moving in the wind or flag flapping or even headlights encroaching on my motion trigger areas resulted is a lot of activity I wasn't really interested in reviewing....if that makes any sense. Anyhow...how do you like that Dahau NVR and how do you not like it?

 

[Sybertiger]

the differences are discussed in detail in many posts. But i wont waste my breath, NVR is the correct path for you.

Thank you...I appreciate it.

 

[mat200]

Since you own a Dahua NVR5216-16P-4KS2 NVR and have had time to play with it I'm curious to know what you have learned are the pros and more importantly me the limitations that wish the NVR had. Maybe it can't do something that Blue Iris can or perhaps the user interface is an issue or maybe it just isn't very efficient when it comes time to review stored video. The one thing I learned about the LaView and Lorex systems is that without IVS it would appear that trying to locate video on a certain event is not easy. I was surprised how long it would take for me to get the video segment I was looking for and this is primarily because the motion triggers were not versatile enough such that I could pinpoint the action segment quickly. That is to say that tree branches moving in the wind or flag flapping or even headlights encroaching on my motion trigger areas resulted is a lot of activity I wasn't really interested in reviewing....if that makes any sense. Anyhow...how do you like that Dahau NVR and how do you not like it?

Hi Sybertiger,

When I had to setup my system I was in a major rush due to an adjacent drug den - so much of a rush I bought Arlos at first... wasted a lot of time on that. Once I gave up on that product due to numerous faults, it took me a lot of time figure out what were the options. I finally came here due to the recommendation of others and was originally looking for a Hikvision OEM products. The Dahua OEM starlights had just came out - and as I had major night time issues ( drug den was very popular at night ) so I opted to spend more than I had originally hoped and went w/starlights.

I looked for a IP POE switch and a used i5/7 at that time, however I was not having much success finding a good deal when I needed it - which as ASAP ( if you have the time - you will eventually find a good deal, sometimes there are a lot of good used systems which have just come of lease - I think I hit a 2-3 week lull when I was looking. ).

I ordered a NVR5216-16P-4KS2 from Andy thanks to those who reviewed it here and those who recommended going 16 ports vs 8! ( THANKS everyone for that ).

It does take time to figure it out.

Clearly if you have more time than I had, and enough room in the "IT closet" ( I am running low on that ) - a nice used i5/i7 windows PC based Blue Iris system would be the most flexible solution. ( say if you want to do some of those smart home integration things with the cameras )

I still like the NVR I got, and recommend it as an option compared to the more affordable models.

One day I may setup a hybrid recording solution w/a BI system and the NVR and an external POE switch... this way if someone steals one of the recorders or if I have a failure on one - I will still have records.


BTW - La View currently ( today, Green Monday ) has a deal on an external 8-port POE switch, so you can get it and test Blue Iris out on a PC and compare it to the NVRs which you have used.

Laview PoE Switch-8 Channel - $41.24
Code "green25" for 25% off
Free shipping

PoE Switch-8 Channel
SKU LV-SW90

 

[Sybertiger]

Hi Sybertiger,

When I had to setup my system I was in a major rush due to an adjacent drug den - so much of a rush I bought Arlos at first... wasted a lot of time on that. Once I gave up on that product due to numerous faults, it took me a lot of time figure out what were the options. I finally came here due to the recommendation of others and was originally looking for a Hikvision OEM products. The Dahua OEM starlights had just came out - and as I had major night time issues ( drug den was very popular at night ) so I opted to spend more than I had originally hoped and went w/starlights.

I looked for a IP POE switch and a used i5/7 at that time, however I was not having much success finding a good deal when I needed it - which as ASAP ( if you have the time - you will eventually find a good deal, sometimes there are a lot of good used systems which have just come of lease - I think I hit a 2-3 week lull when I was looking. ).

I ordered a NVR5216-16P-4KS2 from Andy thanks to those who reviewed it here and those who recommended going 16 ports vs 8! ( THANKS everyone for that ).

It does take time to figure it out.

Clearly if you have more time than I had, and enough room in the "IT closet" ( I am running low on that ) - a nice used i5/i7 windows PC based Blue Iris system would be the most flexible solution. ( say if you want to do some of those smart home integration things with the cameras )

I still like the NVR I got, and recommend it as an option compared to the more affordable models.

One day I may setup a hybrid recording solution w/a BI system and the NVR and an external POE switch... this way if someone steals one of the recorders or if I have a failure on one - I will still have records.


BTW - La View currently ( today, Green Monday ) has a deal on an external 8-port POE switch, so you can get it and test Blue Iris out on a PC and compare it to the NVRs which you have used.

Laview PoE Switch-8 Channel - $41.24
Code "green25" for 25% off
Free shipping

PoE Switch-8 Channel
SKU LV-SW90

Thanks mat200!

You must be still building a system (LOL) because I often see a lot of posts by you pointing out good deals to everyone which tells me you are still looking at equipment. You wouldn't happen to know any good deals on a 16 channel POE switch would you?

I really appreciate reading many of your posts as it's clear that you make a lot of effort to help out the newbs. Thank you!

 

[mat200]

Thanks mat200!

You must be still building a system (LOL) because I often see a lot of posts by you pointing out good deals to everyone which tells me you are still looking at equipment. You wouldn't happen to know any good deals on a 16 channel POE switch would you?

I really appreciate reading many of your posts as it's clear that you make a lot of effort to help out the newbs. Thank you!

Hi Sybertiger,

lol - spending too much time here...

There were a number of nice deals during the BF-cyberweek period

I think a number of those have dried up.

Lorex still has deals, but iirc they really didn't seem to have deals on individual POE switches, NVRs, or many of their cameras. Mostly deals on kits.
LaView still has their 12 days of deals going on.

Nelly's has some stuff in their garage sale section - though iirc they do charge on shipping on those.

Looks like Montavue still has a deal going on for a number of their specials, in particular you may want to compare their 16 port switch with your other options: ( I think this is a Dahua OEM product )
Montavue 16 Port/Channel Hi-PoE Gigabit Managed Switch 240W | Montavue

 

[Sybertiger]

Hi Sybertiger,

lol - spending too much time here...

There were a number of nice deals during the BF-cyberweek period

I think a number of those have dried up.

Lorex still has deals, but iirc they really didn't seem to have deals on individual POE switches, NVRs, or many of their cameras. Mostly deals on kits.
LaView still has their 12 days of deals going on.

Nelly's has some stuff in their garage sale section - though iirc they do charge on shipping on those.

Looks like Montavue still has a deal going on for a number of their specials, in particular you may want to compare their 16 port switch with your other options: ( I think this is a Dahua OEM product )
Montavue 16 Port/Channel Hi-PoE Gigabit Managed Switch 240W | Montavue

Okay, thanks! I just might go ahead and order that 8 channel POE switch.

 

[looney2ns]

On a real computer, not your phone study the > cliff notes.
I have reviewed two nvrs, but I've been using BI for almost two years now, and Blue Iris is head and shoulders above any nvr hands down.
The learning curve is the same, Blue Iris motion detection and it's Mobile app are the cats meow.
Purchase a refurbed Dell optiplex with a I7-4750 from Ebay, you then have a very small and energy efficient system.
Properly set up, it is every bit as reliable as is any NVR.
Review-Dahua Starlight IPC-HDW5231R-ZE 800 meter capable ePOE
If no audio is needed, then this: Review-Dahua IPC-HDW2231RP-ZS Starlight Camera-Varifocal
Choosing Hardware for Blue Iris | IP Cam Talk
https://www.amazon.com/IPCamPower-Network-Additional-Designed-Cameras/dp/B07BVVWYHN/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1544488682&sr=8-4&keywords=ipcampower+poe+switch