Flock installed LPR's without permits and has now been banned from operating in two states

[jd415]

An AI license plate surveillance startup installed hundreds of cameras without permission

Flock installed its surveillance cameras without permits, and has now been banned from operating in two states

qz.com

 

[TonyR]

An AI license plate surveillance startup installed hundreds of cameras without permission

Flock installed its surveillance cameras without permits, and has now been banned from operating in two states

qz.com

Excerpt:

In June of 2022, an Illinois DOT official in contact with Flock representatives told the company it had many repeated, error-filled permit applications for camera installations. A Flock representative gave the IDOT official a thinly-veiled threat that if they didn’t fast-track the process, Flock would send “about 30 different police chiefs” to their office to talk to them about it.​

​

Now that's ballsy. The State of Illinois needs to take them to court in no uncertain terms and seek highly punitive damages, financially of course. And if there are, in fact, "police chiefs" ready to storm their office (which I doubt) they also need to be reminded just who they work for.

 

[samplenhold]

It never stated which two states banned them.

 

[Ri22o]

I am seeing these things all over now.

 

[steve0805]

We have one in our neighborhood. We've had 3 incidents and the Flock camera has failed to capture the license plate each time. The most recent time, the camera cable had been cut more than a week prior and no one noticed.

Our Flock camera is mounted on a 6 foot pole. They mounted a large Flock Safety sign under the camera that we removed, but they're still very obvious and very easy to disable.

From looking at this forum, we could implement a more capable system than Flock for less than half the annual cost.

 

[wittaj]

WOW - I would be asking for a serious credit back. How could they not have noticed?

Generally Flock costs $650 per camera for installation and $2,500 per camera annually.

From what I have seen and from talking to police officers, our captures with the less than $260 per camera 5241-Z12E and the 5442-ZE and Z4E are of better quality than the Flock. And even more so on the 3M printed plates that many states are going to.

 

[samplenhold]

the camera cable had been cut more than a week prior and no one noticed.

Wow, no one noticed? Whoever did that did it to cover their crimes they were going to commit. With no cam covering the Flock cam, one will never know who did it.

At minimum, the cable should be armored. Really should be inside the pole and directly from the inside of the pole to the inside of the cam with no exposed cable at all.

 

[steve0805]

WOW - I would be asking for a serious credit back. How could they not have noticed?

Generally Flock costs $250 per camera for installation and $2,500 per camera annually.

From what I have seen and from talking to police officers, our captures with the less than $260 per camera 5241-Z12E and the 5442-ZE and Z4E are of better quality than the Flock. And even more so on the 3M printed plates that many states are going to.

We pay $1500 since we're grandfathered in. But clearly Flock isn't actually doing any work for the money.

My neighbor just OK'd mounting a camera on their fascia where I can bridge it into my wifi. We live on a cul-de-sac so this would point straight up the street about 100' from where the street widens from 26' wide.

A 40-50mm focal length should give us 15-19 feet of horizontal which I think is enough to see plates both directions and still give us >100 pixels of resolution for the plate . Based on this, the 5241-Z12E seems ideal.

Does this seem reasonable to you? Are there issues capturing plates at night (using IR) when the headlights are pointing straight at the camera?

 

[duplo]

Flock beats physics with AI.

 

[wittaj]

We pay $1500 since we're grandfathered in. But clearly Flock isn't actually doing any work for the money.

My neighbor just OK'd mounting a camera on their fascia where I can bridge it into my wifi. We live on a cul-de-sac so this would point straight up the street about 100' from where the street widens from 26' wide.

A 40-50mm focal length should give us 15-19 feet of horizontal which I think is enough to see plates both directions and still give us >100 pixels of resolution for the plate . Based on this, the 5241-Z12E seems ideal.

Does this seem reasonable to you? Are there issues capturing plates at night (using IR) when the headlights are pointing straight at the camera?

The Z12E would be the one.

At the shutter speeds we run the headlights are not an issue.

If they are, you run HLC (I refer to it is Head Light Compensation lol)

 

[StevenFromTexas]

Lubbock County (where Lubbock,Texas is located) has apparently installed around 80 Flock automated license plate recognition (ALPR) cameras in 2024. Nearby large cities Amarillo and Midland also have installed them. So they are going up all over Texas.

 

[jd415]

When I reached out to Flock about a year ago just to get their prices below is what they sent me.

As @wittaj mentioned $2,500 a year per camera and that's for a 2 year contract plus $650.00 for install. If you check their website they have other cameras besides ALPR including PTZ's.

 

[wittaj]

When I reached out to Flock about a year ago just to get their prices below is what they sent me.

As @wittaj mentioned $2,500 a year per camera and that's for a 2 year contract plus $650.00 for install. If you check their website they have other cameras besides ALPR including PTZ's.


View attachment 202135 View attachment 202136

How many did you buy

 

[jd415]

@wittaj ZERO, just doing some opposition research

 

[wittaj]

@wittaj ZERO, just doing some opposition research

And you opposed to buying at those prices LOL.

Almost makes me wanna set up a system and sell it...almost LOL

 

[jd415]

@wittaj seriously! I thought of that too!

When I post my LPR pics to Nextdoor and local crime Facebook groups everyone is asking where they can get one. I heard Ring was looking into ALPR years ago, they are probably still in the testing phase or almost done.

 

[steve0805]

To be fair, I don't think Flock is focused on one/two camera neighborhoods. Around here, they seems to be cutting deals with cities for a few dozen cameras at a time. It makes sense. The cost of selling/supporting this is much lower. Plus, Flock's "technology" (solar power, cellular connectivity, ALPR/AI/aggregated database) seems to have much greater value for this scenario than a neighborhood where power/connectivity is easily available and the main requirement is plate capture.

I do think there is a biz opportunity for neighborhood surveillance. I don't know about selling a system, but configuring cameras optimally (acceptably?) requires a lot of knowledge/experience. It seems like there should be a market for a service that you could email in videos and get suggestions on tuning (kind of what you do for free on IPCT).

 

[steve0805]

By the way, Flock told us that they did know the camera wasn't working--They just hadn't gotten around to fixing it or telling us. We felt much better

 

[wittaj]

How long was it down? Is there anything in the contract on uptime or repair of broken camera?

 

[observant1]

I spoke with our " Director of Community Outreach" about some issues including Flock Cams and the leagal issues that prevent the installation just anywhere the g'vmt want to place them.

It's not legal in many jurisdictions.