Looking for low-light camera recommendation to use as navigation aid on a boat

I

ipcam17

n3wb
Jul 17, 2017
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I am looking for a recommendation for a low-light camera to use as an additional navigation aid while underway at night. There are several commercial options for marine low-light (and thermal) cameras, such as Sionyx, Boateye360, Black Oak Marine, and certain FLIR models, however they all cost thousands of dollars. I came across an interesting thread on a marine forum, where people are instead adapting and using low-light IP cameras for the same purpose, with decent success.

One particular model that was mentioned was the Hikivision DS-2CD2347G2-LU with a 4mm lens, which is rated for 0.0005 lux of light and based on the few pictures I've seen it seems to perform quite well in low light conditions. I am far from a camera expert, but my understanding is that the key is to find a camera with large aperture and large sensor, as well as set the camera frames per second to somewhere around 12 - 24.

Before I purchase and experiment with the above-mentioned Hikivision DS-2CD2347G2-LU, I wanted to post on this forum to see what cameras would be even better for use exclusively in low-light environment, without relying on supplemental visible light illumination (IR would be ok). A HUGE added bonus would be a direct HDMI output, though not a requirement.
 
That camera has no IR so it can only see with the onboard White LED or ambient white light, correct?

Any online sample pics for marine duty?
 
As some have mentioned before on the Forum, there is very slight lag on live IP video vs. Analog video.
but of course the tunability of an IP cam is tremendously superior to what I've seen in analog cams.
 
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The top row of Dahua cameras below (sold by Empiretech, the forum favorite seller) are white light only as well/
The 1st and 3rd are the same camera in different formats with a big 1/1.2" sensor and 4K. They pick up light extremely well.

4K Full Color Camera

Building security systems for home and business offices. Protecting customers' personal safety and property security. All the security cameras and NVRs we sell are of great quality and at affordable prices.
empiretech01.com empiretech01.com

The 5442 series is the Go-to series for most here. It has IR but no White light. 4MP great performer with the same 1/1.8 sensor as the HIK you mentioned

Smart IR Series Camera | EmpireTech

EmpireTech's Smart IR Series network camera uses advanced deep learning algorithms for enhanced accuracy in audio & video analysis with features like video metadata, smart sound detection, facial recognition, perimeter security, & people counting. Rated IP67 & IK10, it's dustproof, waterproof, &...
empiretech01.com empiretech01.com
 
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This is one of the commercial products which I am considering, but I am curious if a similar performance can be achieved with a low-light security camera instead.

 
bigredfish said:
That camera has no IR so it can only see with the onboard White LED or ambient white light, correct?

Any online sample pics for marine duty?
Click to expand...
The Hikivision model I posted earlier does't have IR, only visible while LEDs and for this application they have to be disabled. I saw a couple of still sample pictures, I can x-post them here, but I am curious how the camera would perform in motion, as still pictures don't tell the full story.
 
All cameras need light, either visible or infrared.

Any camera can make a good static image when you slow the shutter and crank up the gain, but then motion will absolutely suck.

Since you don't have the light, don't waste time looking at any camera that cannot see infrared.

And as pointed out, these cameras have a video time lag that may be an issue for your use case.
 
wittaj said:
All cameras need light, either visible or infrared.

Any camera can make a good static image when you slow the shutter and crank up the gain, but then motion will absolutely suck.

Since you don't have the light, don't waste time looking at any camera that cannot see infrared.

And as pointed out, these cameras have a video time lag that may be an issue for your use case.
Click to expand...
Interestingly enough, I don't believe that any of the commercial marine cameras can see IR - they are either low-light or thermal. I don't know enough about this topic, so I am not trying to argue, I just think it is important to keep in mind the intended use of the camera and certain level of blur might be OK too - in this particular use case I am not trying to capture an identifiable image of a face or a license plate, but rather see objects such as channel markers, other vessels, kayaks, jetties, etc.

Did you happen to see the video I posted earlier? I know it is really hard to judge the quality from a cell phone footage of a screen, but at least it gives you rough idea what I am going for.
 
So to get pretty close to the Boateye360 cam you'd be looking at the 4K-T AND 4K-X with the big 1/1.2" sensor
Though I'm not sure even they would do well enough. I'll get a video clip here in an hour off my dock without lights on. Its damn dark back there

....and the relatively new 3449 Pro
www.dahuasecurity.com

IPC-HDW3449H-AS-PV-PRO - Dahua International

IPC-HDW3449H-AS-PV-PRO
www.dahuasecurity.com www.dahuasecurity.com

They have white lights but if you have enough ambient light you dont have to turn them on.

Same restrictions as the BoatEye in that they'd need some light. It would be interesting to know what sensor he's using.

But I think the drawbacks are
  • Saltwater environment- not sure how the Dahua IP cameras would hold up
  • IP /PoE based. which not only means equipment but compatibility issues with most everything you have on the boat including displays being BNC/Analog based
  • Video Lag

I think the problem with IR is the distances involved. Even Laser IR in big PTZs is typically only 1000-2000'
 
Best I could do with my limited view here at the swamp

4K-T 1/1.2" sensor

Normally how I run it. 1/150th exposure, about 50 Gain, 16,000 bitrate, Onboard LED's on 100%
192.168.1.110_GatorCam-Color4K-T_main_20250216191335_@1.jpg

Same settings but LED's OFF
192.168.1.110_GatorCam-Color4K-T_main_20250216190559_@1.jpg

iphone un-corrected pic
IMG_8521.JPG

1/30th Exposure, 80 Gain, 80 Exp Correction, 70 brightness (any more and the noise just gets worse)
192.168.1.110_GatorCam-Color4K-T_main_20250216190427_@1.jpg
 
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shhhhhhh
 
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I think thats a large part of how they get away with it like on the Boateye video. Nothing except the boat itself is moving very fast.
That and probably a 4/3" sensor
 
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Thermal cameras can pick up navigational aids at night.
A good radar is your best bet, with a good spot light.

Commercial vessels use radar the most, unless on rivers where spotlights are the #1 priority.
 
Timokreon said:
Thermal cameras can pick up navigational aids at night.
A good radar is your best bet, with a good spot light.

Commercial vessels use radar the most, unless on rivers where spotlights are the #1 priority.
Click to expand...
I have a radar and I am very comfortable using it, the camera would be just for added situational awareness and to spot objects that aren't great radar targets...like the guy finishing from a kayak in the middle of the navigational channel without lights on :oops: Spotlights, LED bars, etc, on the other hand are a no-no.
 
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ipcam17 said:
I have a radar and I am very comfortable using it, the camera would be just for added situational awareness and to spot objects that aren't great radar targets...like the guy finishing from a kayak in the middle of the navigational channel without lights on :oops: Spotlights, LED bars, etc, on the other hand are a no-no.
Click to expand...
Then I would suggest a thermal.
Why are spotlights a no no? Every vessel has them. I've never been on any navigable waterway where spotlights aren't allowed.
 
bigredfish said:
So to get pretty close to the Boateye360 cam you'd be looking at the 4K-T AND 4K-X with the big 1/1.2" sensor
Though I'm not sure even they would do well enough. I'll get a video clip here in an hour off my dock without lights on. Its damn dark back there

Same restrictions as the BoatEye in that they'd need some light. It would be interesting to know what sensor he's using.

But I think the drawbacks are
  • Saltwater environment- not sure how the Dahua IP cameras would hold up
  • IP /PoE based. which not only means equipment but compatibility issues with most everything you have on the boat including displays being BNC/Analog based
  • Video Lag

I think the problem with IR is the distances involved. Even Laser IR in big PTZs is typically only 1000-2000'
Click to expand...

Generally speaking, would an 8MP camera with 1/1.2" sensor outperform a 4MP camera with 1/1.8" sensor ? I am not familiar with any of the brands, but I spent some time looking at the Hikivision product line these past few days and I was torn between the DS-2CD2387G2-LU 4MM and the DS-2CD2347G2-LU 4mm.

I have no idea what sensor the Boateye camera features as there aren't any specs published on their website, but there is quite a bit of information available both for the camera and the sensor for one of their competitor products made by Sionyx:

You make all valid points regarding the drawbacks, see my comments below:
  • Saltwater environment- not sure how the Dahua IP cameras would hold up - at <$200 I am not really worried, it is still significantly cheaper than the alternative products, even if I have to install a new one each season
  • IP /PoE based. which not only means equipment but compatibility issues with most everything you have on the boat including displays being BNC/Analog based - actually most modern chartplotters have network ports and are capable of supporting IP cameras. That said, I was hoping to use a tablet with a USB-C Ethernet adapter straight from the camera, while supplying the camera with 12VDC through the dedicated power input (not PoE)
  • Video Lag - definitely a concern. I am hoping that I'd be able to tune the camera in a way to minimize the lag to <1sec.
 
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Timokreon said:
Then I would suggest a thermal.
Why are spotlights a no no? Every vessel has them. I've never been on any navigable waterway where spotlights aren't allowed.
Click to expand...
Thermal is quite expensive, FLIR is the only game in town as far as I know, and they are way out of my budget.
Spotlights in my opinion are a hazard to navigation as they blind other boaters, there's nothing worse than someone killing your night vision by shining a spotlight your way because they are trying to dodge moorings and channel markers. The only thing worse than that are the giant LED light bars...
 
bigredfish said:
Best I could do with my limited view here at the swamp

4K-T 1/1.2" sensor

Normally how I run it. 1/150th exposure, about 50 Gain, 16,000 bitrate, Onboard LED's on 100%
View attachment 214709

Same settings but LED's OFF
View attachment 214710

iphone un-corrected pic
View attachment 214711

1/30th Exposure, 80 Gain, 80 Exp Correction, 70 brightness (any more and the noise just gets worse)
View attachment 214712
Click to expand...
Thank you for the pictures, it looks like there's almost no ambient light currently, or is there? If there's some moonlight or anything like that, then the 2nd and 3rd picture definitely have me concerned. The last picture looks amazing, but I am wondering how bad would the image get distorted if the camera was in motion and everything else was still.
 
ipcam17 said:
Thermal is quite expensive, FLIR is the only game in town as far as I know, and they are way out of my budget.
Spotlights in my opinion are a hazard to navigation as they blind other boaters, there's nothing worse than someone killing your night vision by shining a spotlight your way because they are trying to dodge moorings and channel markers. The only thing worse than that are the giant LED light bars...
Click to expand...
Dahua has thermal. @EMPIRETECANDY sells them, such as thermal cams

Spotlights are necessary, but perhaps recreational boaters don't need them. :shrugs:
 
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