Blue Iris will not launch

wlf311

n3wb
Oct 9, 2024
20
1
Hello all, just bought a copy of blue iris here and downloaded the software and the 64 bit update and installed. Unfortunately I can't even get blue iris to open to enter my license key. Blue iris starts and the picture displays in the center of the screen and the messages start displaying at the bottom of the picture, the last message I see is "creating window" then the picture disappears and that's as far as it gets. Running windows11 pro with latest updates.
Any suggestions and/or help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
Running nvidia p400 video card currently
 
Last edited:
It shouldn't be it, but disable the video card.

When the picture disappears, open up Task Manager and see if it shows it running in the background.

Since you are on Win11 I assume you are on a capable machine at least 8th gen, but what are the specs?
 
It shouldn't be it, but disable the video card.

When the picture disappears, open up Task Manager and see if it shows it running in the background.

Since you are on Win11 I assume you are on a capable machine at least 8th gen, but what are the specs?
Hello, Thanks for the tip. I tried that and it is definitely tied to the video system somehow, now it gets farther but severe artifacts etc. So at least I have a troubleshooting path forwards, thank you. Yes PC should be ok I9-9900, 16G ram (32G coming tomorrow), M.2 drives, Nvidia p400. (I have a P1000 coming next week just in case). I am hoping this system can run 12-16 cams. From what I have been reading 16 cams may be pushing the limit.
 
People run 50 cams on a 4th gen with no GPU just fine.




A GPU is only needed if you plan to run a lot of CodeProject. Most here do not run BI with a GPU. Most of us the cameras AI is superior.

Do not use H265 or special codec in the cameras.

Do every optimization in the wiki
 
People run 50 cams on a 4th gen with no GPU just fine.




A GPU is only needed if you plan to run a lot of CodeProject. Most here do not run BI with a GPU. Most of us the cameras AI is superior.

Do not use H265 or special codec in the cameras.

Do every optimization in the wiki
Thank you so much, I will read the recommended wiki. A quick question about substreams and frame rates. I would think the highest frame rate possible would be needed for capturing a moving license plate to possibly get a clear picture. When you select a substream, is that only for display on the screen or is that also what is used for capturing motion events and clip storage? Is the substream resolution what is captured or is the capture from the main stream. Thanks again
 
Regarding Plates:

Your thinking is wrong LOL.

Shutter speed is more important than FPS. I capture plates at 8FPS and the plate is in and out of the field of view in about a half second (so I capture 4 frames) because I am using the correct shutter speed for the task at hand.

I will take a camera at 10FPS with a properly dialed in shutter for the speed of the object I am trying to capture over 60FPS with a camera on default/auto settings all night long.

You would have to set the camera up specifically to read plates. You need the proper camera with OPTICAL zoom for the distance you are covering and the angle to get plates.

Keep in mind that this is a camera dedicated to plates and not an overview camera also. It is as much an art as it is a science. You will need two cameras minimum. For LPR we need to OPTICALLY zoom in tight to make the plate as large as possible. For most of us, all you see is the not much more than a vehicle in the entire frame. Now maybe in the right location during the day it might be able to see some other things, but not at night.

At night, we have to run a very fast shutter speed (1/2,000) and in B/W with IR and the image will be black. All you will see are head/tail lights and the plate. Some people can get away with color if they have enough street lights, but most of us cannot. Here is a representative sample of plates I get at night of vehicles traveling about 45MPH at 175 feet from my 2MP 5241-Z12E camera (that is all that is needed for plates):

1675078711764.png



See the LPR subforum for more details.


Regarding FPS

These types of cameras are not GoPro or Hollywood type cameras that offer slow-mo capabilities and other features. Some "offer" 30FPS and 60FPS to appease the general public that thinks that is what they need, but you will not find many of us here running more than 15 FPS; and movies are shot at 24 FPS, so anything above that is a waste of storage space for what these cameras are used for. If 24 FPS works for the big screen, I think 15 FPS is more than enough for phones and tablets and most monitors LOL. Many of my cameras are running at 12FPS.

Sure 30FPS can provide a smoother video but no police officer has said "wow that person really is running smooth". They want the ability to freeze frame and get a clean image. So be it if the video is a little choppy....and at 10-15FPS it won't be appreciable. My neighbor runs his at 30FPS, so the person or car goes by looking smooth, but it is a blur when trying to freeze frame it because the camera can't keep up. Meanwhile my camera at 15FPS with the proper shutter speed gets the clean shots.

We wouldn't take these cameras to an NBA game to broadcast, nor would we take the cameras they use at an NBA game to put on a house. Not all cameras are alike and the approach of "a camera is a camera" mentality will result in failure. Another example, I can watch an MLB game and they can slow it down to see the stitching on the baseball. Surveillance cams are not capable of that. You need to find a camera for the intended purpose.

Watch these, for most of us, it isn't annoying until below 10FPS






Regarding Substreams

Substreams typically reduce CPU usage by 5x to 20x and make a struggling system run great. The full quality main stream is still recorded and available when you need it.

When you configure a camera in Blue Iris to use a sub stream, Blue Iris will pull video from both the "main" and "sub" streams. Each stream is used for different purposes.

The main stream is used for:
  • direct-to-disc recording
  • single-camera live viewing and recording playback
  • audio

The sub stream is used for everything else:
  • multiple-camera viewing
  • motion detection
  • alert snapshots
  • etc.

The NOOB always comes here worried about video quality and missing something using substreams.

We are a bunch of security sensitive people and if substreams resulted in missing a key action, we wouldn't be using it.

That is the beauty of the substreams, you can do whatever you want.

Record continuous and it will record mainstream 24/7 but use the substreams for the CPU intensive features.

Record continuous plus triggers and it will record substream until a trigger and then go to mainstream - you can set the triggers pretty low so that it records for anything.

Record continuous plus alerts and it will record substream until an alert and then go to mainstream - with this one you run the risk of missing a trigger than wasn't elevated to alert level.

But if you do anything other than continuous it will result in disc space savings.

The biggest problem people make is trying to do too much with one camera. Using a 2.8mm fixed lens to try to IDENTIFY or capture motion at 50 feet is the wrong camera. Which leads to:


Camera Selection

You need to get the correct camera for the area trying to be covered. A wide angle 2.8mm to IDENTIFY someone 40 feet away is the wrong camera regardless of how good the camera is. A 2.8mm camera to IDENTIFY someone within 10 feet is a good choice OR it is an overview camera to see something happened but not be able to identify who.

One camera cannot be the be all, see all. Each one is selected for covering a specific area. Most of us here have different brands and types, from fixed cams, to varifocals, to PTZs, each one selected for it's primary purpose and to utilize the strength of that particular camera.

See this thread for the commonly recommended cameras (along with Amazon links) based on distance to IDENTIFY that represent the overall best value in terms of price and performance day and night.

The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection
 
Regarding Plates:

Your thinking is wrong LOL.

Shutter speed is more important than FPS. I capture plates at 8FPS and the plate is in and out of the field of view in about a half second (so I capture 4 frames) because I am using the correct shutter speed for the task at hand.

I will take a camera at 10FPS with a properly dialed in shutter for the speed of the object I am trying to capture over 60FPS with a camera on default/auto settings all night long.

You would have to set the camera up specifically to read plates. You need the proper camera with OPTICAL zoom for the distance you are covering and the angle to get plates.

Keep in mind that this is a camera dedicated to plates and not an overview camera also. It is as much an art as it is a science. You will need two cameras minimum. For LPR we need to OPTICALLY zoom in tight to make the plate as large as possible. For most of us, all you see is the not much more than a vehicle in the entire frame. Now maybe in the right location during the day it might be able to see some other things, but not at night.

At night, we have to run a very fast shutter speed (1/2,000) and in B/W with IR and the image will be black. All you will see are head/tail lights and the plate. Some people can get away with color if they have enough street lights, but most of us cannot. Here is a representative sample of plates I get at night of vehicles traveling about 45MPH at 175 feet from my 2MP 5241-Z12E camera (that is all that is needed for plates):

1675078711764.png



See the LPR subforum for more details.


Regarding FPS

These types of cameras are not GoPro or Hollywood type cameras that offer slow-mo capabilities and other features. Some "offer" 30FPS and 60FPS to appease the general public that thinks that is what they need, but you will not find many of us here running more than 15 FPS; and movies are shot at 24 FPS, so anything above that is a waste of storage space for what these cameras are used for. If 24 FPS works for the big screen, I think 15 FPS is more than enough for phones and tablets and most monitors LOL. Many of my cameras are running at 12FPS.

Sure 30FPS can provide a smoother video but no police officer has said "wow that person really is running smooth". They want the ability to freeze frame and get a clean image. So be it if the video is a little choppy....and at 10-15FPS it won't be appreciable. My neighbor runs his at 30FPS, so the person or car goes by looking smooth, but it is a blur when trying to freeze frame it because the camera can't keep up. Meanwhile my camera at 15FPS with the proper shutter speed gets the clean shots.

We wouldn't take these cameras to an NBA game to broadcast, nor would we take the cameras they use at an NBA game to put on a house. Not all cameras are alike and the approach of "a camera is a camera" mentality will result in failure. Another example, I can watch an MLB game and they can slow it down to see the stitching on the baseball. Surveillance cams are not capable of that. You need to find a camera for the intended purpose.

Watch these, for most of us, it isn't annoying until below 10FPS






Regarding Substreams

Substreams typically reduce CPU usage by 5x to 20x and make a struggling system run great. The full quality main stream is still recorded and available when you need it.

When you configure a camera in Blue Iris to use a sub stream, Blue Iris will pull video from both the "main" and "sub" streams. Each stream is used for different purposes.

The main stream is used for:
  • direct-to-disc recording
  • single-camera live viewing and recording playback
  • audio

The sub stream is used for everything else:
  • multiple-camera viewing
  • motion detection
  • alert snapshots
  • etc.

The NOOB always comes here worried about video quality and missing something using substreams.

We are a bunch of security sensitive people and if substreams resulted in missing a key action, we wouldn't be using it.

That is the beauty of the substreams, you can do whatever you want.

Record continuous and it will record mainstream 24/7 but use the substreams for the CPU intensive features.

Record continuous plus triggers and it will record substream until a trigger and then go to mainstream - you can set the triggers pretty low so that it records for anything.

Record continuous plus alerts and it will record substream until an alert and then go to mainstream - with this one you run the risk of missing a trigger than wasn't elevated to alert level.

But if you do anything other than continuous it will result in disc space savings.

The biggest problem people make is trying to do too much with one camera. Using a 2.8mm fixed lens to try to IDENTIFY or capture motion at 50 feet is the wrong camera. Which leads to:


Camera Selection

You need to get the correct camera for the area trying to be covered. A wide angle 2.8mm to IDENTIFY someone 40 feet away is the wrong camera regardless of how good the camera is. A 2.8mm camera to IDENTIFY someone within 10 feet is a good choice OR it is an overview camera to see something happened but not be able to identify who.

One camera cannot be the be all, see all. Each one is selected for covering a specific area. Most of us here have different brands and types, from fixed cams, to varifocals, to PTZs, each one selected for it's primary purpose and to utilize the strength of that particular camera.

See this thread for the commonly recommended cameras (along with Amazon links) based on distance to IDENTIFY that represent the overall best value in terms of price and performance day and night.

The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection

Wow, I have a lot to learn and lots of reading to do. Guess I wasted money getting a better video card. My dedicated plate camera has optical zoom it is a IP4M-1053E
 

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Thank you, just this bit of information you gave has taught me more the the reading I have done in the last few days. It sounds like I need to set BI as a service at some point as well. No wonder my PC was struggling previously when I tried this last time. I had 9 cameras running a 30fps and I was just minimizing BI, not using direct to disk etc. That is how ended up with an I9 processor, that was the best I could get at the time and made a custom PC just for this. LoL. the basic used I5 HP prodesk PCs I bought would have probably been ok.
 
Not using direct to disc is a big CPU user. Direct to disk and substreams are a must.

Can you return the GPU's?

Around the time AI was introduced in BI, many here had their system become unstable with hardware acceleration (Quick Sync) on (even if not using DeepStack or CodeProject). Some have also been fine. I started to see errors when I was using hardware acceleration several updates into when AI was added.

This hits everyone at a different point. Some had their system go wonky immediately, some it was after a specific update, and some still don't have a problem, but the trend is showing running hardware acceleration will result in a problem at some point.

However, with substreams being introduced, the CPU% needed to offload video to a GPU (internal or external) is more than the CPU% savings seen by offloading to a GPU. Especially after about 12 cameras, the CPU goes up by using hardware acceleration. The wiki points this out as well.

My CPU % went down by not using hardware acceleration.

Here is a recent thread where someone turned off hardware acceleration based on my post and their CPU dropped 10-15% and BI became stable.

A GPU is only needed if you plan to do a lot of CodeProject, which would be insane as most find the AI in the cameras to be more than enough.

But if you use HA, use plain intel and not the variants.


Some still don't have a problem, but eventually it may result in a problem.

Here is a sampling of recent threads that turning off HA fixed the issues they were having....

No hardware acceleration with subs?


Hardware decoding just increases GPU usage?


Can't enable HA on one camera + high Bitrate


The camera you selected for plate reading is the wrong choice. They have used that model for other cameras, but I am assuming it is the PTZ with up to 12mm focal length? Plus it is a camera using a sensor designed for 720P, so it will perform poorly at night.

PTZs in general are a bad choice for plate reading due to the post above about how the image will be black at night due to the fast shutter speed.

The faster the shutter, the more light that is needed.

We take advantage of the highly reflective plates to offset the higher shutter speed. That is why we see the headlights and plates and not much else.

PTZs have the problem of not being able to set a focus number.

With a fixed cam, you can set the focus. So say the range is 0-1200 and in focus at your distance is 643, well you set the camera to manual focus and set it to that number and it stays at that focus all night.

A PTZ doesn't have that ability and many are in a autofocus mode all the time. So you either have to set the camera to the night setting an hour before sunset and hope it finds something to focus on and holds that focus all night.

Because if the image is all black, the camera has nothing to focus on and will be hunting all night changing the focus trying to see something.

So if you want to pan the ptz around at night, it will then never be able to capture plates without having something to focus on.

And if your camera is the 12mm version, it will struggle to even be able to read a plate beyond 30ish feet.

Some with enough light or some of the better PTZs that let in more light and can see something to focus on can work, but I think you will have more problems than successes with this camera choice.

To capture plates, it is all about angle, distance, and the correct focal length camera.

Most of us use this camera for LPR because it is good up to 200ish feet.

 
As an Amazon Associate IPCamTalk earns from qualifying purchases.
Ok, you sold me. I can use my existing cam elsewhere. Maybe I can return the video card and make up most of the cost. LoL. Thanks again.
 
Not using direct to disc is a big CPU user. Direct to disk and substreams are a must.

Can you return the GPU's?

Around the time AI was introduced in BI, many here had their system become unstable with hardware acceleration (Quick Sync) on (even if not using DeepStack or CodeProject). Some have also been fine. I started to see errors when I was using hardware acceleration several updates into when AI was added.

This hits everyone at a different point. Some had their system go wonky immediately, some it was after a specific update, and some still don't have a problem, but the trend is showing running hardware acceleration will result in a problem at some point.

However, with substreams being introduced, the CPU% needed to offload video to a GPU (internal or external) is more than the CPU% savings seen by offloading to a GPU. Especially after about 12 cameras, the CPU goes up by using hardware acceleration. The wiki points this out as well.

My CPU % went down by not using hardware acceleration.

Here is a recent thread where someone turned off hardware acceleration based on my post and their CPU dropped 10-15% and BI became stable.

A GPU is only needed if you plan to do a lot of CodeProject, which would be insane as most find the AI in the cameras to be more than enough.

But if you use HA, use plain intel and not the variants.


Some still don't have a problem, but eventually it may result in a problem.

Here is a sampling of recent threads that turning off HA fixed the issues they were having....

No hardware acceleration with subs?


Hardware decoding just increases GPU usage?


Can't enable HA on one camera + high Bitrate


The camera you selected for plate reading is the wrong choice. They have used that model for other cameras, but I am assuming it is the PTZ with up to 12mm focal length? Plus it is a camera using a sensor designed for 720P, so it will perform poorly at night.

PTZs in general are a bad choice for plate reading due to the post above about how the image will be black at night due to the fast shutter speed.

The faster the shutter, the more light that is needed.

We take advantage of the highly reflective plates to offset the higher shutter speed. That is why we see the headlights and plates and not much else.

PTZs have the problem of not being able to set a focus number.

With a fixed cam, you can set the focus. So say the range is 0-1200 and in focus at your distance is 643, well you set the camera to manual focus and set it to that number and it stays at that focus all night.

A PTZ doesn't have that ability and many are in a autofocus mode all the time. So you either have to set the camera to the night setting an hour before sunset and hope it finds something to focus on and holds that focus all night.

Because if the image is all black, the camera has nothing to focus on and will be hunting all night changing the focus trying to see something.

So if you want to pan the ptz around at night, it will then never be able to capture plates without having something to focus on.

And if your camera is the 12mm version, it will struggle to even be able to read a plate beyond 30ish feet.

Some with enough light or some of the better PTZs that let in more light and can see something to focus on can work, but I think you will have more problems than successes with this camera choice.

To capture plates, it is all about angle, distance, and the correct focal length camera.

Most of us use this camera for LPR because it is good up to 200ish feet.

The camera should be here today, I hope to get the PC redone and ready tomorrow. Thank you for the guidance.
 
As an Amazon Associate IPCamTalk earns from qualifying purchases.
I purchased from Amazon, I saw the note about it above. Should I have purchased directly from here? Sorry, I hope you get some type of compensation from my purchase.