Dumb member need help understanding

Basjke

Getting the hang of it
Jan 5, 2017
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I own this recorder Dahua XVR5108HS-5M-I3.

My cameras are 6 x dh-hac-hfw2221rp-z-ire6 set at H264 1080P 25fps - 1 x HAC-HFW2120RP-Z set at h264 720p x 25fps and 1 x DH-HAC-HFW1200RP-Z-IRE6 set at H264 1080p 25fps.

They are connected over LAN cable through balun.

My HDD is a WD Purple 4TB.

If I set all 8 cameras at 24/7 recording, how many days can I store before it start over writing, or what would be the ideal setting for using maximum storage period with acceptable recording quality?

Thanks in advance
 
So there are a lot of things going on here that I don't understand why.. First why are you only wanting to use h.264? Next need to know what you have your Snapshots setup for. If they are off 8 cameras at them settings without knowing what you have your Bit Rate set for I would guess about 12 days Why are you not setting your cameras up for H.265 using a DVR all of my DVRs are setup to run H.265 only system that I can run all my cameras at that seeing my IP cameras either older or get little cranky if I try to do so. i mean I have some newer cameras that are H.265 but normally my IP cameras from Dahua or Dahua OEMs are running H.264h for best results and works well with Bi as well for me. Sure have a couple in Bi that are on H.265 but when I updated to quality DVRs and I do own a OEM 5108-I3 as well as older OEM 7108-Ai and 8M16-H5 all are running cameras at H.265 even my very old PTZs..

What are you in need of 24/7 recording? 4tb 8 cameras that are not on at least h.264h will eat up your HDD in short order.. I use IVS and SMD even though I am normally opposed to using SMD.. On my older 8mp DVR that uses a mix of 8mp and 5mp cameras I record only major channels full time on the sub channel.. I have changed all my Sub Channels to run at D1 format 704x480 and the feed is enough for my needs. I also changed all my Main to 22fps and my subs to 18 on the recorded channels of all DVRs that support them the rest are even less for the higher MP cameras seeing the best 7108-Ai does only 15fps and the 5108 only does 7.. Anyway Only able to get 12 on the 5mp even in the Sub channels but the footage looks good enough mainly only recording full time to cover anything that I might miss and for Audio that might happen before an event happens.. So looking at my 8ch that is running full time recording on D1 of the sub channel I get around 85 days. that again is H.265 and 12fps with a bit rate of 512. It would normally be higher but I have some other recordings in there as well on main channel for a couple of the cameras. Last year when I only did full time no events it was about 96 days before it would start to over write on my WD Purple 4tb..
 
@Revo2Maxx Thanks for your reply, but the reason for my post is actually the questions you ask, and to which I don't have the answers. Thought that was obvious from the thread title :)

I'm open to your suggestions of what would be the optimal settings to keep about 3 weeks of recording, which I think will be sufficient as I will be rarely away for more than 2 weeks.

My cameras are 7x 2MP and 1 x 1.4MP. I have no idea about the snapshot settings, and don't even know what the purpose of those is, since I'm looking for advice from here before I start playing with all that. All my cameras are outdoor, directed at entrance points.
My device is what I have posted in the OP, and that is what I will use, so not gonna buy a DVR.
 
Under your Storage tab do you have a Rec Estimate?
 
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Your Recorder is a DVR... As I said I have a 5108-i3 as well..

So here is what I would do, Change the format to H.265, Set the Bit Rate to 2048 if it was higher then that if lower that is fine but 2048 I would say is max, Then go to Main Menu, Then Storage, then click on the Schedule for Snap Shot. I would just to be safe. first off change the Full time Schedule to None.. However then you will click on the left side Record, Then Snapshot turn them off.. all of them then Schedule don't matter but I like to do things a way.. Then you can leave your system setup scheduled to record full time on Main and with snapshots off you should get about 22.5 days of full time on full main channel.. That is over your 21 days aka 3 weeks..
 
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all you can do is record to the 4TB for awhile and then check the playback calendar in a couple weeks. you can probably get about 15-20 days out of it...maybe more.
As I recall( vaguely) my Nightowl 16 DVR was running about 9 cameras, with a 4TB WD and we were getting 28-30 days.
 
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Your Recorder is a DVR... As I said I have a 5108-i3 as well..

So here is what I would do, Change the format to H.265, Set the Bit Rate to 2048 if it was higher then that if lower that is fine but 2048 I would say is max, Then go to Main Menu, Then Storage, then click on the Schedule for Snap Shot. I would just to be safe. first off change the Full time Schedule to None.. However then you will click on the left side Record, Then Snapshot turn them off.. all of them then Schedule don't matter but I like to do things a way.. Then you can leave your system setup scheduled to record full time on Main and with snapshots off you should get about 22.5 days of full time on full main channel.. That is over your 21 days aka 3 weeks..

Thanks for your detailed instructions, Later today I will get into it, and if I experience issues I will take screenshots.
 
Here is a visual that might aid in making the changes.. In the first picture I have it numbered..
In picture 1
0 Not listed. Main Menu
1 Storage
2 Schedule
3 Click the Snapshot Icon
4 Remove if it is Green the full time Snapshot for all days
5 Copy and then pick all
6 Not on list. Press the Save/Apply

Picture 2 should be the end result for all channels. By the way just this action should make it so the snapshots don't record. But I want to remove from Schedule so no accidents can happen. Double Protection.

Picture 3 click under Storage, Record. Then for Snapshots if enabled turn them all off and save.
Screenshot (3799).png
Screenshot (3800).pngScreenshot (3801).png
 
Here is a visual that might aid in making the changes.. In the first picture I have it numbered..
In picture 1
0 Not listed. Main Menu
1 Storage
2 Schedule
3 Click the Snapshot Icon
4 Remove if it is Green the full time Snapshot for all days
5 Copy and then pick all
6 Not on list. Press the Save/Apply

Picture 2 should be the end result for all channels. By the way just this action should make it so the snapshots don't record. But I want to remove from Schedule so no accidents can happen. Double Protection.

Picture 3 click under Storage, Record. Then for Snapshots if enabled turn them all off and save.
View attachment 209757
View attachment 209758View attachment 209759

Thanks Sir, I couldn't imagine getting any better help than this
 
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Keep in mind many/most of us here do not run H265.

H265 in theory provides more storage as it compresses differently, but part of that compression means it "macro blocks" (technically coding tree units) big areas of the image that it thinks isn't moving. That can be problematic for digital zooming with H265.

However, it also takes more processing power of the already small CPU in the camera and that can be problematic if someone is maxing out the camera in other areas like FPS and then it stutters.

Further some cameras can handle H265 better than others, even if the camera "claims" to support it.

In theory it is supposed to need 30% less storage than H264, but most of us have found it isn't that much. My savings were less than few minutes per day. And to my eye and others that I showed clips to and just said do you like video 1 or video 2 better, everyone thought the H264 provided a better image.

The left image is H264, so all the blocks are the same size corresponding to the resolution of the camera. H265 takes areas that it doesn't think has motion and makes them into bigger blocks and in doing so lessens the resolution in those larger blocks yet increases the camera CPU demand to develop these larger blocks.

1667974399793.png




In theory H265 is supposed to need half the bitrate because of the macroblocking. But if there is a lot of motion in the image, then it becomes a pixelated mess. The only way to get around that is a higher bitrate. But if you need to run the same bitrate for H265 as you do H264, then the storage savings is essentially zero.


In my testing I have one camera that sees a parked car in front of my house. H265 sees that the car isn't moving, so it macroblocks the whole car and surrounding area. Then the car owner walked up to the car and got in and the motion is missed because of the macroblock being so large. Or if it catches it, because the bitrate is low, it is a pixelated mess during the critical capture point and by the time H265 adjusts to there is now motion, the ideal capture is missed.

In my case, the car is clear and defined in H264, but is blurry and soft edges in H265.

Digital zooming is never really good and not something we recommend, but you stand a better chance of some digital zoom with H264 rather than a large macroblocked H265. I can digital zoom on my overview camera and kinda make out the address number of the house across the street with H264, but not a chance with H265 as it macroblocked his whole house.

H265 is one of those theory things that sounds good, but reality use is much different.

Some people have a field of view or goals that allow H265 to be sufficient for their needs.

As always, YMMV.


Regarding amount of storage, there is this calculator, but that is only part of the equation.



While having lots of days/months sounds great, the reality of it is unless it was something catastrophic (which you would have known about sooner anyway), most are not going to start scrubbing video for something that may have happened a few weeks or months ago.

By spending time to dial in the alerts and a frequent peek at what is going on, you would have noticed something around your property within days. I literally every morning in under 30 seconds can scrub what happened the night before and see if anything happened I need to look at further. This is for things off my property. I will know immediately with an alert of a person or car is on my property.

If a neighbor comes up to me and says "sometime around 2 weeks ago someone backed into my car, can you see if you caught it?" You will find that even with the best scrubbing this is a monumental task. Unless they can narrow down the day/time window or you can visually see the damage on your video that you can start looking at the same time everyday until you see the damage and then do an iterative process to narrow down when it was, most of us are not going to scour it.

There are some other considerations or law reasons for businesses that may need longer, but for the average homeowner, the reality that we are going to scrub thru months of video is slim. I would rather have higher quality and 24/7 for a shorter duration than longer duration but lower quality and potentially missed video. But that doesn't mean I run continuous mainstream either. I run substream until triggered and then mainstream. Anything of interest I export out.

Quality is a function of bitrate and resolution. The lower the two, the more storage you can get. But too low and then the quality suffers.

As always YMMV.
 
Where would I enable that setting? Triggered, I assume you enable movement. How accurate is that function?

Your NVR may or may not be able to do that. You would have to see if it allows substream recording and if it does, check it and then go outside and trigger the camera and see if it then switches to mainstream recording during the trigger.
 
His Recorder is an DVR not a NVR and that is only reason I said to use H.265.. My NVRs are setup with a Mix of devices between the H.265 and h.264h but I am normally opposed to H.265 in IP cameras because the cameras can be a pain at times.. Had it been a NVR with IP cameras I would have said they needed a larger HDD.. Trying to help get the goal they wanted with what they had.. 3 weeks on a 4tb for 8 cameras.
 
Then in my first reply when I said I record in Sub and Event in Main. I did cover that and what I do. If you wanted to do that. Then looking at the IMAGES where I said to click on the Snapshots in Schedule. You keep in the Recording.. Remove all the full time recoding for all days all cameras.. Then on the picture of the record tab on left. In the Sub Channel section move them all to Manual. You DVR will record all sub channels full time. Then you will need to setup your EVENTS either motion or IVS and those are the events that will record full Main channel..

I know it is an XVR, However right now it is a DVR unless he enabled the XVR function.. Then all the horse power in the DVR is running in DVR mode if not enabled as XVR.. XVR is just a dumb gimmick name like some of the special chip names for capturing clearer night images.. While there is Hardware and software that can do it. If not enabled then it is just a camera or DVR or NVR special names just make the Prices go up lol..
 
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Then in my first reply when I said I record in Sub and Event in Main. I did cover that and what I do. If you wanted to do that. Then looking at the IMAGES where I said to click on the Snapshots in Schedule. You keep in the Recording.. Remove all the full time recoding for all days all cameras.. Then on the picture of the record tab on left. In the Sub Channel section move them all to Manual. You DVR will record all sub channels full time. Then you will need to setup your EVENTS either motion or IVS and those are the events that will record full Main channel..

I know it is an XVR, However right now it is a DVR unless he enabled the XVR function.. Then all the horse power in the DVR is running in DVR mode if not enabled as XVR.. XVR is just a dumb gimmick name like some of the special chip names for capturing clearer night images.. While there is Hardware and software that can do it. If not enabled then it is just a camera or DVR or NVR special names just make the Prices go up lol..
That's a bit like me saying I have a car and I can change it to a motorbike.
It's a XVR.
Think it wise to get the OP to acquire the largest hard drive for the XVR that it can accommodate. Or upgrade the XVR to at least a 2 hard drive bay unit.
 
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That's a bit like me saying I have a car and I can change it to a motorbike.
It's a XVR.
Think it wise to get the OP to acquire the largest hard drive the XVR can accommodate. Or upgrade the XVR to at least a 2 hard drive bay unit.
Sorry don't get it..
An XVR is like a car that can turn into a convertible. Most of the time, it's just a regular car (DVR) that works with regular things like analog cameras. But if you want it to be special and use it with IP cameras, you take the top off (enable the IP channels).
Just like how turning a car into a convertible might make it a little slower or harder to use because it has to work differently, an XVR has to work harder when it uses IP cameras. So, it’s usually best to keep it as a regular car (DVR) unless you really need that convertible feature
 
Going through the specs of my dh-hac-hfw2221rp-z-ire6 cameras, I don't see any mention of IVS, so my cameras support it, or is this a function of the XVR?
 
Those are HDCVI analog cameras. They dont have IVS
Your XVR "might" have it and usually limited to I believe 4 rules

Regardless, my opinion on your original question is to use h.264.h, bitrate no less than 4096, 15FPS, record full time (green) PLUS motion and or IVS, check and record snapshots, and see what you get as far acceptable coverage and storage. I'll guess 14-21 days

If however your sole focus is on storage and not image quality or capturing the many things that may happen before or after your motion event gets recorded (which wont always be as precise as you imagine) you may want to consider a simple trail cam instead of an NVR and cameras.
 
The XVR is a DVR & NVR, hence it being labelled an XVR. Half breed to work with analogue CVI, etc cams and also IP cameras.
Amcrest 8ch Xvr was only allowed ( by design) to accept 2 IP cams, by giving up 2 Analog channels. so not much of an opportunity for substreams saving space on the drive.
 
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