Some Direction needed in camera choice

[BeanAnimal]

Hello -

Looking to replace some cameras on my property. I have been out of the game for a while and no longer do commercial work or keep up with the state of the industry and just spent a day or two trying to get back up to speed.

I have a pile of IPC-HFW4421S that I would like to upgrade. I would prefer (where possible) to use turrets. I understand that chasing MP is not always the best path, but would much prefer 4K. I have

Forgive my ignorance, but I don't understand the "new" warm white fuss. Am i mistaken in thinking that these are just wide aperture color cameras that require visible light, like any other color camera and maybe do a bit better white balance/correction based on the wavelength of their own onboard illuminators? Doesn't feel so "new" to me unless I am missing something?

From an aesthetic standpoint, how much visible light do these throw? Are they like little spotlights or flashlights? Fine in a commercial setting, but ugly in a home landscape setting?

In any case - I have some areas with path or similar lighting that I need to cover (walks, driveway, deck, porch) and other areas that will require definitely IR. Motorized would be nice but is not a deal breaker.

I ditched the Milestone server recently and moved to a Synology (no more servers in home YAY) system.

Can any of you steer me to cameras that meet my needs. Not too worried about cost. I just want the best options for upgrade of what I have.

Thanks!

 

[Gargoile]

What is your primary objective in your cameras? Facial recognition or just awareness of what's going on?

Your Synology is a small form factor server so you still have them

 

[BeanAnimal]

What is your primary objective in your cameras? Facial recognition or just awareness of what's going on?

Your Synology is a small form factor server so you still have them

Image quality is my primary objective - I get awareness with the older 4mp Dahuas - just looking to improve.

Sure if you want to call the synology a "server" in some context . Far smaller footprint than 20 U of 1U SuperMicros and 2U PowerEdges, switches and Liebert UPSs that once heated my basement.

 

[sebastiantombs]

The current crop of 8MP and 4MP for your perusal -

8MP Review

Worlds First Review - Dahua - IPC-Color4K-X / DH-IPC-HFW5849T1-ASE-LED - Full Color 4K Camera

Intro I’m excited to be doing another Worlds First Review. this time as I mentioned in the full color thread, I’ve been testing the new Dahua full color 4K camera. This was provided courtesy of @EMPIRETECANDY for a fair, honest, no holds barred, unbiased review. I’ll attempt to answer any and...

ipcamtalk.com

Worlds First Review - Dahua DH-IPC-HDW5849H-ASE-LED / IPC-Color4K-T - 2.8mm Turret

Ok, who's ready for not only a review BUT another World's First Review ? You heard it here first, new camera in hands and almost ready to review. Thanks as always goes to Andy (@EMPIRETECANDY) for providing this camera in exchange for a fair, honest, non biased, no holds barred review. I’ve...

ipcamtalk.com

2021 Full Color 2.0 Has a Fantastic New Dual Lens Camera

Hey guys The full color 2.0 has been released. Most cams I already posted here. Like: IPC-Color4K-X Bullet 4MP Motorized Full color. Today I bring a secret model, 1st release for the Dual-Lens Full color model in the world. Dual-lens Camera( Sample at Early Sep ) Ø Dual light fusion...

ipcamtalk.com

Dual Lens

Worlds First Review - Dahua DH-IPC-HFW5449T1-ASE+D2 - Dual Lens Full Color 2.0

Intro I’m pleased to announce we have another worlds first review to kick off, this time on the new HFW5449T1. So whats better than 1 camera (lens), well 2 of course. This camera makes some bold claims of Full Color regardless of low light environments utilizing 2 lenses. Lets jump into it but...

ipcamtalk.com

Review: Dahua DH-IPC-MFW7442K1-Z4-T40 - Dual Sensor (4MP + 4MP) Bullet Camera

Hope all of you are doing well ! Intro Its time to do another review and this time (as you may have seen in my Coming Soon video), we have 2 of them. Both of these cams are from the same MFW-7x42K1 family and feature dual sensors. I have the 7442 (4MP) and 7842 (8MP) versions of these cams...

ipcamtalk.com

180 Degree FOV 4K

New Dahua 180 Degree Bullet Camera (IPC-Color4K-180)

The new Dahua 180 degree bullet camera (IPC-Color4K-180) should be available soon from Andy along with its data sheet. Looks like a most interesting camera for many applications.

ipcamtalk.com

5442 Reviews

Review-OEM Loryta IPC-T5442T-ZE Varifocal 4mp camera (Dahua)

IPC-T5442T-ZE Varifocal from @EMPIRETECANDY 4MP WDR Turret Varifocal Network Camera Review unit courtesy of Andy (@EMPIRETECANDY) in exchange for a fair and honest review. Andy's ipcamtalk store: link Andy's AliExpress store: link Andy's Amazon store: link Price Approximately US $200.00...

ipcamtalk.com

Review - OEM IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP AI Varifocal Bullet Camera With Starlight+

All, thanks to Andy (@EMPIRETECANDY ) we have a new 4MP AI camera for testing. This camera has been provided by Andy in exchange for a fair and honest review. This camera is using the OEM model number of IPC-B5442-ZE which is the equivalent of the Dahua IPC-HFW5442-ZE for reference. The IPC-B...

ipcamtalk.com

Review-OEM 4mp AI Cam IPC-T5442TM-AS Starlight+

Dahua OEM IPC-T5442TM-AS from EMPIRETECANDY 4MP WDR Turret AI Network Camera Review unit courtesy of Andy (@EMPIRETECANDY) in exchange for a fair and honest review. Andy's ipcamtalk store: link Andy's AliExpress store: link Andy's Amazon store: link Price Approximately US $160 Link to camera...

ipcamtalk.com

Review IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED (Full Color, Starlight+)

Dahua OEM IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED from EMPIRETECANDY 4MP WDR Turret AI Network Camera Review unit courtesy of Andy (@EMPIRETECANDY) in exchange for a fair and honest review. Andy's ipcamtalk vendor forum: link Andy's AliExpress store: link Andy's Amazon store: link Andy's Email: kingsecurity2014...

ipcamtalk.com

Review: IPC-HDBW5442R-ASE-NI - Dahua Technology Pro AI Dome Network Camera

Hey, this is a wonderful forum, and since I’ve recently purchased a new set of Dahua cameras, I thought I’d share my thoughts and opinions. This camera is the IPC-HDBW5442R-ASE-NI, and it’s actually the fourth camera from Dahua that I’ve purchased for my house over the years. Prior to this, I...

ipcamtalk.com

Every camera needs some light to get color at night, that's a given. Onboard white LEDs in cameras are kind of a gimmick more than anything else. Think of a cell phone flashlight and how much that actually can illuminate further than maybe ten feet.

 

[Gargoile]

A lot of people on here have and like the ipc-t5442t-ze

 

[wittaj]

All cameras need light regardless of what any marketing claims. I can make a crap camera look like noon at midnight, but then motion is a blur.

Some of the newer "warm light" cameras do exceptionally well with just a little bit of light, but they do need light. They benefit from a much larger sensor than most cameras.

I have a Full Color type camera and the LED light on it is a gimmick. It helps for a small diameter circle, but it is no different than going outside at pitch black and turning on your cell phone light - it is bright looking directly at the LED light, but it doesn't spread out and reach very far. Fortunately I have enough ambient light that I do not need the little piddly LED light on and it actually looks worse with it on, but it performs better than my other cameras when tested at the same location. But without some light, a camera with IR capability is the safer bet.

See this thread on the importance of focal length over MP, complete with the commonly used and recommended cameras based on distance (most of which are already referenced above):

The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection

At the urging of several folks here, I created a thread to show the importance of focal length and how focal length can be more important than megapixels (MP). I mentioned some of this in the post regarding The Hookup’s latest video demonstrating different cameras, including one sold from a...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[BeanAnimal]

Every camera needs some light to get color at night, that's a given. Onboard white LEDs in cameras are kind of a gimmick more than anything else. Think of a cell hone flashlight and how much that actually can illuminate further than maybe ten feet.

So the real improvement here is just the latest generation of sensor/firmware and given porch, deck or other ambient lighting, I can go without the built in (what I assume to be ugly) white LEDs. So best day/night in this case will be the 4k-x variants as long as fixed focal length meets the needs.

It looks like the newer 8MP IRs (5842) have 1.8s instead of 2.7 or whatever. So superior quality that would outperform the 5442 in daylight and may be at a slight disadvantage in IR conditions. Is this correct?

That brings me to this

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09JFW767F

It would appear to be a varifical version of the 5842? Or something else? Is this the way to go in the places where I need IR?

 

[sebastiantombs]

Putting 8MP on a 1/1.8" sensor does hinder low light performance IMHO. The 5442, 4MP, uses that same sensor. Doubling the number of pixels to 8MP translates to roughly half the light per pixel in the 8MP versus the 4MP. There are some 8Ms coming out, soon, with larger sensors so that may be worth the wait unless you're in a real rush. Yes, technology has improved and they do operate well in very low light, but some light is still needed. The only way to know for sure is to buy one and test with it. I sometimes wish accurate LUX meters were less expensive so measurements could be taken for comparison purposes rather than being stuck with very generalized statements.

The 4K-X series seems to be the goto in 8MP at the moment. It does have a problem with the focal length in terms of best focus distance. That optimum focal point is relatively close to the camera. Have a look at the review of the 4K-X for the specifics on that.

I'd stay away from any camera that is "full color", full time color, because they have no IR cut filter and can't see IR. If the scene gets really dark IR is needed and they can't see it at all.

I have a bunch of he 5442s. I can "force" them to stay in color at night, but I feel they do better with IR. I'll aso say that they stay in color mode well after dusk, but so do the 3241s I have. It's a function of sensor, resolution and lens speed. I use auxiliary IR lighting rather than the built in IR lights just to keep the bugs away from the camera. I have been toying with the idea of adding some solar powered white lights to enhance them at night and keep them in color. So far, finding a solar powered flood light that can stay on all night after a day or two, or maybe longer, of cloudy weather has proven to be a daunting task. I am experimenting with adding additional battery capacity and may end up trying a much larger battery array, say 10 or 20 AH worth, charged with a separate solar panel/charger to be able to do what I want to do.

 

[Mike A.]

It looks like the newer 8MP IRs (5842) have 1.8s instead of 2.7 or whatever. So superior quality that would outperform the 5442 in daylight and may be at a slight disadvantage in IR conditions. Is this correct?

That brings me to this

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09JFW767F

It would appear to be a varifical version of the 5842? Or something else? Is this the way to go in the places where I need IR?

Basically correct. I have both. The 5842 isn't quite as good as the 5442 for low-light and not as good as the Color4K-X for color low-light but it's pretty good.

Detailed review here:

Worlds First Review - Dahua DH-IPC-HDW5842T-ZE-S2 / IPC-T5842T-ZE - 8MP / 4K Vari-Focal Turret

Intro I’m pleased to announce we have another worlds first review to kick off, this time on the new IPC-T5842T-ZE (@EMPIRETECANDY / Andy’s model number). This camera picks up where the 5831 left off and is a natural, potential step up from those already utilizing the legendary 5442. Lets jump...

ipcamtalk.com

I'd agree with the above. Unless you have quite a bit of light at night, then go IR with the 5442/5842. Even the Color4K-X needs more than most probably expect to really work well with motion and all considered.

 

[tigerwillow1]

The 5842 isn't quite as good as the 5442 for low-light and not as good as the Color4K-X for color low-light but it's pretty good.

Happening to have all 3 of these models, I totally agree. I ran a 5842 and 5442 side-by-side for a bit and was surprised at how much less-worse the 5842 was with dim lighting and at night. There must be more than just pixel size in play, with the newer sensors doing better in low light for the same pixel size. A big example is comparing the 5442 with the 2 MP starlights. Same pixel size and the 5442 blows the 2 MP cameras away in low light. To take advantage of the 5842's higher resolution you need to run a higher bit rate. If you don't want to do that, IMO the 5442 makes more sense.

 

[sebastiantombs]

I have to disagree, somewhat, with tigerwillow concerning the 2MP versus 4MP low light performance. I have a few 3241s and more than a few 5442s. The 3241s mounted in the same vicinity as 5442s remain in color a little longer and with a slightly brighter color picture. Of course the detail on the 5442 is better but that isn't critical within the DORI distances. Overall, I think the improved electronics and proper sensor sizes, along with lens speed, make these two excellent choices. The 5842, based on the reviews, seems to come quite close to the 5442 but again I have to side with the 5442 for the sensor/resolution ratio. It is apparent that the processing is improving though based on the comparison videos.