IVS or Motion

[CCTVCam]

What's the best for this scene:


IVS or Motion?

From what I'm reading IVS requires an object to be in the scene for at least 2 seconds before triggers apply. In this scene, a person might not be visible until they come around the rear of the vehicle and could then have travelled to the front of the vehicle before that 2 seconds is satisfied. Same with someone coming down the side of the garage to the right and eg throwing a brick on the car. That could lead to damage or other occurrences being missed in recordings in my mind.

Is IVS unsuitable for this type of scene?

Also, if so, what is the best way to trigger, motion (which type) and in camera or in BI, or both? Bit confused, Read the Wiki's and instructions but none of them seem to address the duplication's between BI and camera triggers or address which ones to use or the pre-requisites properly eg calibration for IVS, 2 second delay etc. whether any motion needs to be enabled to allow AI functions such as tips to work etc.

 

[wittaj]

I have field of views where a car is in view less than 2 seconds and IVS triggers.

Best thing is to try both and see which one is more consistent.

And then up to you if you use camera motion or BI or both.

I use camera AI to trigger and alert for people but use BI motion to trigger and capture mainstream everything else.

 

[bigredfish]

IVS Tripwire doesnt require 2 seconds, its immediate

 

[CCTVCam]

Ok that's great. The Dahua manual says the object has to be in the picture 2 seconds. Maybe they mean overall.

I'm guessing I now have to set up Global calibration followed by IVS rule?

One other quick question, how do you control the recording settings for the SD card? I have a mainstream 4k - 1683kbs, substream 1080P 4020kbs and both cameras have an SD card fitted. Ideally, I'd like to send the substream only to the SD card to reduce overhead and maximize capacity. However, it's not clear what settings in the camera affect all recording and which only affect the SD card alone.

 

[Perimeter]

IVS Tripwire doesnt require 2 seconds, its immediate

View attachment 159714

I was having trouble with a simple tripwire setup myself and started to experiment. I used a cork on a stiff wire as object and had a vertical tripwire in the middle of the screen. And I found the problem for my Dahua HFW2231 was to lock on the cork before it reached the tripwire. It took indeed some 1-2 seconds before the red frame came up. So if I moved the cork fast enough, it would cross the tripwire without the frame and would be undetected. I could duplicate the results using myself as object. In fact, that is why I started to experiment.

 

[Ri22o]

Ok that's great. The Dahua manual says the object has to be in the picture 2 seconds. Maybe they mean overall.

I'm guessing I now have to set up Global calibration followed by IVS rule?

One other quick question, how do you control the recording settings for the SD card? I have a mainstream 4k - 1683kbs, substream 1080P 4020kbs and both cameras have an SD card fitted. Ideally, I'd like to send the substream only to the SD card to reduce overhead and maximize capacity. However, it's not clear what settings in the camera affect all recording and which only affect the SD card alone.

Event and Storage should only affect internal recording to the SD card. Event settings should only affect BI if you use IVS rules and have ONVIF trigger events turned on within BI. (but this is only a trigger event and does not change any settings)

How do you plan to trigger the substream to record to the SD card?

 

[wittaj]

A cork and a human or vehicle are different objects lol.

A camera with AI will be much better.

 

[Perimeter]

A cork and a human or vehicle are different objects lol.

Indeed. But I only used the cork because the camera didn't get me and I wanted to know what was going on. I stole the idea from some Dahua tube stuff where a guy demonstrated tripwire with it. It helped me understand why the camera didn't get me.

 

[tigerwillow1]

In addition to everything that's been said, every time I've tried the on-camera motion detection I've happily gone back to tripwires.

 

[wittaj]

Everything is so unique to the field of view and settings.

Running on default settings versus taking time to dial in the settings can result in different experiences.

It is best to try the different options and pick the one that works best. Some of my cameras are trip wires in a zig zag fashion while others use the intrusion.

 

[bigredfish]

I was having trouble with a simple tripwire setup myself and started to experiment. I used a cork on a stiff wire as object and had a vertical tripwire in the middle of the screen. And I found the problem for my Dahua HFW2231 was to lock on the cork before it reached the tripwire. It took indeed some 1-2 seconds before the red frame came up. So if I moved the cork fast enough, it would cross the tripwire without the frame and would be undetected. I could duplicate the results using myself as object. In fact, that is why I started to experiment.

Hmmm not my experience with newer cams with AI. The 2231 series is a bit dated. Setting to human or vehicle its immediate. I have 200-300 events per day on various cameras with the same response.

Here's an example. I just set a tripwire on a camera facing a busy 4 lane. Average speeds are 45-50.

I got instant activation on most every vehicle ( *about 250 hits on the timeline in less than 5 minutes)



With one set of two black trucks taking 5 frames past the tripwire to activate due to speed probably being 55+.
That is far less than 1 second (I'm running 30FPS so I guess in theory that took what .17 seconds?)

 

[CCTVCam]

I might have to pay someone to look at this. Something not quite right.

Sometimes going back in and all the image settings have reverted to defaults. I can get no reponse from trip wires, in BI I'm getting the low fps symbol (only set to 15fps) and cpu at 4-8% and GPU (integtrated graphics) at 8%.

I'll try and post a screenshot below of the areas of concern.

 

[Perimeter]

30FPS

This might be of relevance here. I was running 15 FPS iirc.

 

[bigredfish]

The 2 seconds might refer to the object being in the overall scene? But those cars going left to right aren’t more than 1/2 second in scene.

I also wonder if the 2 seconds refers to “Intrusion” box. I do believe with Intrusion I see more of a delay, but not tripwire.

When you think about it, plain old MD may indeed trip quicker than AI assisted lines. With MD it’s simply sensing ANY change in pixels (sensitivity could play a roll) but with Tripwire, the AI algorithm has to do its thing before returning a value. So it would make sense that it would take longer (fractions of a second but longer) I’m certainly no math genius or computer engineer but that makes sense on its face.

 

[wittaj]

I might have to pay someone to look at this. Something not quite right.

Sometimes going back in and all the image settings have reverted to defaults. I can get no reponse from trip wires, in BI I'm getting the low fps symbol (only set to 15fps) and cpu at 4-8% and GPU (integtrated graphics) at 8%.

I'll try and post a screenshot below of the areas of concern.

Low FPS symbol is either a sign of VBR, smart code, a failing power supply or a hardware acceleration issue.

There is no need to run hardware acceleration now that substreams are available. The CPU needed to offload to the GPU is more than the savings offloading to the GPU. Most see CPU% go down when turning off hardware acceleration

 

[tigerwillow1]

The 2231 series is a bit dated.

I've found my single 2231 to have a higher missed detection rate than other models. Even the old chinese market cameras do better. Perhaps they overshot in trying to reduce false positives? I do not use human/vehicle detection.

 

[CCTVCam]

Low FPS symbol is either a sign of VBR, smart code, a failing power supply or a hardware acceleration issue.

There is no need to run hardware acceleration now that substreams are available. The CPU needed to offload to the GPU is more than the savings offloading to the GPU. Most see CPU% go down when turning off hardware acceleration

Here are the screenshots:

Forced Alarm keeps lighting red in the camera. Clicking it has no effect:



In BI...

Intermittent low fps warning on both cameras

No Triggers on timeline (record continuous + triggers)

Some more warning symbols below the timeline




Everything is brand new. Brand new pc, new POE switch, new network cable (same as Alastair Stevenson's), Klein Plugs, Network fully tested using tester.

Camera settings set using Internet explorer.

Hardware acceleration was at default, now set to no.

BI Settings:

Configuration:



Video:



Audio:




Record:




Trigger:

 

[bigredfish]

Can’t help ya with BI settings I’m not smart enough for BI thus I use NVRs

 

[wittaj]

That red alarm is for the output cables - it does nothing to trigger the motion.

Keep in mind a tester simply tests continuity and that it could pass but not be sufficient for POE loading.

Post screenshots of the camera GUI - codec settings, FPS and iframes, etc.

Post screenshot of the BI camera status page - the page that shows camera name, IP address, FPS, KEY, bitrate, etc. along with the MP/s at the bottom.

Make and model of POE switch.

 

[CCTVCam]

Camera Settings (mirrored, image settings aside)

AI - Global:



AI - IVS:

(Not Sure what Post Record does here):



Encode:




Video Detection - Motion - I enabled this after IVS failed to trigger in the hope Motion needed to be on. Setting is left blank ie no squares filled in for actual motion detection:



I attempted to set up Audio Detection - this also fails to trigger recordings:



Smart Motion Detection:



I haven't touched Network or most other tabs. If you need to see anything else, let me know.