Cant figure out what is causing this multiple recordings

[NWHiker]

Hi all,

I've searched the archives here, but cannot seem to come up with a solution.

I have camera's that have multiple entries and others that only have a few. Archive settings are set to every 4 hrs. Besides that, these are the same cameras and one will record 4 hours using 4 gb, and the other will use 16gb to record the same time frame.

Any ideas? I've compared settings. Everything is the same from camera to camera. 1028x720, 10FPS, etc

 

[Mikk36]

I don't see any duplicate recordings, only files split by the 4 gigabyte limit (every file has a different name-timestamp / last modified). It looks like your POS camera uses a lot more bandwidth than the Waiting Room one.

 

[NWHiker]

Thanks Mikk36. what would cause one camera to use more bandwidth than another, even though the settings are the same? The camera's are setup on opposite sides of the wall and go through the same switch. I've checked resolution, framerates, formats...I'm really at a loss.

 

[IAmATeaf]

I assume that you are checking the settings on the cams and not within BI?

 

[SouthernYankee]

camera setting screen shots would be helpful, from the cameras.
screen shot of BI
1) BI Options clips and archiving tab new folder
2) BI for each camera Record tab.

I am assuming that the cameras are on continuous record.

The type of compression will effect the size. Also what is going on in the video, if there is a lot of movement and a lot of small color changes it will take more space, then a static image.

Also the waiting room is set to split the files every 8 hours. The POS is splitting at 4 GB. The smaller files can be caused by power failures. Or some times the switch from night to day.

 

[Mikk36]

Also the waiting room is set to split the files every 8 hours. The POS is splitting at 4 GB. The smaller files can be caused by power failures. Or some times the switch from night to day.

Power failures are not an issue here, both cameras are set to split at 8 hours (POS creates a new file at 000000, 080000 and 160000).
As for why they are giving out different bitrates: propably different settings or different amount of change in image (static image doesn't use much data when it's set to VBR). You can check that the difference is from the cameras with the status display (that graph-like icon next to question mark on the top left corner of BI main window). It will display status information for every camera there, including live bandwidth.
It could also be different lighting conditions, for example. If one has low light, it could produce a lot of noise in the image, which will eat bandwidth.

 

[NWHiker]

Hi guys...Thanks for all the help. Right now, the only thing that makes sense is one camera has lots of movement (POS) and the other doesnt (Waiting room)
I've attached screen shots that Yankee asked for. I added the bitrates as suggested by others. Yes, I am checking the settings on the cameras and in BI.
My biggest thing right now is I can't lose any more data. However, it makes it really hard to try and configure storage size.

On a side note, right now I have grabbed a 4TB external hard drive and slapped it in there to go along with the other 4TB internal drive. I have now set the internal NEW folder to keep 60 days worth of data and then move that to the Stored folder on the external drive and keep it for 31 days.

 

[IAmATeaf]

One is set to 30fps from what I can see and know?

 

[Mikk36]

I don't see the AvertX camera CBR/VBR setting, does it always use CBR? The Amcrest uses VBR, which means that at 720p it propably is using a lot less than that 768 Kbps limit you have set (propably more like 100-200 Kbps).

Don't limit new/stored folder by time, if you want to maximize the amount of recordings you can hold. Set each to hold the highest amount of space you can allocate unless you need each to only hold x amount of days of video.

 

[NWHiker]

One is set to 30fps from what I can see and know?

Here is a screen shot of the choices. Not sure why it is only allowing 30fps

 

[NWHiker]

I don't see the AvertX camera CBR/VBR setting, does it always use CBR? The Amcrest uses VBR, which means that at 720p it propably is using a lot less than that 768 Kbps limit you have set (propably more like 100-200 Kbps).

Don't limit new/stored folder by time, if you want to maximize the amount of recordings you can hold. Set each to hold the highest amount of space you can allocate unless you need each to only hold x amount of days of video.

Hey Mikk, I only need to store 90 days.

 

[Edcfish]

I would not move files based on date.
I would save 1/2 your cameras to one drive and the other half to the 2nd drive (assuming they are both now internal drives).
As Mikk36 said, I also would not try to retain files based on date, and use drive space only to determine when to delete (or even move to a longer term storage if that is the requirement)....if i needed to retain files for longer I would increase drive sizes instead of moving files around.
I also would shorten the length recorded per file to 1/2 or 1/4 of what you currently have. Yes it will be more files but they will be smaller and much easier to manage.

 

[Mikk36]

This is the display that shows how much each camera is using bandwidth at the moment:

Is the 90 days requirement so that you need to remove if after 90 days?

 

[NWHiker]

I would not move files based on date.
I would save 1/2 your cameras to one drive and the other half to the 2nd drive (assuming they are both now internal drives).
As Mikk36 said, I also would not try to retain files based on date, and use drive space only to determine when to delete (or even move to a longer term storage if that is the requirement)....if i needed to retain files for longer I would increase drive sizes instead of moving files around.
I also would shorten the length recorded per file to 1/2 or 1/4 of what you currently have. Yes it will be more files but they will be smaller and much easier to manage.

Hey Ed,
As noted, one is internal the other external. I like the idea of sending half to one folder and half to the other

 

[Mikk36]

This only works if both cameras are using similar bandwidth, otherwise one will be able to store a lot less data.

 

[Edcfish]

and slapped it in there to go along with the other

I couldn't tell from your post if you meant you pulled the external drive from the case and put it in the PC or just plugged the external into the PC.

...and, Mikk36, yes if the cameras are not sending similar amounts of data one would fill up quicker, but if the faster to fill drive was able to hold the required 90 days then all would still be good.

With the 2nd drive external, I would not split storage as I has posted previously (if for no other reason than I rarely trust external enclosures/drives as much as i would a good internal WD purple drive)

 

[SouthernYankee]

NWHIKER

What are the sub streams used for? if not used turn them off.

Only use the external drive as the stored folder, Never use an external drive as your primary storage. Most external drives do not have a long term running full time life. Drives in BI are running 100% of the time.

From your screen shot all cameras are recording at 10 FPS. Two cameras have the IFRAME set to 10 and the remainder have the Iframe set to 20. That is the key (.5) value in the fps/key.

The question is why is the kitchen have such a high bitrate. Does that camera have a higher quality then the other cameras. Screen shot of that cameras settings.

If storage is critical I would get a larger drives they are cheap. If using an External drive for the stored folder, I would reduce the size of the files, by setting the size to 1 hour recording. They are easier and faster to copy form the internal to external drive.

You could also set up a NAS with a lot of space for your stored files.

I would not sacrifice video quality for storage space. When you need the video, quality of the video will be critical.

 

[NWHiker]

NWHIKER

What are the sub streams used for? if not used turn them off.

Only use the external drive as the stored folder, Never use an external drive as your primary storage. Most external drives do not have a long term running full time life. Drives in BI are running 100% of the time.

From your screen shot all cameras are recording at 10 FPS. Two cameras have the IFRAME set to 10 and the remainder have the Iframe set to 20. That is the key (.5) value in the fps/key.

The question is why is the kitchen have such a high bitrate. Does that camera have a higher quality then the other cameras. Screen shot of that cameras settings.

If storage is critical I would get a larger drives they are cheap. If using an External drive for the stored folder, I would reduce the size of the files, by setting the size to 1 hour recording. They are easier and faster to copy form the internal to external drive.

You could also set up a NAS with a lot of space for your stored files.

I would not sacrifice video quality for storage space. When you need the video, quality of the video will be critical.

Aren't sub streams used for feeding video to the web interface?
I can change the IFRAME rate to 10, but I don't know what I am changing.
I don't know why the bitrate is so high on that camera. I cannot log into that camera because the former person here did not write down the password.

 

[SouthernYankee]

What web interface ? I have never used a substream. I view everything via Blue Iris.

The H.264 and H.265 are similar in there video compression. In very simple terms, and Iframe is a complete full frame / picture, with all the data, pixels and color information. The next frame after the Iframe just contains the information that has changed, the Iframe and the change data is used to reconstruct the second frame, Each frame after that uses the previous frame to build the new frame. The problem is that this is not perfect, Fast moving object, cars, People turning there head can cause fuzzyness or tails or items that seem to appear out of nowhere. So you need another Iframe to start the process over again. If the Iframes are too far apart the video looks like crap. If they are too close together you waste space. The general recommendation is for the Iframe to be the same as the FPS, so you get one Iframe per second. For real static images, then an iframe no more than every 2 seconds , twice the FPS.

On the kitchen camera it appears to be using 5 to 10 time more space/data then the other cameras. I know nothing about these cameras, I would look for doing a hard reset on the camera, Normally you take the camera down, open it up, push a button or short two pins. look at the documentation.

 

[Mikk36]

Indeed, having the password lost is a perfect excuse to reset that camera.