Best day/night option without external API

[jarrow]

Hi guys,

I have a system running at a factory with a total of 16 (in the nearby future 25) HFW5442 and HFW5241 cams on a NVR5832-R-4KS2. I'm trying to get the best day/night settings and am running into the known problem of not being able to have color and the perfect shutter/gain options at night when the 'Day/Night' profile is enabled.
At the moment, I have two different profiles for day and night, with these settings:

	Day	Night
Manual Shutter	1.5 ms	16.67 ms
Manual Gain	40	50
Day & Night 'Mode'	Auto (greyed out, not able to change)	Auto (greyed out, not able to change)
Day & Night 'Sensitivity'	Low	Low

First problem with the above setting, is that at sunrise/sunset the modes continuously flicker for half an hour from day to night because the amount of light is just at the edge of both profiles. Setting the sensitivity doesn't help.
Second problem is that it goes to a B/W image with IR. With the amount of light, color would be possible and preferable.

Ideally I'd have a machine on the network with the DahuaSunriseSunset from @bp2008, or the Linux variant on a Pi or something, but the camera side of the NVR doesn't have internet access, because of the dual NIC in the NVR, and it adds a lot of uncertainty when this machine wouldn't work, because the setup isn't continuously monitored. Then all the cams would be completely black at night, whenever an API call fails.

One 'solution' to my problem would be to have the General profile for both day and night, and have it on auto gain/shutter and force them to color, but I don't believe that would result in a good quality picture, but mostly overexposed faces.

Has anyone bumped into this problem before? How did you solve it? How would one normally have a Dahua NVR + Dahua cams and have the profile switch properly, just twice a day?

 

[wittaj]

Yeah after all these years the day/night doesn't work properly in these cameras for our use. It works well in well lit areas.

What most have done that have an NVR is they go into the camera GUI and set up a schedule for the day profile and the night profile. Now what that means is a couple times a year you need to adjust the schedule for the changing sunrise/sunset.

When you switch from the day/night option in the camera to schedule, you should get access then to force it in color.

 

[jarrow]

Thanks for your answer @wittaj!
Yes the schedule option is a possibility which does work good when the times are right.
But as its at a client, I'm looking for something more permanent. Not really looking to be on site 4 (or more) times a year to change the schedules on 25 separate camera GUI's

 

[Flintstone61]

Have you tried setting Day exposure faster like .5 ?
Then adjust other parameters to achieve a usable image.....
Then it would switch to night earlier and possibly without the back and forth...
try sensivity to another setting as well....
Do you need IR at night?

 

[wittaj]

Have you tried setting Day exposure faster like .5 ?
Then adjust other parameters to achieve a usable image.....
Then it would switch to night earlier and possibly without the back and forth...
try sensivity to another setting as well....
Do you need IR at night?

The problem with that is many of these cameras do not switch between day and night profile when using the day/night option in the profile management (yeah one would think it does but it doesn't). It simply switches it to color or B/W and uses either the general or the day profile. Works well in commercial settings, but not well for residential. Part of the reason why bp2008 created the utility.

The only way to force it to use the day profile or the night profile is the Schedule option or the sunrise/sunset utility. Or some other home automation system. Now the problem is those with an NVR are limited due to the NVR isolating the cameras. So then they need to add a computer to do the sunrise/sunset utility or go into the profile management schedule several times a year and adjust the cameras.

 

[Flintstone61]

When i setup the cam, I setup the Full time day schedule that works for me, and save it....
then i toggle fulltime again and choose night....then i setup my night settings that i like...
Then i choose the Day/night option...and it flip flops when it senses enough light change.

 

[Flintstone61]

does that make sense?

 

[Flintstone61]

Cuz if you go to day/night first without defining and saving Night settings and select that....it greys out some settings you may have wanted control of.....

 

[wittaj]

When i setup the cam, I setup the Full time day schedule that works for me, and save it....
then i toggle fulltime again and choose night....then i setup my night settings that i like...
Then i choose the Day/night option...and it flip flops when it senses enough light change.

Are you sure it flips/flops and not just using one of the profiles and going to B/W with IR?

Tonight log into the camera GUI and see which profile is actually running.

Or as a test take your LPR camera and turn the night profile shutter to 1/30 and if it is switching to night profile based on this profile management option, then the image will be real bright at that slow shutter. If it is dark, then it is using the day profile but just kicked it to B/W with IR...

I tried using that profile management option on one of my cameras and it used the day profile 24/7 and just simply switched between B/W and color....and that is why it greys out the option to force it to color or B/W....

 

[Flintstone61]

I beleive the 5442 bullet and the 5241 bullet and my 5442 ZE will auto-switch when day/night buton is selected

 

[Flintstone61]

heres is my 5442 z4
on day/night toggle
night is LPR exposure
day is color with other settings

 

[Flintstone61]

 

[wittaj]

that seems awfully bright at a 1000 shutter given there doesn't appear to be street lights or other lights.

But I have seen it work with some cams and not others, so I stick to the utility to have complete control.

 

[Flintstone61]

I would not be getting plates at night with a .25- to 12 exposure

 

[Flintstone61]

i have huge light LED in intersection

 

[wittaj]

I agree a 12ms shutter wouldn't get the plate, but in any event, the day/night profile management doesn't work for the OP, which has been my experience as well.

 

[Flintstone61]

He may have to individually adjust and save each day parameter he wants with each individual menu item before moving to another menu setting....when all the day is set.
then go back to the full time menu...and select night....and do it all over again....
then select Day/Night and see how it goes.

 

[Flintstone61]

You can see the IR toggle itself on and go into LPR settings between 4:53 and 4:54 in the images

 

[Flintstone61]

external API....hmmm does that mean only from the NVR?
then yeah he could have headaches,,,,
i wonder if he leaves the NVR GUi on auto for day/night
and mkes his changes in the Cam GUI if it will stick....

 

[jarrow]

Are you sure it flips/flops and not just using one of the profiles and going to B/W with IR?

Tonight log into the camera GUI and see which profile is actually running.

Or as a test take your LPR camera and turn the night profile shutter to 1/30 and if it is switching to night profile based on this profile management option, then the image will be real bright at that slow shutter. If it is dark, then it is using the day profile but just kicked it to B/W with IR...

I tried using that profile management option on one of my cameras and it used the day profile 24/7 and just simply switched between B/W and color....and that is why it greys out the option to force it to color or B/W....

Its already dark over here, I tested it and it actually switches from the Day profile to the Night profile (with the slow shutter, thus overexposed) and it also shows the night profile when logging in and going to settings.

He may have to individually adjust and save each day parameter he wants with each individual menu item before moving to another menu setting....when all the day is set.
then go back to the full time menu...and select night....and do it all over again....
then select Day/Night and see how it goes.

Yes that's indeed how I set it in the first place. That's also necessary to be able to adjust the sensitivity to Low for the Day/Night switch, as its not greyed out when in Full Time profile, and it presumably keeps its setting when switching to the Day/Night profile (that's what I read somewhere on this forum). Setting the day shutter higher (to e.g. 12 ms) would possibly fix one issue: the constant back and forth switching. Wouldn't be to much of a problem as I don't need plates, just faces.
Unfortunately won't fix the fact that I can't force them in color mode. (Just add more light isn't an option, I think I should have more to say about if a picture is bright enough than a piece of hardware I bought.)

external API....hmmm does that mean only from the NVR?
then yeah he could have headaches,,,,
i wonder if he leaves the NVR GUi on auto for day/night
and mkes his changes in the Cam GUI if it will stick....

External API means the DahuaSunriseSunset from bp2008 or actually a C program called SunWait: GitHub - risacher/sunwait: Sunwait calculates sunrise or sunset times with civil, nautical, astronomical and custom twilights, for use with Windows Task Scheduler or 'cron' on Linux.
Actually tried to change the option in your screenshot yesterday via the NVR (just for fun), and it does really change in the greyed out area when in the cams settings, but after the next change from day to night or the other way around, it'll revert to the original 'Auto' setting.