Burglars Survey

[nayr]

http://www.kgw.com/news/investigations/we-asked-86-burglars-how-they-broke-into-homes/344213396

some interesting insights for you guys to think about..

Generally, burglars agreed security cameras were a deterrent. But some said it also likely signaled there were valuables inside the home.

“NRA sticker on car bumper = Lots of guns to steal,” wrote one burglar

If a homeowner had a big, loud dog most burglars would stay away. Smaller dogs don’t seem to bother them.

Most intruders said they would leave immediately if a security alarm went off.

 

[Jack B Nimble]

I wonder if the burglars understand that in today's technology the cameras send pictures immediately to smart phones and the receiver can open all their cameras in a instant as I do ? I also wondered that with all my cameras they may feel there are more valuables at my place than at the next house. I guess I can only hope they educate themselves better when they are in jail and learn that IP cameras are not yesterday's technology and perhaps they should just move on to another home.

 

[nayr]

thats not as common of a capability as you think... and few people are willing to accept cameras inside there house; especially with all the hackers out there.. so how exactly are you going to know your getting burglarized without an alarm system? a picture of someone at my front door is not enough to call the cops.. and most people cant see there doors on camera; so if its been kicked open you wont see it.

every once and a while I hear of someone watching a criminal and getting the cops to sneak up on em; but I'd rather an alarm go off the moment they are inside and they just leave before they can take anything of value.

a video surveillance system does not replace a home security system.. by any stretch of the means.. what if they are burglarizing you when your on an airplane, at a sporting event with horrid mobile service, at a theatre, performance or anywhere its not acceptable to use a mobile, driving down the interstate and unable to check your mobile device, far too many points of failure and Murphy is on there side; not yours.

 

[Fastb]

Interesting. nayr, thanks for posting.

nayr said "and most people cant see there doors on camera; so if its been kicked open you wont see it."
True Dat!
I'm a fan of having some cams mounted outside, pointed towards the house.
House-mounted cam gets a good view of them approaching, but not leaving. Cam mounted in tree or in garden sees 'em leaving.
Vantage points of Cams on house + cams away from house gives two perspectives. Useful.

nayr said "a video surveillance system does not replace a home security system"
Alarm & surveillance are two goals, with some overlap. One doesn't replace the other. Each requires different equipment, for the non-overlapping techniques and technology.

Article said "Generally, burglars agreed security cameras were a deterrent."
The burglars didn't mention decoy cameras. I'm amazed by the number of cameras on commercial establishments that use phony cameras. They're easy to spot.
1) Like when the drilled hole for the cam cable is the same size at the cable diameter. I really doubt the installer crimped on the bnc or RJ45 connector while standing on a ladder.
2) When my cell phone cam doesn't see IR from the cam's fake leds

Some burglars said "some said visible cams also likely signaled there were valuables inside the home."
Reminded me of a college girl knew who moved to NYC. Fire escape outside her window. 6 story building. Called to get bars added to the window, to keep out intruders. Vendor came out, opened the window, looked up and down. He said "You'd be the only apartment with bars on the windows. Do you want to tell the crooks you have more valuable stuff than your neighbors?"
She didn't get bars.

Survey said "Most intruders said they would leave immediately if a security alarm went off."
In Seattle, you can't mount the alarm's siren outside the house. So here at least, how effective is that interior mounted alarm? Boils down to how involved your neighbors will be a) to call 911 and/or b) walk over to your house to check on things?
Police out here don't respond to house alarms - too many false alarms. Having a neighbor see a kicked in front door, and then tell the 911 operator - THAT will turn it into a "confirmed alarm", at which point the police respond.

Survey said "If a homeowner had a big, loud dog most burglars would stay away. Smaller dogs don’t seem to bother them."
That reminded me of a DIY alarm a guy made. He had a small dog. He recorded the yapping. Connected a cassette deck to the front door button. When the door bell was pressed, the tape would play at half-speed. Instead of a small lap dog, it now sounded like two dogs, and one was a giant with very deep barks. Ha Ha!

 

[Keyboard]

... and few people are willing to accept cameras inside there house; ...

This is unfortunate IMO. I think more people should put cameras inside their house (less any intimate/private areas). After all, if an intruder breaks in, then I want to have a good image/video of the thief. Also, I like being able to check on the interior of my home while I'm away.

Hackers peeping in on you are a concern, but I would not want a 3rd party company having access to my cameras. I do not trust cable and alarm companies that offer homeowners video surveillance. Not only do they have admin access to your system (they own it), but they also want to charge a monthly fee for their monitoring service.

... a video surveillance system does not replace a home security system...

I agree. Hopefully, most people understand this. My video surveillance system augments my alarm system. I still want my entry points and interior protected by a conventional alarm system.

I'm hoping to have a fully integrated system one day, where the alarm triggers video recording of the cameras as opposed to the cameras assuming a burst of sunshine is motion.

 

[nayr]

@Keyboard, shrug; I like being able to fuck in any room in the house but not so keen on making my own porn; were also a bunch of nudists.. the entire interior of my house is intimate.. The camera in the kids room has been offline for months now; was catching my wife topless more than it was being used to check on the kids.. I wouldent look at it all day long then, BOOBS!


@Fastb, people crimp bnc connectors at tops of ladders all the time.. hell Ive soldered wires together 25ft up a ladder before.

I also kinda disagree in pointing em at your house; might be good additional coverage.. but its horrible for identification, people will approach the house casually, possibly glancing around looking for cameras or activity inside.. when they leave, if they were up to no good; odds are they are hauling ass, looking at the ground so they dont do a face plant.. The best opportunity to get a good identifying shot is on the approach; not the departure.. however if you already have your ID capabilities well covered a nice shot of the house its self could prove to be quite useful in several situations, like checking up on things while away or insurance purposes if a natural disaster does some severe damage.

My 2 PTZ's let me look at all the windows, doors, gates, etc without needing a inward facing camera.. so when an alarm is triggered, they will go to a preset that has that sensor in view.

 

[Kurtus]

I could've had a serious incident out the front of my house two weeks ago but 3 separate neighbours came out as I was pursued by a chap claiming to have a knife. We handled the situation passively but couldn't reason with this person who left eventually after threatening with a knife, path bricks. The police showed up later and did a good job I think but the thing that hit me was that if my neighbours hadn't come out to even just to show to this person that they are willing to witness what is going on things could've turned out a lot different.
Great camera setup in that situation is still needed isn't it. I had a very basic setup but have bought the Hikvision NVR listed below now.

 

[Fastb]

@nayr,

'I also kinda disagree in pointing em at your house; might be good additional coverage.. but its horrible for identification, people will approach the house casually, possibly glancing around looking for cameras or activity inside.. when they leave, if they were up to no good; odds are they are hauling ass, looking at the ground so they dont do a face plant..'
No disagreement, really.

When they approach, looking casual & typical, with no hoodie, not running, looking everywhere but the ground, etc. - that's ideal time for capturing some good footage (house-mounted or not). I'm not saying "Choose non-house mounted cams over house mounted cams"

Not A vs B. Instead, A plus B. The different perspective adds more info.

Also, which I didn't mention earlier, is that a cam non-house mounted, but aimed at a corner of the house, can watch two sides of the house. For house-mounted cams, you'd need two cams, one aimed at each side of the house. Yes, two perspectives, with the pros & cons

So house-mounted and non-house-mounted are complimentary.

My house lot is big, so I have many non-house mounted options. I'm also able to use use laser liines, and dual tech sensors. IMHO, reducing false alarms is job one. Second is capturing video that's useful, both in a] real time (when calling 911 when I'm not at home and viewing on cell phone), and b] after the fact, to identify the clowns who trespassed.

I just got my 4MP Turret w/ 12mm lens. Now I can see license plates of cars coming up my long driveway. [mounted off-house, due to foliage and need for clean view]. And whenthey're leaving.

As we all know, there's no "one size fits all" solution. This forum lets us evaluate the pros and cons, and find the solution that best fits their application, budget, objectives, ect. Sorry if I'm preaching to the choir.

 

[Jack B Nimble]

thats not as common of a capability as you think... and few people are willing to accept cameras inside there house; especially with all the hackers out there.. so how exactly are you going to know your getting burglarized without an alarm system? a picture of someone at my front door is not enough to call the cops.. and most people cant see there doors on camera; so if its been kicked open you wont see it.

every once and a while I hear of someone watching a criminal and getting the cops to sneak up on em; but I'd rather an alarm go off the moment they are inside and they just leave before they can take anything of value.

a video surveillance system does not replace a home security system.. by any stretch of the means.. what if they are burglarizing you when your on an airplane, at a sporting event with horrid mobile service, at a theatre, performance or anywhere its not acceptable to use a mobile, driving down the interstate and unable to check your mobile device, far too many points of failure and Murphy is on there side; not yours.

I have an alarm and cameras inside my house. Any motion on inside cameras while away get numerous emails to on the ground family members. I can't prepare for every event that may happen but, I am better prepared than many.

 

[dorcse]

Survey said "Most intruders said they would leave immediately if a security alarm went off."
In Seattle, you can't mount the alarm's siren outside the house. So here at least, how effective is that interior mounted alarm? Boils down to how involved your neighbors will be a) to call 911 and/or b) walk over to your house to check on things?
Police out here don't respond to house alarms - too many false alarms. Having a neighbor see a kicked in front door, and then tell the 911 operator - THAT will turn it into a "confirmed alarm", at which point the police respond.

I don't have an exterior siren as part of my home alarm. I do have 115dB interior sirens on each level of my home. And I did something extra. I installed two additional 115dB sirens and mounted them inside the ventilation returns to my HVAC fan-forced air system. First, this stops someone from silencing the interior sirens by just smashing the ones mounted to the ceilings. Second, it creates a near intolerable situation for an intruder. The sirens in the return echo and reverberate everywhere. This is extremely loud. So loud in fact that I can attest that it is almost physically impossible to stay in the house. My house alarm also has a 4G dialer as a back-up to the phone line. I don't really need my neighbors to hear the alarm and call the PD. If the alarm were to sound, I get a call and a text and I am able to bring up on my smartphone three interior cams. If I verified an actual intruder, I would personally call the police and describe the person(s) in my home. I live in a town that has a very responsive PD (I think they are bored.) Recently, my elderly neighbor called the PD because she was concerned about a cat supposedly stuck in her tree. They dispatched 2 cruisers and the fire dept.. no kidding.

 

[dorcse]

@Keyboard, shrug; I like being able to fuck in any room in the house but not so keen on making my own porn; were also a bunch of nudists.. the entire interior of my house is intimate.. The camera in the kids room has been offline for months now; was catching my wife topless more than it was being used to check on the kids.. I wouldent look at it all day long then, BOOBS!

Nayr.. man.. you crack me up!!!

 

[9volt]

Survey said "If a homeowner had a big, loud dog most burglars would stay away. Smaller dogs don’t seem to bother them."
That reminded me of a DIY alarm a guy made. He had a small dog. He recorded the yapping. Connected a cassette deck to the front door button. When the door bell was pressed, the tape would play at half-speed. Instead of a small lap dog, it now sounded like two dogs, and one was a giant with very deep barks. Ha Ha!

I have my Blue Iris set to play a rottweiler growling if anyone comes within 3 feet of my front door or my garage.

 

[cam235]

> few people are willing to accept cameras inside their house
True, but it seems OK to have cameras inside that run only when the interior motion sensors are active (eg. no one supposed to be home). That does require a connection between the alarm system and the video system, which isn't always the case for older setups. I've seen a number of indoor burglar videos online captured by "Nest" cams and the like.

One thing that stood out for me, when thinking about camera placement:

[FONT=&amp]> [/FONT][FONT=&amp]Did you typically knock on the front door before breaking into a home?

Yes. All of the inmates who responded said they would knock on the front door before breaking in.[/FONT]

 

[tangent]

Article said "Generally, burglars agreed security cameras were a deterrent."
The burglars didn't mention decoy cameras. I'm amazed by the number of cameras on commercial establishments that use phony cameras. They're easy to spot.
1) Like when the drilled hole for the cam cable is the same size at the cable diameter. I really doubt the installer crimped on the bnc or RJ45 connector while standing on a ladder.
2) When my cell phone cam doesn't see IR from the cam's fake leds

Some burglars said "some said visible cams also likely signaled there were valuables inside the home."
Reminded me of a college girl knew who moved to NYC. Fire escape outside her window. 6 story building. Called to get bars added to the window, to keep out intruders. Vendor came out, opened the window, looked up and down. He said "You'd be the only apartment with bars on the windows. Do you want to tell the crooks you have more valuable stuff than your neighbors?"
She didn't get bars.

Survey said "Most intruders said they would leave immediately if a security alarm went off."
In Seattle, you can't mount the alarm's siren outside the house. So here at least, how effective is that interior mounted alarm? Boils down to how involved your neighbors will be a) to call 911 and/or b) walk over to your house to check on things?

Remember only fake cameras have blinking leds

Security bar vendor should have sold her on a security laminate for the window and door jamb reinforcement.

If it can't be outside, can it be in the attic right next to a soffit/gable vent? If not maybe mount one to your combustion air intake.

 

[MaryChong]

Well, I may think that fake security cameras are not functioning. We'd better buy true security cameras since those rather "smarter" burglars might recognize those dummy security cameras are fake. And they would invade our house.

 

[Kawboy12R]

The burglars didn't mention decoy cameras. I'm amazed by the number of cameras on commercial establishments that use phony cameras. They're easy to spot.
1) Like when the drilled hole for the cam cable is the same size at the cable diameter. I really doubt the installer crimped on the bnc or RJ45 connector while standing on a ladder.
2) When my cell phone cam doesn't see IR from the cam's fake leds

1) It isn't that hard to do and gives a more professional appearance than some biggass hole filled with silicone. I'd call it a better install job rather than an indicator of a fake camera.

2) Why get all high tech? If it's dark out the LEDs are red. No need to pretend to be all CIA to figure that out.

The blinking "Look at me!" LED is the best giveaway of a fake.

The best (worst?) fake camera install I've seen is in a local Chinese restaurant. They didn't want to spend for the wiring and DVR so they just paid a handyman to install real cameras with the wires not hooked to anything above the false ceiling. He was a bit of a drunk and loved to tell anybody who would listen about his fake cam install. Those cams have been sitting there not doing anything for 20 years. I don't think they've ever been robbed though.

 

[Ryan00]

Who the hell steals Credit cards, that would be the last thing I would take.