Camera to read License plates / Not APR or LPR

[mike james]

I looked at some cameras to capture license plates on the street during an upgrade last year but decided the investment was not worth it. However, we have has some incidents of people taking pictures. It is unclear if they were taking pictures of the house or the kids outside. For obvious reasons, I would like to identify the people. There have been other times that the cameras would have been useful, but this incident brought the deployment options to the table again.

I am running blue iris and using AI to detect people and cars. I have a camera that gives a good side profile of the street/ car, so pairing with a camera focused on plate only would be helpful. I would need 2 cameras as some cars only have 1 plate. Logging of plates would be helpful, but not required. If I was deploying something like that it would be trough BI. The most challenging will be the low light and concealing.

I plan to build a planter, light post or mailbox that would allow mounting. I would like to conceal the cameras so the don't draw attention. This may make the IR unusable as it dose in one of the bird houses I made for other cameras. I have a flood light that spills out in the road, but will not be much help for plate capture due to side profile of light. There are no other street lights on the road. I do have the option of putting in a light post. That would be last option as it involves running 150' of underground wire.

Photos attached
Camera location and direction they would point.
Street view from mailbox/ camera mount location
Night view with driveway light
Night view with capture of car


Looking for recommendations:
cameras that are under $250 us
Mounting options/ ideas
BI license plate integrations or deepstack
Lighting options- if needed.

 

[TonyR]

There are no other street lights on the road. I do have the option of putting in a light post. That would be last option as it involves running 150' of underground wire.

I understand your reluctance to run 150' underground of anything but....how did you intend to power the cameras and communicate with them?

 

[mike james]

I understand your reluctance to run 150' underground of anything but....how did you intend to power the cameras and communicate with them?

Same way I did the others. Underground Cat 6. Cat and 110/220v cant be in the same trench by code.

 

[wittaj]

You do not need visible light. You have to run fast shutter speed (1/2000) and use IR. Picture will be completely black except for head/tail lights and plates.

Need an angle to see the plate. The angles you show get the side of the car, so you would needs to mount it where you can point I down the street to get front and back of plates.

The 5241-Z12E sold by @EMPIRETECANDY is the go to camera for this type of activity.

 

[mike james]

You do not need visible light. You have to run fast shutter speed (1/2000) and use IR. Picture will be completely black except for head/tail lights and plates.

Need an angle to see the plate. The angles you show get the side of the car, so you would needs to mount it where you can point I down the street to get front and back of plates.

The 5241-Z12E sold by @EMPIRETECANDY is the go to camera for this type of activity.

Side profile is of current camera. see 2 pictures of up and down the street showing the top of the mailbox and picture with red markup of camera direction. angle wound not be much...15 degrees?

 

[wittaj]

15 degrees will be fine. I make it work at about 48 degrees at 175 feet away.

If you place it at the street you could probably get by with a 2mp varifocal turret. Will want two - one in each direction.

 

[mike james]

The 5241-Z12E sold by @EMPIRETECANDY is the go to camera for this type of activity.

I think this is the camera I was looking at last year. You think that this would work in a no light application? I may not be able to use the IR of the camera due to reflection once I mount them.

 

[wittaj]

You need IR or a ton of light. I have zero light and just IR bouncing off of reflective plates. The shutter speed needs to be too fast to get moving plates.

Very few have been able to make it work in color at night and those are usually situations at a stop sign and street lights.

 

[mike james]

You need IR or a ton of light. I have zero light and just IR bouncing off of reflective plates. The shutter speed needs to be too fast to get moving plates.

ok. so I will need to mount an external IR or lamp post. Not sure which would draw more attention on my street. I can power the IR over POE. If I did install the light post, my thought was the light would not spill far enough since it would not be a flood light. I will have to look more at IR options. Last I looked into it, the invisible ones did not work with all or most cameras.

 

[wittaj]

You could add external IR offset if the camera IR bounces off your hiding spot. But most people don't notice even if you mounted them right on the mailbox pole.

 

[wittaj]

The likelihood you could add enough white light to get moving plates would be tough. Many cannot get it with street lights.

 

[mike james]

The likelihood you could add enough white light to get moving plates would be tough. Many cannot get it with street lights.

IR it is

 

[looney2ns]

Study this subject area: LPR | IP Cam Talk

 

[rsoxhater]

You could add external IR offset if the camera IR bounces off your hiding spot. But most people don't notice even if you mounted them right on the mailbox pole.

You're right on the road, its a pretty easy install. See a LPR install I did on a post next to a gate, just used one of Andy's higher quality 2-12mm turrets, works perfectly. Short LPR setup with IPC-HDW5231R-ZE

 

[rsoxhater]

A regular high quality camera that close with the built in IR will get the plates quite well since the plates pass almost right by the camera. 1/1000 or 1/2000 exposure and you should be set.

 

[mike james]

A regular high quality camera that close with the built in IR will get the plates quite well since the plates pass almost right by the camera. 1/1000 or 1/2000 exposure and you should be set.

Unable to use built-in IR in this application.

 

[wittaj]

I do not think you need to hide it as well as you think. People are oblivious.

My neighbor is a corner lot so his side fence is literally within 3 feet of the public sidewalk. He has cameras up and down the post at 2 to 4 feet in height and they have never been touched.

Paint them the color of your mailbox post and maybe wrap some fake plant or vine around it and nobody will see it.

 

[mike james]

I do not think you need to hide it as well as you think. People are oblivious.

My neighbor is a corner lot so his side fence is literally within 3 feet of the public sidewalk. He has cameras up and down the post at 2 to 4 feet in height and they have never been touched.

Paint them the color of your mailbox post and maybe wrap some fake plant or vine around it and nobody will see it.

Thank you for the information. This is not a new install so I know the use case here pretty well. Security of the camera will not be an issue as the mounting location has camera coverage already. They will be hidden. The IR will wash back. I will do some testing with external IR and the 2 cameras mentioned so far in the thread.

 

[mike james]

You're right on the road, its a pretty easy install. See a LPR install I did on a post next to a gate, just used one of Andy's higher quality 2-12mm turrets, works perfectly. Short LPR setup with IPC-HDW5231R-ZE

do you have alot of street light in that application? I did some testing with a similar camera and it did not perform well.

 

[wittaj]

I know it is not a new install, I am simply pointing out that you possibly do not need to hide them and simply paint them the color of the post and strap them to the mailbox post and probably be fine and thus be able to use the camera IR...just giving you suggestions based on what others have done as that is what you asked for....

But it can be hidden as well and still use the camera IR if you mount the lens flush to the outside of the object you place it in.

@samplenhold provides a great summary of what he did here:

New to LPR? Considerations Before You Begin

Thought I would throw together a post on my experiences so far with LPR in an effort to help others that are considering running down that rabbit hole. There are some practical considerations you should know about LPR. I am approaching this from the position of using Blue Iris and Plate...

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