Dahua 5216P, Panasonic cameras and PAL vs NTSC

[BlackFox]

As a few of us discovered in the firmware update thread - it looks like there are a number of vendors selling PAL format Dahua NVRs to the North America market without really noting they're PAL anywhere on their ads. I didn't realize it until I went to upgrade the firmware :mad-new:. After installing HDs and working on it for a few weeks, though - I suspect my opportunity to swap or return it is over, so I'm trying to figure out how to make it work. I'm hoping someone with more experience may have some pointers, though, because I'm stumped.

PAL vs NTSC
Before I updated my firmware, the menu had an option to work in NTSC or PAL mode, which seemed like it may work around the format issues. After upgrading to the latest firmware, however, that option is no longer available. It is set in PAL mode only now, and the NTSC firmware would NOT install. This seems like a huge drawback to applying a firmware update if you're stuck with a PAL NVR! I believe PAL only works in 25 fps and with some odd resolution and frequency settings. Is it as simple as changing the camera settings to be compatible? I know the 25 fps is an option on the cameras, although I suspect there's little one can configure beyond that. A normal monitor works fine with the NVR, so the camera stream seems to be the only concern. Replacing several thousand dollars of cameras to work around a few hundred dollar NVR is obviously not an option.


Panasonic Camera compatibility
Prior to the firmware upgrade, I was operating the NVR in NTSC - and could never get the NVR to discover my cameras. The light on the camera config screen remained red, and I never saw any video of course. For better or worse, I standardized on the Panasonic outdoor dome IP camera line (primarily the WV-NW484s). I have about a dozen of them installed, and they work great via web browser. I still can't get my NVR to discover them, though. I use a 192.168.1/24 network on the front end (like most I suspect), and left the NVRs 10.1.1/24 network on the camera side (since that's how it came configured). I was able to view the cameras from a laptop on the 10.x segment, but the NVR would never discover them. I manually configured them in the configuration menu, of course (using custom settings and the Panasonic native settings), but could never get the green light on the camera config screen. I'm unclear whether this is related to the NTSC vs PAL issue - because they wouldn't discover while in NTSC mode. Does anyone who's worked on the Dahua NVRs have any pointers?

Thanks all!

 

[icerabbit]

For the second part.

I would think that you need to configure your cams to be 192.168.1.number. All cameras and other equipment either come with DHCP where they grab a number on the LAN they see or they get a factory number, which the user must change during the initial setup, so that it matches their network and connects to the home's router which is typically set at 192.168.0.1 or 192.168.1.1 or some such number. So when you are running the cams on 10.10.1.1 and your router and NVR on 192.168.0.x they are on different networks as far as they're concerned.

 

[BlackFox]

Good ideas, although the Dahua requires the front network be a different range than the network the security cameras reside on. It's basically acting as a router, which I want (because it keeps the security cam traffic off the main network, and restricts untrusted access from untrusted devices). That's the way the Dahua NVRs work as far as I can tell. I'm well familiar with DHCP versus static and other networking issues (I used to work for Cisco Systems). I think the assumption here is that the front end (LAN) versus back end (security cams) are on different network segments.....

 

[n4gry]

I think the first step is to determine just what you have. There is a 52 series NVR an a 52P series. The main difference is the 52P series has built in POE and requires two power supply's.


Here is a picture of the back of the 52 series...


View attachment 598

and here is the back of the 52P series...


View attachment 599

For now don't worry about the Pal vs NTSC.. The first step is to get it to "SEE" the cameras.

 

[BlackFox]

Sorry, n4gry - should have mentioned that up front! It's the 5216P (with 8 POE ports). I'm running direct connections from the cameras to the POE ports. The POE ports do power the cameras, and the cameras are working. All cables are CAT-6 and tested.

 

[n4gry]

This is a bad thing to do... BUT, I will assume you do have the 52P series and camera connections on the back...

Ifyou do have the 52P please be aware that the camera inputs are more a switch (withPOE) and NOT a router!
FromNetwork->Network Server->Switch, you can set switch IP address, subnetmask, gateway and etc.


View attachment 600


Yes, the switch needs an IP address…

Good luck!!

might help

 

[BlackFox]

Hey n4gry - I sent an email this morning, but in the meantime will follow up here as well. I completely understand what you're getting at, and definitely had read the manual. The manual provided does a great job of telling you where to go to change a setting. It gives you absolutely nothing on how the NVR should be set up, though, which leaves me flying a bit blind. I'm definitely interested in hearing your experience.

So two things led me to believe the NVR acts as a router rather than a switch:

(1) the default values under settings -> Network is for a Network IP value in the 192.168.1/24 range. The Network Setting button leads to the Network Setting window you captured above, which allows one to set the Switch Settings. The default value for the Switch Setting is a 10.1.1.1/24 address range. The NVR comes with two completely different networks established for LAN versus the camera networks.

(2) If I attempt to put both settings to the same network segment (in this case, 192.168.1/24) - I get the following error message when I attempt to save from the Network Setting window: "Switch and the device shall not (be) in the same network segment."

I'm using different IPs, of course, and have tried several combinations, but it sure looks like the NVR wants these two values to be on different network segments (particularly based on the message in blue above).

I have no doubt I'm missing something obvious! Again, I greatly appreciate any feedback or advice here....

UPDATE: just to keep this thread fresh for anyone who looks at it later - the 5216P DOES act like a router. I've confirmed this via multiple websites, and the software does require the IPCam network be different from the LAN interface. If anybody is interested, I used 192.168.1.x on the LAN, and 192.168.2.x on the IPCam Network.

 

[maggel]

Hello everyone, just wanted to share my experience with the same issue posted here. In order for the POE cameras to work you need to make sure 2 things. First make sure that the POE cams are in DHCP so as to take an IP from the dahua POE switch. Secondly in Dahua configuration "remote device" make sure that on each POE camera you have inserted the correct user name and password (that is camera user name and pass). When these are met the cameras will go green.

 

[BlackFox]

All - just wanted to keep this thread updated in case it helps someone in the future. I still haven't solved the problem, but am getting closer. Here's an update:

* The Dahua 5216P (and any of their POE devices) DO act like a router. You have to set the camera network to be a different subnet than your LAN.
* I HAVE gotten a green Status on the Dahua config manager, but cannot get video yet. I cannot access the camera behind the NVR/router, but when I move it to the LAN I can access via web browser.
* N4gry has actually been helping me a lot offline, and has suggested that having to use RTSP is common. He suggested I find the right URL to use at http://www.soleratec.com/support/rtsp/rtsp_listing, and use that in the device config. I had to configure the device as "General" versus "Panasonic" (to get the full URL option). Further, he suggested a few URLs like this:

rtsp://192.168.1.22:554/ip_adx/mediainput/mpeg4

rtsp://192.168.1.22:554/ip_adx/mediainput/mpeg4.sdp

rtsp://192.168.1.22:554/ip_adx/mediainput/mpeg4.sdp?

Lastly, I've read that these URL strings often have to include the username and password, so am trying URLs like this:

rtsp://192.168.2.106:554/user=admin&password=admin&channel=1&stream=0//mediainput/mpeg4.sdp?

I'm in the middle of trying all the URL combinations I can think of, and will report back when I've tried them all. Thanks again everyone!

 

[BlackFox]

Hello everyone, just wanted to share my experience with the same issue posted here. In order for the POE cameras to work you need to make sure 2 things. First make sure that the POE cams are in DHCP so as to take an IP from the dahua POE switch. Secondly in Dahua configuration "remote device" make sure that on each POE camera you have inserted the correct user name and password (that is camera user name and pass). When these are met the cameras will go green.

Hmm - I never want to discount feedback like this, but I'm struggling with the idea that you MUST use DHCP for the cameras. I can't imagine that's a requirement, but I'll give that a try too!

 

[maggel]

Hmm - I never want to discount feedback like this, but I'm struggling with the idea that you MUST use DHCP for the cameras. I can't imagine that's a requirement, but I'll give that a try too!

You are right. Actually you can use static as well but then you have to add the remote devices manually while when in DHCP mode the channels will come up automatically with an ethernet icon on the top left and then after setting user name and password they go green and video comes up.

 

[BlackFox]

Looks like I've hit a dead end. I tried every one of the URLs above in every combination I can think of - no joy. I get the green light on the status screen, but never see video. I tried the DHCP option like maggel mentioned. Clicking "Device Search" on the camera tab produces no results. I know the cameras are working. I have them up all day on my browser via a direct connection. I've run out of ideas about how to get the NVR to recognize and get video from the cameras, though.

The irony is that I bought a prepackaged NVR because I didn't have time to deal with the headaches of building my own on a PC platform. Right now my guess is that I'm out several hundred dollars on the NVR, and have wasted more time than it would have taken just to build something myself . I'm really not impressed with the Dahua NVR line at the moment.....

 

[Shockwave199]

You're talking about Panasonic cameras? It's a crap shoot for anything third-party regardless of what compatibility is stated. In that case I think it comes down to onvif compatibility. If there's any way to set the cameras to onvif, do so. Also there's something about the private setting for the manufacturer in the nvr too I remember hearing about. Maybe change that and see if they show up?

 

[maggel]

Just a quick note. Since you say you have the cams up and running all day on your browser, I was wondering how you are connected with your Pc to the cameras? I mean since the POE switch is a private network by default to the 10.1.1.xxx subnet how are you connecting to the cameras Web interface...? I wonder that cause the only way I manage to do that is by connecting my Pc with a second ethernet connected on a free POE switch port configured on the POE subnet..
Also I have to second what Shockwave 199 suggests about onvif. All my hikvision cams are onvif compatible and that's how they are configured on tha dahua. I never managed to connect my older vivotek cams which were not onvif compatible.

 

[BlackFox]

Just a quick note. Since you say you have the cams up and running all day on your browser, I was wondering how you are connected with your Pc to the cameras? I mean since the POE switch is a private network by default to the 10.1.1.xxx subnet how are you connecting to the cameras Web interface...? I wonder that cause the only way I manage to do that is by connecting my Pc with a second ethernet connected on a free POE switch port configured on the POE subnet..
Also I have to second what Shockwave 199 suggests about onvif. All my hikvision cams are onvif compatible and that's how they are configured on tha dahua. I never managed to connect my older vivotek cams which were not onvif compatible.

Yeah, was trying to keep it simple - most of my cameras are on the LAN (not the subnet behind the NVR), and I'm just using one as a guinea pig on the subnet. I've also been able to plug a laptop in to the back of the NVR and see the test camera there.

Off to look at onvif today then. I have the Panasonic onvif tools already, so let's give that a try. Thanks again everyone!

 

[BlackFox]

So after hitting a wall with what seemed to be a straight-up compatibility issue between the Dahua and my Panasonic cameras - onvif seemed to be the path forward. Unfortunately, after installing all the Panasonic onvif tools and getting everything configured - I couldn't get the onvif tools to recognize any of my cameras. Sure enough, when I went to the Panasonic onvif compatibility page (at http://security.panasonic.com/pss/security/products/hd/onvif/index2.html) - onvif is only supported with the next level up camera (I have the WV-NW484S, and onvif support began with the WV-NW502S models).

To sum up - I have roughly 10 Panasonic WV-NW484S cameras installed, they have green lights on the Dahua "Set" tab. It looks like my NVR is set to PAL, but I don't know if that's significant or not at this stage. I have never been able to view video from the cameras via the NVR. I can view video via a PC. I tried RTSC, but could never get that to work. My cameras are NOT onvif compatible. It looks like the Dahua NVR is not going to work with the Panasonic cameras, and I have 10x the money in cameras (installed) than I do the NVR. I suspect this means I'm officially out of options, and just wasted 4 months and $800 on an NVR that won't work :mad-new:. Comparable Panasonic NVRs run ~$2,500, so it looks like I have a bitter pill to swallow.....

Thanks again for all the help everyone. It is much appreciated. I'll probably post my barely used Dahua NVR in the for sale forum soon.

 

[rtsp_guy]

Here is another site with a really detailed list of ip-camera manufacturers along with the RTSP URL listings... Seems to have even more companies and camera models then the other sites listed... Hope this helps someone else too.


http://www.securityhive.com/rtsp