Help with deciding which camera to go with...

The images in the thread I linked in Post #10 above are all the 5442 forced into color.

Most here do not run the full camera camera with the white LED lights on - causes way more bugs than IR and makes it obvious there is a camera and the dispersion isn't all that great.

wittaj

Thread 'The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection'

At the urging of several folks here, I created a thread to show the importance of focal length and how focal length can be more important than megapixels (MP).

I mentioned some of this in the post regarding The Hookup’s latest video demonstrating different cameras, including one sold from a forum favorite here @EMPIRETECANDY , but this post will put it all in one place where we can point a NOOB to. The cameras I am highlighting were purchased from @EMPIRETECANDY

Almost every big box store, consumer grade cameras and all-in-one-box kits come with either 2.8mm or 3.6mm...
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Ri22o said:
No, I don't run the onboard LEDs, I have 1500 lumen bulbs in my coach lights. They give enough light for the 4K-X, but it's still too dark for the T54IR-ZE to be ran in color. I do have IR floods across the front of the house that give more light for it to be ran in B/W though.
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That's very impressive for night color without having to use the built in white camera LEDs. The night time clarity on that 4K-X is very nice with only your exterior lights on.

Would be nice to see a comparison between the Color4K-X 3.6mm and 6mm. I think the smaller field of view from the 6mm will work well for me given that camera will be sitting between two side walls. :idk:
 
wittaj said:
The images in the thread I linked in Post #10 above are all the 5442 forced into color.
Click to expand...
Not bad for forced color on the IR. Almost looks like my doorbell night camera whereas the nighttime color and picture quality is not as clear and sharp as natural daylight would produce.


Although, it seems as if a camera that is equipped with the white LED's is turned off, the night color can still look very nice (with sharper quality image) with just your exterior lighting on as compared to the forced color through IR equipped cameras.

I'm only coming to this conclusion based on the photos Ri22o listed (post #17) which showed the Color4K-X at night time with the white LEDs turned off.

Would this be considered a valid assumption?
 
wittaj said:
Most here do not run the full camera camera with the white LED lights on - causes way more bugs than IR and makes it obvious there is a camera and the dispersion isn't all that great.
Click to expand...



True, bugs do get attracted to lighting although I have four exterior lights mounted on the exterior of our home that comes on automatically at dusk and turns off at dawn. Not too much issues at all with bugs flying around. Don't know if these camera leds would attract bugs any more than what I have now.

I also feel that by having the white LED lights on it could serve as a deterrence. In all honesty, If I was scoping a neighborhood or just up to no good, and noticed a home with a security camera I wouldn't bother messing with the home or touching anything in plain view of it. I would move on to the house next door that doesn't seem to have any visible cameras and were they have no exterior front lights ever turned on.

I believe most thief's would rather not be caught in front of a camera let alone a well light place.

Having a camera hiding takes away from this type of visual deterrence. A thief may attempt a break in not knowing there was a camera outside that could have been the initial deterrence and the story may end in a bad way. It's kind of like having an alarm security system, but disabling the siren at night before going to bed. Heh. :)


I may also very well end up feeling different about all this If I actually owned one of those types of security cameras with the obnoxious white LED's lights, and it sounds like with enough exterior lighting I may not even need to have the white LED lights on.


Decisions, Decisions. :confused:

I'll say, what we really need is a good high quality optical zoom/varifocal camera that has good color night vision. Not just forced IR color but one that is equipped with both white LED's and IR. EmpireTech should have something like this.
 
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As a comparison, this is the view using a Dahua 180 degree camera. The white camera LED's are off. The lighting is from an above garage door 15 watt white LED garden flood light.

Driveway .jpg

In the below image the Dahua 6mm 1/1.2 5849T1 is mounted next to the 180 degree camera.

Driveway Narrow.jpg
 
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Termin8r said:
Not bad for forced color on the IR. Almost looks like my doorbell night camera whereas the nighttime color and picture quality is not as clear and sharp as natural daylight would produce.


Although, it seems as if a camera that is equipped with the white LED's is turned off, the night color can still look very nice (with sharper quality image) with just your exterior lighting on as compared to the forced color through IR equipped cameras.

I'm only coming to this conclusion based on the photos Ri22o listed (post #17) which showed the Color4K-X at night time with the white LEDs turned off.

Would this be considered a valid assumption?
Click to expand...

Keep in mind that the 4K-X has a much larger sensor so it collects more light than the 5442.
 
Termin8r said:
That's very impressive for night color without having to use the built in white camera LEDs. The night time clarity on that 4K-X is very nice with only your exterior lights on.

Would be nice to see a comparison between the Color4K-X 3.6mm and 6mm. I think the smaller field of view from the 6mm will work well for me given that camera will be sitting between two side walls. :idk:
Click to expand...
There is a thread on here comparing those two focal lengths. I will see if I can find it.
 
K

Thread 'Color4K-X 6mm FOV vs T5442T-ZE'

I plan to replace existing T5442T-ZE with Color4K-X in 6mm, but I'm not sure if FOV will meet my needs.

I read a good thread from Alaska Country (Color 4K-X-6MM vs Color 4K-X-3.6MM (HFW5849T1-ASE-LED) Side by Side Test Images), comparing 4K-X in 3.6mm and 6mm.
Also one good thread comparing varifocal 5442 and fixed lens 5442 FOV (Comparison of a Fixed Lens and a Varifocal Lens Camera's FOV)

I'm not sure if mine calculations are correct:
fov comparisson.jpg


Does anybody has side by side 4K-X 6mm and T5442T-ZE and confirm me what zoom level results in same FOV?
 
Alaska Country said:
As a comparison, this is the view using a Dahua 180 degree camera. The white camera LED's are off. The lighting is from an above garage door 15 watt white LED garden flood light.

In the below image the Dahua 6mm 1/1.2 5849T1 is mounted next to the 180 degree camera.
Click to expand...
Thanks for showing those shots. That 6mm does provide a nice close up shot, yet cuts out a bit of the surrounding area.

I can see how it would be ideal to have that type of setup with two cameras close to each other. One for the wider overview and the other 6mm for more close up.
 
Ri22o said:
There is a thread on here comparing those two focal lengths. I will see if I can find it.
Click to expand...
Thanks for showing that comparison with the different focal lengths lined out. Such a helpful photo. That's quite the difference from 3.6mm to 6mm. That 6mm crops out a good bit of the area.
 
I just came across this empire tech 2.7mm-13.5mm vari-focal ptz camera.

Empire Tech 2.7mm-13.5mm vari-focal PTZ Camera

Are those warm white led lights used for color night vision? Is this a IR and white led lights combination?


It does look like it has a smaller sensor at 1/2.8 compared to the 1/1.8 and is only 4MP. But the optical zoom sounds like I would be able to clock this at the ideal spot as necessary (and it's priced at about the same as the IPC-Color4K-X).
 
Just buy 3-4 possible candidate cameras and tinker around with them.
You WILL use them all eventually.
Cameras multiply Like Rabbits
 
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Termin8r said:
Thanks for showing that comparison with the different focal lengths lined out. Such a helpful photo. That's quite the difference from 3.6mm to 6mm. That 6mm crops out a good bit of the area.
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It's a link, no clue why it made it look like a quote. There is more information in that post.
Termin8r said:
I just came across this empire tech 2.7mm-13.5mm vari-focal ptz camera.

Empire Tech 2.7mm-13.5mm vari-focal PTZ Camera

Are those warm white led lights used for color night vision? Is this a IR and white led lights combination?


It does look like it has a smaller sensor at 1/2.8 compared to the 1/1.8 and is only 4MP. But the optical zoom sounds like I would be able to clock this at the ideal spot as necessary (and it's priced at about the same as the IPC-Color4K-X).
Click to expand...
You don't want that. 4MP should not be on a 1/2.8 sensor.
 
This is a super helpful thread! I'm also in the market for cameras again (after c.12months), and can't decide between the IPC-54-IR-ZE-S3 or the IPC-Colour4K-1/1.2 with 3.6mm lens.

I'll try and get some photos uploaded, my biggest concern is the front of the house which has a streetlight, so any trespassers are backlit!

I've only got c.8m between the road and the deepest part of my driveway, the long minimum focus distance of the 4K (6m!?!) makes me think it won't be suitable- mounted on the back of my house overlooking my drive, 4m long car is all within the close focus distance...??
 
Flintstone61 said:
Just buy 3-4 possible candidate cameras and tinker around with them.
You WILL use them all eventually.
Cameras multiply Like Rabbits
Click to expand...
Yes, I can see how that can easily happen. :)

Just a few days ago I was thinking about going with the 4k-X 6mm, now I'm wondering if maybe the 3.6mm would serve me better. I should just buy them both for starters. I'm sure I'll end up finding the ideal placement location for each one after moving them around some.
 
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Ri22o said:
You don't want that. 4MP should not be on a 1/2.8 sensor.
Click to expand...
OK, thanks for that tip. I'll stay away from the 1/2.8 sensors.

EmpireTech should have a PTZ camera on a 1/1.8 sensor that has them warm white lights for full night color.

If I were to zoom into a desired distance on a IPC-Color4K-X 3.6mm camera (using the software) and hold it there for surveillance, will I still have a sharp focus or will zooming in create or cause some blurring?
 
Termin8r said:
OK, thanks for that tip. I'll stay away from the 1/2.8 sensors.

EmpireTech should have a PTZ camera on a 1/1.8 sensor that has them warm white lights for full night color.

If I were to zoom into a desired distance on a IPC-Color4K-X 3.6mm camera (using the software) and hold it there for surveillance, will I still have a sharp focus or will zooming in create or cause some blurring?
Click to expand...
Digital zoom is never ideal. Always try to use optical zoom.
 
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