IP Cameras Effect on Network Bandwidth

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I am wanting to switch from my current analog camera/DVR system to IP camera/NVR and take advantage of PoE option. My concern is the extra bandwidth required for multiple IP cameras on my home network. With streaming TV, Alexa smart devices, wireless gateways, and phones already taxing my wireless router should I setup a 2nd home network dedicated to home security?

Has anyone else already been through this scenario and able to offer some guidance and/or suggestions?
 

Mark_M

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I am wanting to switch from my current analog camera/DVR system to IP camera/NVR and take advantage of PoE option. My concern is the extra bandwidth required for multiple IP cameras on my home network
Just like those analogue cameras, network IP cameras have their own cable back to the recording device.

Look at this photo of an NVR (network video recorder). It has 16 ports for 16 cameras.
1654690183220.png

You CAN get complicated and mix the cameras into your main home network, but 95% of the time it SHOULD be isolated.
Isolated for security reasons too.

should I setup a 2nd home network dedicated to home security?
The ports on that NVR make it's own network and the NVR controls that network
 

The Automation Guy

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You can certainly isolate the cameras on their own network switch or DVR. Many will argue that this is the best solution. Certainly if you are using a router supplied by your service provider or an inexpensive "all in one" consumer grade router, it is probably best to keep the CCTV traffic off of it.

However, depending on what network gear you run, it's possible that you can run everything together. If you use something like pfSense or a more robust firewall/router device, it will likely have enough processing power to support it. Personally I have a pfSense firewall running on an old HP t620plus thin client. I have somewhere around 75 devices on my network (12 cameras, 9 PBX phones, about 10 TVs/streaming devices, 30+ wifi lighting devices, other networked automation devices (most are not IP controlled, but RS-232), mobile devices, computers, printers, gaming consoles, etc, etc, etc). While I have many VLANs (virtual lans), the devices are not physically isolated from one another. My system works just fine without any noticeable bottlenecks.
 

hajalie24

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IP cameras don't use a lot of bandwidth. Like maybe 8mbps max. And keep in mind this is all local bandwidth too. It shouldn't affect your outbound bandwidth, so streaming, youtube, etc will all be unaffected.
 

wittaj

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IP cameras don't use a lot of bandwidth. Like maybe 8mbps max. And keep in mind this is all local bandwidth too. It shouldn't affect your outbound bandwidth, so streaming, youtube, etc will all be unaffected.
Cameras going thru a wifi router can absolutely impact the rest of the system. We have countless people come here with problems and once they isolated the cameras and removed them from the wifi router, everything cleared up.

You would be surprised how quickly that data adds up.

My cameras are on their own isolated network that does not touch the router or the internet. On my isolated NIC, my cameras are streaming between 280Mbps to 350Mbps depending on motion. This is full-on, never stopping to take a breath. Even if someone has a gigabit router, a 3rd of non-buffering 24/7 data will impact its speed.

People will say stuff like "we stream 5 TVs with no problem". Yeah that is because streaming services like Netflix and others buffer the video. It may buffer 15 seconds to a minute or more of video. This allows it to send some video, pause to let something else on the network use the internet, send some more video, and repeat process.

These cameras do not buffer and all full-on nonstop. Pull the ethernet cable and the surveillance camera stops instantly. Pull the internet cable while watching Netflix and you may get an additional minute of watching the video.

Cameras connected to Wifi routers (whether wifi or not) are problematic for surveillance cameras because they are always streaming and passing data. And the data demands go up with motion and then you lose signal. A lost packet and it has to resend. It can bring the whole network down if trying to send cameras through a wifi router. At the very least it can slow down your entire system.

Unlike Netflix and other streaming services that buffer a movie, these cameras do not buffer up part of the video, so drop outs are frequent. You would be amazed how much streaming services buffer - don't believe me, start watching something and unplug your router and watch how much longer you can watch NetFlix before it freezes - mine goes 45 seconds. Now do the same with a camera connected to a router and it is fairly instantaneous (within the latency of the stream itself)...

The same issue applies even with the hard-wired cameras trying to send all this non-buffer video stream through a router. Most consumer grade wifi routers are not designed to pass the constant video stream data of cameras, and since they do not buffer, you get these issues. The consumer routers are just not designed for this kind of traffic, even a GB speed router.

So the more cameras you add, the bigger the potential for issues.
 

hajalie24

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I will keep an eye out myself as I add more cameras.

I do not think it is a big deal though, you can avoid traffic going through the router by connecting the NVR / PC to the same switch (or to another switch connected to the switch). The devices are smart enough to know the data doesn't need to pass through the router.

Regarding the buffering example - I don't see how it makes much of a difference, you're still buffering the whole time up to the end of the show.

# of devices in general matters more, especially wireless devices. This is because the router needs to keep track of all devices, plus the devices will have random wifi bursts that the router needs to handle dynamically. Just keep an eye out on the CPU and memory usage of the router as you add more devices.

All in all though, in terms of pure bandwidth, IP cameras are miniscule in comparison to other common network devices, such as a server or NAS.
 

wittaj

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I will keep an eye out myself as I add more cameras.

I do not think it is a big deal though, you can avoid traffic going through the router by connecting the NVR / PC to the same switch (or to another switch connected to the switch). The devices are smart enough to know the data doesn't need to pass through the router.

Regarding the buffering example - I don't see how it makes much of a difference, you're still buffering the whole time up to the end of the show.

# of devices in general matters more, especially wireless devices. This is because the router needs to keep track of all devices, plus the devices will have random wifi bursts that the router needs to handle dynamically. Just keep an eye out on the CPU and memory usage of the router as you add more devices.

All in all though, in terms of pure bandwidth, IP cameras are miniscule in comparison to other common network devices, such as a server or NAS.
Many people unfortunately have their cameras routing thru their wifi router and it causes problems. Countless examples of folks coming here with issues and were doing just that and cleared up after they removed that data stream out of the router. You would be surprised how many let their router assign an IP address to their cameras, which then forces it to route it.

Again, because these cameras do not buffer, if the router gets "overloaded" and has a lost packet, it has to resend. It can bring the whole network down if trying to send cameras through a wifi router. At the very least it can slow down your entire system.

With a streaming device like a Netflix, because of the buffering, the router is taking "breaks" as it routes and deals with other devices on the system and then comes back to the Netflix stream and loads up a bit of that and then goes and does other things.

These cameras provide NON-STOP data streaming and as such can provide a constant load that some of the routers will have trouble with.

As I mentioned, on my isolated NIC, my cameras are streaming between 280Mbps to 350Mbps depending on motion. This is full-on, never stopping to take a breath. Even if someone has a gigabit router, a 3rd of non-buffering 24/7 data will impact its speed. I wouldn't call 350Mbps minuscule LOL.

1654718077298.png
 

Flintstone61

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Heres what comin down the pipe from Blue Iris and my DVR/XVR. The Dvr is streaming out to my switch, over to BI PC, so 33 Megabit per/second passing thru my router/switch to PC. everybody else is on WIFI. no issues here. Verizon home internet @ 300 Mbps down 26 Mbps up.
Screenshot 2022-06-08 153215.jpgScreenshot 2022-06-08 153522.jpg
 
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Thanks to all that have opened my eyes. I will proceed with caution as I experiment with a new setup while digesting this learning curve.
 

eeeeesh

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I kind of went to towards the extreme. I have (4) different networks. LAN and WIFI are what I consider to be 'secure'. Only computers and other trusted devices are on these two networks. Then I have two 'dirty' networks, one hardwired and one WiFi. IP Cams are on the hardwired (IOTL - Internet Of Things Lan) and other devices (thermostats, roomba's etc are on IOTW (Internet of Things WiFi. For my two WiFi networks, one uses an ORBi mesh system and the other uses an old router running in access point mode.

What makes this all work, a someone else mentioned is the free software - PfSense, running on a 6 port minicomputer. 1 port for WAN and then the 4 ports for my 4 subnets. It's a little complicated, but I enjoyed the challenge setting it all up and I am please in how everything works out.

I bought this directly from China (Yanling is the Manufacturer) but now with shipping the way it is, there is not much savings. I run ESXI 6.7 on it with VM's for pfSense and a Win10 VM for my HomeSeer (home automation) software

Lastly, I was very frustrated with consumer grade wifi routers - especially trying to setup static IP's for all my devices. For the most part, they don't have enough memory to accomplish this (I have 150 static IP's listed :eek: )

T22-1015.jpg
 

newbury

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Good thread -
I've about 40 or so Wyze cams on 3 sites/routers. One site with 10 cams is on a decrepit ISP, I get about 6Mbps down/0.7 Mbps up on a good day. When I try to view remote if I try and pull up more than 2 cams it's iffy. The app often tells me to choose a lower resolution.
BUT they are supposed to install fiber in a month and I'll have 100 Mbps up and down - for about the same price I had been paying :)
Of course 0.7Mbps still beats the 300 baud modem I started with! (back in 1984)
 
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