Line-Crossing (Tripwire) vs. Motion Detection?

[tigerwillow1]

I am surprised by your report. I will admit that headlights are problematic with IVS, but the triggers from shadows should be way down. You could try experimenting with the minimum object size with bugs. Excuse me for asking the dumb question, did you turn motion detection off? All of my cameras are outdoors and for me the operation of IVS over motion detection is huge.

 

[Dramus]

Motion detection was still triggering recording, but not notifications. As dark fell and the night progressed I started getting a bunch of notifications from the front two cameras. Looked at the recordings. Headlights. All headlights. I disabled notification on IVS. Tomorrow I'll probably remove all the IVS rules in the cameras, since they're just config clutter to me.

Minimum object size won't cut it. A bug close up "looks" bigger to the camera than a human or car much further away.

 

[HMC8403]

What I can't figure out. I have an intrusion box drawn and both appear and cross selected but the Dahua NVR stops recording with the people still walking within. How do I get the recording to continue until the target leaves the area?

I can increase the Post-Record but to what? Some people can pass the box in 5 seconds but someone up to no good could hang around for minutes.
View attachment Home_ch3_20200817160151_20200817160206.mp4

 

[ArnonZ]

I'm using both IVS and MD but I use both with human filter (SMD and IVS for human).
none of them works perfect yet I trust the IVS better. Mainly intrusion.
In my scenario, the IVS would trigger the alarm while the SMD is used to surveillance - the IVS is used to check if anyone enters the property while the SMD is used to check also outside and does not trigger the alarm.

 

[aristobrat]

I'm going to have to toss these Dahua cameras for something with IR motion detection.

Unless things have changed over the last few months, there aren't any ultra-low-light cameras with PIR.

Before you ditch your current camera system, see if you can rustle up an old PC and play around with the Blue Iris demo for a week or two. While it supports letting the cameras do motion detection and IVS/Smart Events, it also has its own built-in motion detection with a few unique things, like the ability to draw multiple zones on your image and only have it trigger if an object traverses through the zones in a specific order, etc. This can often be useful for filtering out headlights that only swipe through a specific range of a scene.

Also, there are two open projects that integrate AI into Blue Iris by installing a third-party AI package locally on the PC and then creating a workflow that runs motion detection images from BI through the AI. It seems like folks are having good success with having this AI filter out non-relevant stuff like lights, etc without having to setup more complex Blue Iris motion detection rules. It doesn't look like a cake walk to get either project setup, but there's enough folks posting in the threads that it doesn't appear to be rocket science either. I'm pretty sure I read where BI is supposed to get a feature like this built in to a future update, but I can't find where I read that at the moment.

AI motion detection with BlueIris: an alternate approach
[tool] [tutorial] Free AI Person Detection for Blue Iris

 

[aristobrat]

I can increase the Post-Record but to what? Some people can pass the box in 5 seconds but someone up to no good could hang around for minutes.

If you play the IVS recording back in SmartPSS with the option enabled that shows the boxes around the detected object/rules, I was curious if the camera is losing track of the people (i.e. object box goes away) as they are walking.

In any event, are you also recording continuously so you can still continue to play back the recording after the IVS event ends?

 

[Dramus]

Unless things have changed over the last few months, there aren't any ultra-low-light cameras with PIR.

Thing is: For my purposes, the el-cheapo Reolink wireless, battery-powered camera that used to be by the front door was more useful than these Dahua cameras + the Synology Surveillance Station.

Before you ditch your current camera system, see if you can rustle up an old PC and play around with the Blue Iris ...

That isn't going to happen, but thanks for the suggestion.

 

[biggen]

I run both IVS outdoors and BI motion detection outdoors and I'm not getting any of the false positives you are getting. I'm not sure why its giving you fits. Motion detection for BI can really really be tuned and dialed in. Occasionally a bug will crawl across the camera lens but that is really the only false positive I ever get from BI motion detection. But if you are already discounting it then it doesn't mater.

The only issue I ever have with IVS is headlights at night on the roadway triggering the tripwire a bit too early sometimes. So the snapshot is from the car before it actually gets to the tripwire. But never do shadows, leaves, etc.. cause false positives from any of cameras I'm using IVS on. Strange indeed...

 

[Dramus]

The only issue I ever have with IVS is headlights at night on the roadway triggering the tripwire a bit too early sometimes.

Problem is: We're on the outside of a curve in the road about two doors down in one direction, and we're a cross-street one door down in the opposite direction. So we get a lot of headlights sweeping the front yard.

But never do shadows, leaves, etc.. cause false positives from any of cameras I'm using IVS on. Strange indeed...

Shadows from trees when the wind blows, causing those shadows to move back-and-forth across a tripwire, doesn't trigger it?

I'm really not particularly surprised by what I'm experiencing. Disappointed, yes. Surprised, no.

I might be able to fix it by setting max size. Got too much else going on, right now. Something for another day.

 

[aristobrat]

Thing is: For my purposes, the el-cheapo Reolink wireless, battery-powered camera that used to be by the front door was more useful than these Dahua cameras + the Synology Surveillance Station.

Everyone's environment is different, do what works best in yours.

 

[biggen]

Problem is: We're on the outside of a curve in the road about two doors down in one direction, and we're a cross-street one door down in the opposite direction. So we get a lot of headlights sweeping the front yard.

Ah ok I can see how that would be a pain. I'm not on a cross street of any kind so headlights never sweep my lawn.

Shadows from trees when the wind blows, causing those shadows to move back-and-forth across a tripwire, doesn't trigger it?

I have BI dialed in for motion during the daytime to mask off and ignore areas near trees from neighbors or on the road. But I don't have any trees in my front yard that can be seen from the camera. All of my trees are palm trees and they are close to the house and almost behind the camera's FOV. Nothing out in the grass. I'm not sure how well you can "fine tune" motion settings with the Synology but it would be nice if you could mask of some of the problem areas. Perhaps using that instead of IVS. I run IVS only at night just so I have snapshots of the previous nights events waiting for me in a shared folder for review in the morning while getting ready to head out.

Don't give up on it yet especially since you purchased new equipment. Might just need some tinkering.

 

[Dramus]

I have BI dialed in for motion during the daytime to mask off and ignore areas near trees from neighbors or on the road.

The tree shadow problems are in the back yard. If I masked-off everywhere there were tree shadows, I'd essentially be masking-off everything.

Oh well, it is what it is.

Thanks for the feedback and suggestions, everybody!

 

[bigredfish]

I have great success with my 5442s and Tripwire on a Dahua NVR. I use the human/vehicle AI options and rare;y get a false alert across my drive .

The one that has the line across the street sends me an email snap between midnight and 4am for vehicles going right to left only. Very reliable all around. Now I will ocassionally get a false alert when the 3400 lumen floods come on, but thats ok as its probably something I want to see anyway
.


The Entrance camera does very well also, no false alerts from traffic headlights. The single line gets vehicles and the zigzag only pics up humans crossing. Work great

 

[HMC8403]

I have great success with my 5442s and Tripwire on a Dahua NVR. I use the human/vehicle AI options and rare;y get a false alert across my drive .

The one that has the line across the street sends me an email snap between midnight and 4am for vehicles going right to left only. Very reliable all around. Now I will ocassionally get a false alert when the 3400 lumen floods come on, but thats ok as its probably something I want to see anyway
View attachment 68918.


The Entrance camera does very well also, no false alerts from traffic headlights. The single line gets vehicles and the zigzag only pics up humans crossing. Work great
View attachment 68919

So do you select Cross and Appear, and then also select AI, Human, Vehicle in each rule?

 

[bigredfish]

Cross and Appear both on Intrusion box yes. Tripwire doesnt have that. Human and vehicle on most, but on one in fron of the house crossing the street just vehicle and the walkway at the entrance just human.

I do think I have an advantage with running color at night and having plenty of ambient light to be honest.

 

[HMC8403]

Cross and Appear both on Intrusion box yes. Tripwire doesnt have that. Human and vehicle on most, but on one in fron of the house crossing the street just vehicle and the walkway at the entrance just human.

I do think I have an advantage with running color at night and having plenty of ambient light to be honest.

Thanks, I will give it a try next time I remote in.

Do you do the settings on the camera or the NVR? I don’t see a difference, they seem to update each other. Most of my camera GUIs are not accessible via the NVR and being away my only option is to do it via the NVRs AI settings.

 

[bigredfish]

I make all changes/settings on the cameras themselves. Ive found that the NVR is best for recording and other common functions but have had enough problems in the past with various NVRs to make all my setting changes on the camera and they get pushed to the NVR. Things dont always translate nicely the other way.

 

[HMC8403]

I make all changes/settings on the cameras themselves. Ive found that the NVR is best for recording and other common functions but have had enough problems in the past with various NVRs to make all my setting changes on the camera and they get pushed to the NVR. Things dont always translate nicely the other way.

is there a difference between the rule lines being Blue or Yellow, they seem to change on me.

And on your driveway, why two rules? Wouldn't the intrusion with AI human and vehicle be enough?

 

[bigredfish]

There are 3 actually, two tripwires and one box. The extra line across the drive is just leftover from testing to see if there's a difference in activation between it and the intrusion box. So far they both seem to be working.

On my NVR they're yellow when drawing them on the camera but blue when viewing via Smartpss