Looking for 1st system for home advice

[Bigmixer]

Hello, Long time lurker/reader, first time poster.

I have been researching cameras to death for about 6 months now. I am a little overwhelmed and I feel like I just need to ask opinions.

I have a home I want to monitor to start with 3 cameras:

#1 front door - I have a 20 foot porch with 11 foot ceiling with cat6 in place at the opposite end from the front door (I have a window on the front porch also).

#2 Driveway/Garage-man door. Again a CAT6 cable above the door about 11-12 feet up. This area also could cover the driveway which is approximately 75 feet total.

#3 Rear basement door under covered deck. This CAT6 is ran to corner above door about 8 feet high and could cover the entire rear of the house.

My questions are the typical things.

1. NVR or PC: NVR is easier, less maintenance, less expensive. PC I am sure has better options and I like not having to go to the cloud to view on mobile if I were to get alerts (as opposed to an NVR solution). Trouble is, I can't seem to find the deals on the PCs that I see everyone get. The cheapest i5-6500 OptiPlex that I can find is $489 and that is without a HDD.

This Amcrest NV4108E-HS NVR is $180 and would need an HDD. https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0743WP62Q/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=I3V2UQK8WSBWIP&colid=FKQRA1OOLK7L&psc=1
How does this look?

2. Cameras. I see the advantage of the Dahua Starlight and varifocal. I know it is a better camera, but I can't sell that to the wife. $170 vs $100 vs $75 cameras make no difference to her as long as she can see the video. Is there anything I should be looking for in an Amcrest that could meet my needs? Like these:

https://smile.amazon.com/Amcrest-ProHD-Outdoor-Security-Camera/dp/B07772PXJ2/ref=sr_1_9?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1513802247&sr=1-9&keywords=amcrest+poe+camera


I know these are loaded questions, and I have poured through these and other forums for months. I just need a little guidance. Maybe point me in the direction of a system or sites or anything?

Thank you

 

[fenderman]

Hello, Long time lurker/reader, first time poster.

I have been researching cameras to death for about 6 months now. I am a little overwhelmed and I feel like I just need to ask opinions.

I have a home I want to monitor to start with 3 cameras:

#1 front door - I have a 20 foot porch with 11 foot ceiling with cat6 in place at the opposite end from the front door (I have a window on the front porch also).

#2 Driveway/Garage-man door. Again a CAT6 cable above the door about 11-12 feet up. This area also could cover the driveway which is approximately 75 feet total.

#3 Rear basement door under covered deck. This CAT6 is ran to corner above door about 8 feet high and could cover the entire rear of the house.

My questions are the typical things.

1. NVR or PC: NVR is easier, less maintenance, less expensive. PC I am sure has better options and I like not having to go to the cloud to view on mobile if I were to get alerts (as opposed to an NVR solution). Trouble is, I can't seem to find the deals on the PCs that I see everyone get. The cheapest i5-6500 OptiPlex that I can find is $489 and that is without a HDD.

This Amcrest NV4108E-HS NVR is $180 and would need an HDD. https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0743WP62Q/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=I3V2UQK8WSBWIP&colid=FKQRA1OOLK7L&psc=1
How does this look?

2. Cameras. I see the advantage of the Dahua Starlight and varifocal. I know it is a better camera, but I can't sell that to the wife. $170 vs $100 vs $75 cameras make no difference to her as long as she can see the video. Is there anything I should be looking for in an Amcrest that could meet my needs? Like these:

https://smile.amazon.com/Amcrest-ProHD-Outdoor-Security-Camera/dp/B07772PXJ2/ref=sr_1_9?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1513802247&sr=1-9&keywords=amcrest+poe+camera


I know these are loaded questions, and I have poured through these and other forums for months. I just need a little guidance. Maybe point me in the direction of a system or sites or anything?

Thank you

the fixed turrets are 100...for 35 dollars you will have significantly better night vision, SD card, and audio...you will also not have to clear the spider webs off it every night when the weather is warm...
you are not searching for pc's using the info on this forum...you will find the NVR to be severely lacking..
NVR is does not require any less maintenance...you can buy a pc to handle your 3 cams for 100-150...

 

[Bigmixer]

the fixed turrets are 100...for 35 dollars you will have significantly better night vision, SD card, and audio...you will also not have to clear the spider webs off it every night when the weather is warm...

You are right, I could deal with the $35. How do I best determine the fixed lens I need for each area? I tried the calculator and I suppose I am not grasping the concept. (I promise I get technology, I just have never worked with security cameras before).

you are not searching for pc's using the info on this forum...you will find the NVR to be severely lacking..
NVR is does not require any less maintenance...you can buy a pc to handle your 3 cams for 100-150...

I would like to eventually add a few cams (Possibly a total of 8). I have been on ebay and dell outlet and HP outlet. I think I need an i5-6th or 7th series without T or S, 8 GB of RAM DDR3 or DDR4 does not matter. No video card needed. A HDD for the OS- WINDOWS 10, and a Purple HDD for surveillance.

 

[fenderman]

You are right, I could deal with the $35. How do I best determine the fixed lens I need for each area? I tried the calculator and I suppose I am not grasping the concept. (I promise I get technology, I just have never worked with security cameras before).



I would like to eventually add a few cams (Possibly a total of 8). I have been on ebay and dell outlet and HP outlet. I think I need an i5-6th or 7th series without T or S, 8 GB of RAM DDR3 or DDR4 does not matter. No video card needed. A HDD for the OS- WINDOWS 10, and a Purple HDD for surveillance.

you could easily run 8 1080p cameras on a 150 dollar 3rd or 4th gen i5.

 

[actran]

@Bigmixer 6 months is alot of reading. Until you take the plunge, there are things you won't really know until you get hands-on. (It was the same for me when I first started.)

Start with 1 camera and use that camera to test each area. Some people temporarily mount the camera to the end of 2x4 with a bucket of sand as the base. Buy 1 Dahua varifocal starlight (IPC-HDW5231R-Z) because you can adjust the zoom and figure out what works for each area. Then you'll know what fixed lens you'll want.

Some advice:

#1: Most cameras will give good/excellent daytime footage. That is not the issue. The issue is when something bad happens at night, then you'll realize that getting good moving footage at night is essential. You will find that the Dahua startlights are the best at night.

#2: It sounds like you have a property with high ceiling. The higher you mount the camera, the more difficult it will be for you to get a face shot when the intruder is up-close. Think about the mounting height for each area because getting the top of someone's head is not going to help you identify the perp to the police.

#3: NVR may be cheaper but BI will give you more flexibility (including support for cameras across many different brands, and you may switch camera brands over time). Secondly, the BI mobile app is better than any NVR mobile experience I've seen. Of course, BI will take more work to setup but put in the effort and it will payoff.

 

[looney2ns]

I would not consider BI "more work" than an NVR. BI can be setup to do the basic's very easily.

And it will definitely run circles around any NVR.

You want to know who did it, not just what happened.
Mount cams for Id'ing no higher than 8ft, preferably lower.

 

[Bigmixer]

@Bigmixer 6 months is alot reading. Until you take the plunge, there are things you won't really know until you get hands-on. (It was the same for me when I first started.)

Start with 1 camera and use that camera to test each area. Some people temporarily mount the camera to the end of 2x4 with a bucket of sand as the base. Buy 1 Dahua varifocal starlight (IPC-HDW5231R-Z) because you can adjust the zoom and figure out what works for each area. Then you'll know what fixed lens you'll want.

Some advice:

#1: Most cameras will give good/excellent daytime footage. That is not the issue. The issue is when something bad happens at night, then you'll realized that getting good moving footage at night is essential. You will find that the Dahua startlights are the best at night.

#2: It sounds like you have a property with high ceiling. The higher you mount the camera, the more difficult it will be for you to get a face shot when the intruder is up-close. Think about the mounting height for each area because getting the top of someone's head is not going to help you identify the perp to the police.

#3: NVR may be cheaper but BI will give you more flexibility (including support for cameras across many different brands, and you may switch camera brands over time). Secondly, the BI mobile app is better than any NVR mobile experience I've seen. Of course, BI will take more work to setup but put in the effort and it will payoff.

Thanks for the reply.

#1 The idea of getting one and then adding more best on that makes sense. I am trying to find components and then I will post back.

#2 Yes, the main floor is a minimum of 10 foot ceilings. It would be hard for anyone to get in on the main floor because the main entry points are front door and garage-mandoor in a busy subdivision. The rear of the house is the problem, but only an 8 foot ceiling in that area.

#3 That is what I am thinking, I already have servers and things running in the house, and just wanted to see if BI is really that much better. With a $150-$200 PC and a $50-$75 POE switch, the NVRs that I have seen are close in price unless I go something like Amcrest.

 

[Bigmixer]

you could easily run 8 1080p cameras on a 150 dollar 3rd or 4th gen i5.

Can I do better than below?

I found a couple of PCs
#1 - Dell OptiPlex 3020 SFF i5-4570 3.20GHz 8GB 500GB Win 7 Pro - 83360 - $179
#2 - Dell Optiplex 7010 SFF Desktop PC - Intel Core i5-3470 3.2GHz 8GB 250GB DVD Windows 10 Pro (Certified Refurbished) - $207

These switches:
BV-Tech 9 Port PoE Switch (8 PoE Ports | 1 Uplink Port) – 130W – 802.3af - $70
[URL='https://www.amazon.com/BV-Tech-Port-Switch-Ports-Uplink/dp/B00WKRBI0W/ref=sr_1_8?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1513863865&sr=1-8&keywords=poe+switch']BV-Tech 5 Port PoE Switch (4 PoE Ports | 1 Uplink Port) – 65W – 802.3af – POE-SW501 - $38


[/URL]

 

[actran]

Can I do better than below?

I found a couple of PCs
#1 - Dell OptiPlex 3020 SFF i5-4570 3.20GHz 8GB 500GB Win 7 Pro - 83360 - $179
#2 - Dell Optiplex 7010 SFF Desktop PC - Intel Core i5-3470 3.2GHz 8GB 250GB DVD Windows 10 Pro (Certified Refurbished) - $207

These switches:
BV-Tech 9 Port PoE Switch (8 PoE Ports | 1 Uplink Port) – 130W – 802.3af - $70
BV-Tech 5 Port PoE Switch (4 PoE Ports | 1 Uplink Port) – 65W – 802.3af – POE-SW501 - $38

@Bigmixer

I bought an Optiplex 5050 SFF refurbished from Dell outlet (i7-7700) during Black Friday. I had a i7 3rd generation previously and I was running out of headroom. (I am also thinking of adding ALPR - license plate recognition.)

My SFF has room for 1 2.5" drive (by pulling out the DVD drive), and 1 3.5" drive (purple WD).

If you plan to record in h.265, you may want to check Intel specs and confirm which generation has support for that. (Personally 3rd generation is a bit old.)

And go with the 9-port POE switch. You may not think so now but you will buy more than 3 cameras for your property.

 

[looney2ns]

Thanks for the reply.

#1 The idea of getting one and then adding more best on that makes sense. I am trying to find components and then I will post back.

#2 Yes, the main floor is a minimum of 10 foot ceilings. It would be hard for anyone to get in on the main floor because the main entry points are front door and garage-mandoor in a busy subdivision. The rear of the house is the problem, but only an 8 foot ceiling in that area.

#3 That is what I am thinking, I already have servers and things running in the house, and just wanted to see if BI is really that much better. With a $150-$200 PC and a $50-$75 POE switch, the NVRs that I have seen are close in price unless I go something like Amcrest.

2-What does the height of the ceiling have to do with outdoor mounted cams? You are fooling yourself if you think someone will not take advantage of the front door or man door simply because the subdivision is busy. Bad guys are VERY brazen these days.

A question, have you hardened all of your exterior doors by replacing the 1/2" screws that are in the catch plates of the locks? You need to replace those screws with something long enough to go all the way into the stud behind the door frame.
And for good measure, replace the catch plates with something like this: https://www.amazon.com/Prime-Line-10385-Strike-Accommodates-Centers/dp/B00D2K33NG/ref=sr_1_18?ie=UTF8&qid=1513873795&sr=8-18&keywords=door+security

 

[Bigmixer]

2-What does the height of the ceiling have to do with outdoor mounted cams?

I was answering Actran. I don't want a camera sticking out like a sore thumb on the side of the house. I referenced the ceiling height because that plus the truss height would equal the soffit height (ceiling height for porches).

You are fooling yourself if you think someone will not take advantage of the front door or man door simply because the subdivision is busy. Bad guys are VERY brazen these days.

If they want in that bad, they can have it. I guess you need to see the area to understand why they wouldn't come in that way.

A question, have you hardened all of your exterior doors by replacing the 1/2" screws that are in the catch plates of the locks? You need to replace those screws with something long enough to go all the way into the stud behind the door frame.
And for good measure, replace the catch plates with something like this: https://www.amazon.com/Prime-Line-10385-Strike-Accommodates-Centers/dp/B00D2K33NG/ref=sr_1_18?ie=UTF8&qid=1513873795&sr=8-18&keywords=door+security

Yes, screws are replaced just for trimming and squaring an 8 foot door, most exterior door jambs are soft pine (mine are hard wood or composite), I can kick a door open regardless of the strike plate (I am a decent sized guy though). (I used to be in construction - home, commercial, and a large national builder). I always subbed the security out because I didn't have time. This is a personal home that I built and I want to know all the ins and outs of everything, so I wired the electrical, drew the plans, built the extras, managed framers, plumbers, carpenters, etc...

 

[korin]

the fixed turrets are 100...for 35 dollars you will have significantly better night vision, SD card, and audio...you will also not have to clear the spider webs off it every night when the weather is warm...

Do the Dahua Starlight turrets not have a problem with spiderwebs? I have some cheap-o hosafe turrets and I'm constantly dealing with spiderwebs. I assumed that only a dome camera would be any better, but the Starlights look awesome, and if they could solve my spiderweb issue - even better.

 

[fenderman]

Do the Dahua Starlight turrets not have a problem with spiderwebs? I have some cheap-o hosafe turrets and I'm constantly dealing with spiderwebs. I assumed that only a dome camera would be any better, but the Starlights look awesome, and if they could solve my spiderweb issue - even better.

its not the model, its the turret form factor, specifically the IR is separated from the lens.