bigredfish
Known around here
New ones are Vari-focal
Looking for advice on my install locations.
- Thread starter Ri22o
- Start date
bigredfish
Known around here
I like this idea of using the 3X to watch the mailbox and play spotter
That's sort of where I am. I have the X3s and I want to swap the PTZ, if this works, it works. If not, it's better than nothing and I can keep an eye out for refurb or used Z4Es later on.
I will need to get my IVS calls figured out in BI, which I think is doable now. Right now, I can't assign IVS rules to presets, they all go to one preset.
Well, Andy updated his Refurb list and I grabbed 2 Z4Es to try on the back path. So I got that going for me, hopefully they work out.
I messed with the X3 more last night, and I think I have it to a happy place that will be a compliment to a better PTZ. I may still make some adjustments, but at least I now have my expectations set. After the other X3 goes up and spits out more IR, there might be a difference, but this is what I have for now.
I messed with the X3 more last night, and I think I have it to a happy place that will be a compliment to a better PTZ. I may still make some adjustments, but at least I now have my expectations set. After the other X3 goes up and spits out more IR, there might be a difference, but this is what I have for now.
bigredfish
Known around here
I think that's 8.33/50.
I fiddled with it a little more before I called it a night, and it's currently set to 6.33/50. I never went back outside and had hoped someone would walk by with the new settings.
After looking at my pictures, I may go back the other way with a higher exp and lower gain.
I fiddled with it a little more before I called it a night, and it's currently set to 6.33/50. I never went back outside and had hoped someone would walk by with the new settings.
After looking at my pictures, I may go back the other way with a higher exp and lower gain.
bigredfish
Known around here
I assure you that I do not have much light and I am jealous of the many here that do have a lot of light like bigredfish and samplenhold.
All I have are my outside house lights, infrared from other cameras. There are no streetlights and neighbors keep outside lights off. It is dark.
As I post frequently, one has to test the camera with motion as that is what we are concerned with. I have that post with the starting settings, but each parameter is unique to the camera and the field of view.
And it is amazing how field of view dependent the camera can be. @Ri22o saw different performance of the 3X camera just between it being on the side of his house versus the front of the house.
Too many people get concerned with the still image.
I am not taking still photos for the County Fair competition, I want captures in motion of a perp that the police could use to identify a person.
Many cameras behave differently with motion versus no motion.
I spend A LOT of time setting up the cameras.
I do not go by the static image.
I test every parameter to the extreme with motion to see how the camera responds.
I have found the settings that work for one camera may not work for another. For example, gain can go higher on the 5442 than the PTZ.
Some respond better to fixed shutter/exposure rather than a range.
But I test each one with motion to squeak the best performance I can out of the camera.
Literally some of my cams if I change the parameter ONE number, like gain from 69 to 70 the image with motion completely goes to crap.
So lets talk about the mini-PTZ.
Here are my settings at night.
Noise Reduction at 10. Who here runs NR at 10 at night? Probably nobody.
And as you expect, the static image is a pixelated noisy mess:
View attachment MiniPTZ static view.mp4
Now this field of view does benefit from the infrared of the 3X camera and another PTZ.
But then with motion, the pixelated mess goes away.
View attachment MiniPTZ doorchecker.mp4
This is why you test it with motion and adjust all the parameters to see which one is best for your field of view.
I will admit the mini-PTZ was the most difficult one to dial in. And I still tweak it from time to time.
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Change of gears, for now. Same project, just discussing a different camera.
I decided to take a swing at my mini-PTZ settings since I have time before the sale and I haven't committed to a new, better PTZ yet. After last night, and with the added IR from both X3 cams, I am still on the fence.
Below is a capture from before changes and, now that I am looking at it again, it doesn't seem horrible. My biggest issue is getting the thing to focus properly most of the time.
My settings for above:
And these are captures after making adjustments:
With the above settings, and possibly the before settings, I cannot get it to trigger from the far left sidewalk. This is where it parks, so it's not as if it needs to settle before the IVS rules will work. I think it is just too bad of a static image for it to pick me up near the car on the left.
The far right sidewalk takes until the last IVS tripwire before it detects me.
I decided to take a swing at my mini-PTZ settings since I have time before the sale and I haven't committed to a new, better PTZ yet. After last night, and with the added IR from both X3 cams, I am still on the fence.
Below is a capture from before changes and, now that I am looking at it again, it doesn't seem horrible. My biggest issue is getting the thing to focus properly most of the time.
My settings for above:
And these are captures after making adjustments:
With the above settings, and possibly the before settings, I cannot get it to trigger from the far left sidewalk. This is where it parks, so it's not as if it needs to settle before the IVS rules will work. I think it is just too bad of a static image for it to pick me up near the car on the left.
The far right sidewalk takes until the last IVS tripwire before it detects me.
bigredfish
Known around here
Man its hard to say.
I gave up trying to use mine like a regular IR camera at night. Even with my baby streetlight.
Interesting on the top image with shutter that slow there's not as much blur as I expected. I suspect its because you have the Iris open 100%.
Typically with iris open that far you lose DOF., the image "flattens"
But regardless its a much more usable image
I gave up trying to use mine like a regular IR camera at night. Even with my baby streetlight.
Interesting on the top image with shutter that slow there's not as much blur as I expected. I suspect its because you have the Iris open 100%.
Typically with iris open that far you lose DOF., the image "flattens"
But regardless its a much more usable image
It's been set that way for a while. I think the justification was that the camera is following the person, instead of them walking across the FOV, so it lessens the chance of blurring.
I just made the iris change after the incident with the kids. Previously it was 10-70.
My biggest concerns with the new settings is it not able to pick up on the far sidewalk. Additionally, the internal file capture is junk. I tried to review IVS triggers and am missing the beginning and end of so many clips.
I just made the iris change after the incident with the kids. Previously it was 10-70.
My biggest concerns with the new settings is it not able to pick up on the far sidewalk. Additionally, the internal file capture is junk. I tried to review IVS triggers and am missing the beginning and end of so many clips.
I've known this, but I think I am going to stick to my guns going forward. I am not going to mess with anything less than a 5442 from now on, even if it is a 2MP on the right sensor.
I got a couple Z4E-S3s from the refurb list and put them up over the path yesterday to test. This is what I got with just guessing at the settings based on another Z4E I am using in the backyard, even with IR hitting the trees, leaves, and branches, the picture is what I was hoping to get from the X3 and the Z12E-S2 I've tested. I still need to work on the focus, but this is with 6.33/40, 75 Iris, 50/50 NR
I would like a little more focal length out of it, but I can deal with it.
I got a couple Z4E-S3s from the refurb list and put them up over the path yesterday to test. This is what I got with just guessing at the settings based on another Z4E I am using in the backyard, even with IR hitting the trees, leaves, and branches, the picture is what I was hoping to get from the X3 and the Z12E-S2 I've tested. I still need to work on the focus, but this is with 6.33/40, 75 Iris, 50/50 NR
I would like a little more focal length out of it, but I can deal with it.
bigredfish
Known around here
Yep, right there with ya.
Dahua missed the mark on the Triple, they could have sold a Bazillion if it were 4MP and 1/1.8 sensor
Dahua missed the mark on the Triple, they could have sold a Bazillion if it were 4MP and 1/1.8 sensor
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I'm also with the consensus. Was going to use the X3, but after seeing the less than stellar night captures from all the testing here, I scrapped the idea.
In my opinion, from experience with the 5231, 2mp cameras are great if you have good light. Otherwise, you need to supplement additional light to get a decent night image as I had seen in my back yard. I have one Tendelux IR light, but it needs another on the opposite side to get a more uniform exposure.
That's one thing I noticed that the 5442 has over the 2mp cameras, the exposure uniformity across the image with the same amount of light.
I any event, in the location where I was going to use the X3, I will now be employing a B54IR-Z4E for a close shot and B54IR-ZE for overview of the same intersection. I have the cameras, just have other things to take care of first
In my opinion, from experience with the 5231, 2mp cameras are great if you have good light. Otherwise, you need to supplement additional light to get a decent night image as I had seen in my back yard. I have one Tendelux IR light, but it needs another on the opposite side to get a more uniform exposure.
That's one thing I noticed that the 5442 has over the 2mp cameras, the exposure uniformity across the image with the same amount of light.
I any event, in the location where I was going to use the X3, I will now be employing a B54IR-Z4E for a close shot and B54IR-ZE for overview of the same intersection. I have the cameras, just have other things to take care of first
That is what I am doing in this location. AS 2.8mm on one side of the gate with a ZE crossed over looking the other way, both with their own Z4E zoomed in on the path. I am undecided if I am going to leave the Z4Es where they are, or move them further down the fence to the corners for a clearer shot of the path, but, honestly, I was surprised how well they did with the foliage in the way.
Even though my mini-PTZ has gotten better, I think I'm still going to be fighting it. And after seeing above, I might still be leaning towards a better one.
I am happy with the Z4Es and would like to get the install finalized, but want to get advice on possibly testing another location first before I start buttoning everything up.
Would it be worth testing installing them further down the fence, near the corners? I was surprised they work as well as they do with the branches, trees, leaves, etc that bounce back IR, but these angles would be more open to the path and a lot less obstructed in the future as the trees grow. The distance to the path would be about the same, if not a touch shorter. However, a concern I have with moving to the ends of the fence would be the amount of dead space in between the capture points on the path.
Night captures in their current test locations, for reference. The trees on Path North have been trimmed some since I saved these.
This is what I have going on currently. The turrets give cross coverage for up near the fence/gate and easement area while the bullets capture anyone walking on the path. You can just see the bullets tucked behind the trees, but they are more obvious from the path as you approach from either direction.
These aren't exactly 1:1, but this is close to what you would see if I zoomed the Z4Es out. The red lines are where they are pointed.
These are the locations and sight lines for where I am considering testing them.
An additional concern would be losing some of the additional IR from the bullets to supplement the turrets, but it wouldn't be the end of the world. At night I feel I would have adequate coverage in the area between the path and gate/easement area, even with the bullets moved.
Would it be worth testing installing them further down the fence, near the corners? I was surprised they work as well as they do with the branches, trees, leaves, etc that bounce back IR, but these angles would be more open to the path and a lot less obstructed in the future as the trees grow. The distance to the path would be about the same, if not a touch shorter. However, a concern I have with moving to the ends of the fence would be the amount of dead space in between the capture points on the path.
Night captures in their current test locations, for reference. The trees on Path North have been trimmed some since I saved these.
This is what I have going on currently. The turrets give cross coverage for up near the fence/gate and easement area while the bullets capture anyone walking on the path. You can just see the bullets tucked behind the trees, but they are more obvious from the path as you approach from either direction.
These aren't exactly 1:1, but this is close to what you would see if I zoomed the Z4Es out. The red lines are where they are pointed.
These are the locations and sight lines for where I am considering testing them.
An additional concern would be losing some of the additional IR from the bullets to supplement the turrets, but it wouldn't be the end of the world. At night I feel I would have adequate coverage in the area between the path and gate/easement area, even with the bullets moved.
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I may just commit to where they are now, and move them later if it's an issue. I like the thought of them being crossed, as opposed to a V if they were installed at the ends of the fence.