Looking for some guidance on my lorex

[EyeCyu]

Hi all, I have an older Lorex system that was offered by costco. The recorder is an LNR6108-N with LNB8005-C bullet cameras. The system has never been connected to the internet and still works just fine. This past summer I purchased a couple of 4k dome cameras to add to the system but ran into issues with the quality of the video (not clear). Called lorex and was suggested to update the system but warned it may not work and ruin the recorder. I didn't do the upgrade and returned the cameras. I know the system is dated but I'm fine with it for now.

I found out after reading on here that Dahua makes lorex and should work with my recorder. I'd like to add a few dome cameras and add more storage to the recorder. Any suggestions on cameras or storage? Advice on doing an update?

TIA

 

[wittaj]

What cameras did you try?

Updating the NVR won't increase the MP/s capacity of the NVR.

My neighbor has that system and once it got over 6 4K cameras, the bitrate was cut back substantially by the NVR which degrades the image, so that may be what you were experiencing.

Most here don't recommend domes as they are problematic unless indoors.

What is the goal of the cameras - to detect or identify and at what distance?

This thread lists the most commonly suggested cameras (with Amazon links) here based on distance to IDENTIFY and represent the best overall value in terms of price and performance day and night. The recommendations are all Dahua OEM and will work with the system (keeping in mind the limitations of the NVR itself):

The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection

At the urging of several folks here, I created a thread to show the importance of focal length and how focal length can be more important than megapixels (MP). I mentioned some of this in the post regarding The Hookup’s latest video demonstrating different cameras, including one sold from a...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[mat200]

Hi all, I have an older Lorex system that was offered by costco. The recorder is an LNR6108-N with LNB8005-C bullet cameras. The system has never been connected to the internet and still works just fine. This past summer I purchased a couple of 4k dome cameras to add to the system but ran into issues with the quality of the video (not clear). Called lorex and was suggested to update the system but warned it may not work and ruin the recorder. I didn't do the upgrade and returned the cameras. I know the system is dated but I'm fine with it for now.

I found out after reading on here that Dahua makes lorex and should work with my recorder. I'd like to add a few dome cameras and add more storage to the recorder. Any suggestions on cameras or storage? Advice on doing an update?

TIA

Hi I believe those are dahua oem .. the cameras iirc are not officially onvif yet support enough standards that others have used them with blue iris.

The nvr iirc does have a limited bandwidth that may be your limiting factor.

Recording basics should work with other dahua oem cameras as long as you do not exceed the bandwidth / compute power of the nvr.

If you finding that hitting the bandwidth is an issue you can run less fps.

Remember to use h.264 as older nvrs may not support h.265

 

[EyeCyu]

What cameras did you try?
Lorex E841CD-E wired 4k dome.

Updating the NVR won't increase the MP/s capacity of the NVR.
I've also read that updating may be problematic and most prefer not to be connected to the net?

My neighbor has that system and once it got over 6 4K cameras, the bitrate was cut back substantially by the NVR which degrades the image, so that may be what you were experiencing.
I did not mention that I only currently have 3 cameras hooked up to the nvr. I do plan on adding the others. So the image was poor with just the 3 cameras plugged in and running.

Most here don't recommend domes as they are problematic unless indoors.
I did plan on putting 2 domes outside underneath a covered porch. The others were going to be indoors. Is the reason due to the elements, changes in temp?

What is the goal of the cameras - to detect or identify and at what distance?
Both would be nice. Would that be difficult or expensive? I would like to be able to read a license plate or get a clear picture of someones face. Distance would be roughly 50ft or less.

This thread lists the most commonly suggested cameras (with Amazon links) here based on distance to IDENTIFY and represent the best overall value in terms of price and performance day and night. The recommendations are all Dahua OEM and will work with the system (keeping in mind the limitations of the NVR itself):
Thanks for the link. I'll take a look at it. I know I have some reading to do.

The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection

At the urging of several folks here, I created a thread to show the importance of focal length and how focal length can be more important than megapixels (MP). I mentioned some of this in the post regarding The Hookup’s latest video demonstrating different cameras, including one sold from a...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[EyeCyu]

Hi I believe those are dahua oem .. the cameras iirc are not officially onvif yet support enough standards that others have used them with blue iris.

The nvr iirc does have a limited bandwidth that may be your limiting factor.

Recording basics should work with other dahua oem cameras as long as you do not exceed the bandwidth / compute power of the nvr.

If you finding that hitting the bandwidth is an issue you can run less fps.

Remember to use h.264 as older nvrs may not support h.265

I was hoping to maybe add storage to the nvr as well as maxing out the number of channels it offers for cameras. What it be easier to purchase a better nvr, use my current cameras as well as add more be a better/easier option?

 

[wittaj]

Ok that is not a dome, but a turret. Not sure why they are calling it a dome LOL.

That is correct, there are MANY threads here were someone updates their NVR (and some are just for kicks or OCD) and then something goes wrong.

OK, when you connect the cameras to the NVR, it automatically gives it H265 and a low bitrate - that is the reason for the poor image.

You need to log into the camera GUI and change it to H264, 8192 bitrate, and 15FPS.

To get into the camera GUI from the NVR, you need to first access the NVR GUI by going to a computer and opening up a browser (preferably Internet Explorer but Pale Moon will work as well) and type in the IP address of the NVR and login that way. Next go into the camera settings page on the NVR and look for the Microsoft e Web Browser and select it and it will go to the camera GUI (photo credit bigredfish from his PSA thread). Your screen may look a little different to get into the camera gui and see if doing it this way gets you access to some other features the NVR is blocking - do not worry about the Port number and circle as that was from another issue someone posted.

One camera cannot be the be all see all. A camera to IDENTIFY at 10 feet is one camera; at 50 feet it is a different camera.

Those cameras will not capture plates at 50 feet.

You would have to set the camera up specifically to read plates. You need the proper camera with OPTICAL zoom for the distance you are covering and the angle to get plates.

Regarding plates, keep in mind that this is a camera dedicated to plates and not an overview camera also. It is as much an art as it is a science. You will need two cameras. For LPR we need to OPTICALLY zoom in tight to make the plate as large as possible. For most of us, all you see is the not much more than a vehicle in the entire frame. Now maybe in the right location during the day it might be able to see some other things, but not at night.

At night, we have to run a very fast shutter speed (1/2,000) and in B/W with IR and the image will be black. All you will see are head/tail lights and the plate. Some people can get away with color if they have enough street lights, but most of us cannot. Here is a representative sample of plates I get at night of vehicles traveling about 45MPH at 175 feet from my 2MP 5241-Z12E camera (that is all that is needed for plates):

See the LPR subforum for more details.

 

[wittaj]

I was hoping to maybe add storage to the nvr as well as maxing out the number of channels it offers for cameras. What it be easier to purchase a better nvr, use my current cameras as well as add more be a better/easier option?

That comes down to you. I can tell you we have many people come here after having Lorex for a year or two and looking to upgrade.

Some try to make due with their existing NVR, while others get either a better NVR or go to the Blue Iris/PC combo.

Here is the search tool of all the NVR versus BI comparisons:

blue iris vs nvr ip cam site:ipcamtalk.com - Google Search

Personally, I started with the NVR all-in-one box solution (ok I had several of them over the years LOL) and got fed up with the lack of features and difficulty in scrubbing video and what not and went to BI and can't see myself ever going back to a standard NVR.

You could probably use your existing cameras for some overview opportunities, but you need to decide what the goal is for each camera and then select the proper camera to achieve that goal.

It was said before, and worth repeating - do not chase MP. Chase focal length for the distance you want to identify - and in many cases that will be 2MP or 4MP.

Many people will start with one good varifocal like this one and move it around to different spots to help them figure out what they need:

Amazon.com

 

[EyeCyu]

Ok that is not a dome, but a turret. Not sure why they are calling it a dome LOL.

That is correct, there are MANY threads here were someone updates their NVR (and some are just for kicks or OCD) and then something goes wrong.

OK, when you connect the cameras to the NVR, it automatically gives it H265 and a low bitrate - that is the reason for the poor image.

You need to log into the camera GUI and change it to H264, 8192 bitrate, and 15FPS.

To get into the camera GUI from the NVR, you need to first access the NVR GUI by going to a computer and opening up a browser (preferably Internet Explorer but Pale Moon will work as well) and type in the IP address of the NVR and login that way. Next go into the camera settings page on the NVR and look for the Microsoft e Web Browser and select it and it will go to the camera GUI (photo credit bigredfish from his PSA thread). Your screen may look a little different to get into the camera gui and see if doing it this way gets you access to some other features the NVR is blocking - do not worry about the Port number and circle as that was from another issue someone posted.

One camera cannot be the be all see all. A camera to IDENTIFY at 10 feet is one camera; at 50 feet it is a different camera.

Those cameras will not capture plates at 50 feet.

You would have to set the camera up specifically to read plates. You need the proper camera with OPTICAL zoom for the distance you are covering and the angle to get plates.

Regarding plates, keep in mind that this is a camera dedicated to plates and not an overview camera also. It is as much an art as it is a science. You will need two cameras. For LPR we need to OPTICALLY zoom in tight to make the plate as large as possible. For most of us, all you see is the not much more than a vehicle in the entire frame. Now maybe in the right location during the day it might be able to see some other things, but not at night.

At night, we have to run a very fast shutter speed (1/2,000) and in B/W with IR and the image will be black. All you will see are head/tail lights and the plate. Some people can get away with color if they have enough street lights, but most of us cannot. Here is a representative sample of plates I get at night of vehicles traveling about 45MPH at 175 feet from my 2MP 5241-Z12E camera (that is all that is needed for plates):

See the LPR subforum for more details.

Thanks for the replies, very informative. I started reading the thread you started and getting a better understanding on which camera for what purpose. More reading to do.

Now if I log into the cameras gui, I'm assuming I need to connect the nvr to the internet? If so would the nvr automatically update itself or is that something I would need to initiate? I just don't want to ruin the nvr for now.

 

[EyeCyu]

That comes down to you. I can tell you we have many people come here after having Lorex for a year or two and looking to upgrade.

Some try to make due with their existing NVR, while others get either a better NVR or go to the Blue Iris/PC combo.

Here is the search tool of all the NVR versus BI comparisons:

blue iris vs nvr ip cam site:ipcamtalk.com - Google Search

Personally, I started with the NVR all-in-one box solution (ok I had several of them over the years LOL) and got fed up with the lack of features and difficulty in scrubbing video and what not and went to BI and can't see myself ever going back to a standard NVR.

You could probably use your existing cameras for some overview opportunities, but you need to decide what the goal is for each camera and then select the proper camera to achieve that goal.

It was said before, and worth repeating - do not chase MP. Chase focal length for the distance you want to identify - and in many cases that will be 2MP or 4MP.

Many people will start with one good varifocal like this one and move it around to different spots to help them figure out what they need:

Amazon.com

I'll be doing some more reading and may decide to go BI.

 

[wittaj]

Thanks for the replies, very informative. I started reading the thread you started and getting a better understanding on which camera for what purpose. More reading to do.

Now if I log into the cameras gui, I'm assuming I need to connect the nvr to the internet? If so would the nvr automatically update itself or is that something I would need to initiate? I just don't want to ruin the nvr for now.

No you do not need the internet. People mistake a web browser as needing internet.

None of my cameras are connected to the internet and in fact I get into the GUI with an old Windows 7 laptop so old it doesn't even have wifi on it. I simply plug the ethernet into the POE switch the cameras are on and go to town. Or in your case hook it to the WAN/LAN port of the NVR.

To get into the camera GUI from the NVR, you need to first access the NVR GUI by going to a computer and opening up a browser (preferably Internet Explorer but Pale Moon will work as well) and type in the IP address of the NVR and login that way. Next go into the camera settings page on the NVR and look for the Microsoft e Web Browser and select it and it will go to the camera GUI (photo credit bigredfish from his PSA thread). Your screen may look a little different to get into the camera gui - do not worry about the Port number and circle as that was from another issue someone posted.

And while you are in the NVR GUI and the cameras, turn off auto update so in the event you ever do accidently give it internet access, they won't update.

 

[EyeCyu]

^^^ Thanks for clearing that up