Need advice on PTZ cams

[Elmojo]

Hi all,
I'm about to upgrade my aging switch to a gigabit with PoE, so I'm thinking about camera upgrades as well.
I currently have a single ancient PTZ in my garage, and a couple (unreliable) wireless cams here and there.
I'd like to replace them all with more solid equipment. None of these are for "security", per se. They are more for general observation and keeping aware of what's going on around me. I have no need for facial recognition, but I probably will install Blue Iris or similar on my home server to handle recording and such. My budget is fairly low, and I'll likely be buying these one at a time, in the order listed. I'm putting a general max price after each cam, but of course I'm open to cheaper options, or maybe a bit higher if there's a compelling reason.

Here's what I need:
1x PTZ cam in garage. ~$200. This will be the "primary" camera. It can be an indoor cam, since it will be mounted well inside and protected from the elements, but not in a climate-controlled space. I do need it to have a decent zoom, since I want it to be able to see inside the garage normally, but also zoom out through the doorway to observe the driveway on occasion. This will also require some real WDR to handle the lighting/exposure difference. This is something my current cam struggles with. It also needs IR, since animals like to come into my garage to cause trouble in the evenings, and I'd like to see when they do.
1x PTZ cam on the front porch ($100-150) to watch the front yard/road/mailbox/etc... This one will be protected, but not really indoors. I'm not sure if I can get away with an indoor cam or not here. I'd like to have a little bit of a zoom, but it's not super critical. Low light performance isn't key here either, so maybe a higher res sensor on this one, if the price is reasonable?
1x PTZ cam to cover the back yard ($100-150). This one is mostly just to watch the wildlife and keep and eye on my shop to make sure I shut off the lights. lol I'm not quite sure how I'll mount it yet. The simplest would be on my rear porch, but that would limit the viewing angles. If I do a soffit mount, it would obviously need to be a full outdoor cam, and I may have trouble running the cable for that, since my roofline runs the wrong way for access. I'll have to ponder that one. I have a very wide back yard, so I thought the PTZ would be nice to be able to sweep the view to the part I wanted to see. A nice zoom would be cool, but not critical. We get wild turkeys in the back field, but I'm not really expecting to be able to watch them on the cam.

I'm hoping to be able to connect all these via PoE to my new switch. Am I reasonable in my wish list, or totally off base?
What model(s) would you suggest to fill these requirements? I'm fine with each one being a different model if that's the best fit.
thanks in advance,
-E

 

[sebastiantombs]

At those price points you are waaaaaay off base. A decent PTZ, even indoor, is well into the 200+ range. Search this forum for PTZ reviews before you buy any thing and waste your time and money.

 

[HMC8403]

Don't know if this one would work for any of your needs. Its the 1A404XB-GNR from Andy for $175.00 The shots are Full out, full zoomed and full manual and digital zoom.

 

[Elmojo]

At those price points you are waaaaaay off base. A decent PTZ, even indoor, is well into the 200+ range. Search this forum for PTZ reviews before you buy any thing and waste your time and money.

I don't mean to be contrary, but I just can't believe there are really no good options for any of my 3 use cases. For example, I've done lots of searching and reading on here already, and come across recommendations for this model, which I think may work well for my front porch cam. With its higher resolution, I get get by without the zoom in that particular location, for example. If I have to spend a little more to get a good cam for the primary location in the garage, I'm ok with that. What are your suggestions?

Don't know if this one would work for any of your needs. Its the 1A404XB-GNR from Andy for $175.00 The shots are Full out, full zoomed and full manual and digital zoom.

Thanks so much for the images, those are very helpful!!
Interestingly, I had already flagged a very similar model (I think), from Andy's Amazon store. This one might be a better option for the front porch, since it's outdoor-rated.

 

[HMC8403]

Thanks so much for the images, those are very helpful!!
Interestingly, I had already flagged a very similar model (I think), from Andy's Amazon store. This one might be a better option for the front porch, since it's outdoor-rated.

Mine is the latest model, 4MP. Cheaper if you order from him directly and skip the Amazon fees.

173.4US $ 6% OFF|Latest New Model Ptz Sd1a404xb-gnr 4m 4x Starlight Ir Ptz Ai Network Camera Poe, Free Dhl Shipping - Ip Camera - AliExpress

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

www.aliexpress.com

 

[Elmojo]

Even better! It's a little more than I was initially planning to spend, but that camera may actually work for both my front and back placements.
I'd still love to hear of any other (especially cheaper) options, and something for the primary camera, but this is a great start.

 

[sebastiantombs]

I assumed, incorrectly apparently, that you were looking for some quality, built for surveillance use, cameras. That camera you linked to is 5MP on a 1/3" sensor. At night it will be basically blind unless there's a lot of ambient light or a fair amount of IR. In my mind a PTZ has at least a 12mm lens to provide some ability to "see further clearly". A lens like that, or larger, adds a significant amount to the price of a camera hence the over $200 price tags.

 

[samplenhold]

The $77 Amcrest cam does not have optical zoom. It is a great little cam for looking around a room in the house but the zoom is digital only and even a little zoom pixelates. I have used similar cams indoors to watch pets and keep an eye on the garage. But I ultimately replaced the garage cams with two fixed cams. I get a good shot of the entire garage and the pic quality is much better. But they do not pan and tilt. That is why I am using two cams.

What @HMC8403 showed is a nice cam that you could use in all of your positions. But it is a dome and will have the 'dome' issues if used outdoors. That is IR reflection, dirty dome syndrome, water spots, UV dome fogging, etc. I actually use two of the older, 2MP versions indoors and am quite happy with them.

There is also this one:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32809021863.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000060.2.3e5a2620SXmjrA&gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller&scm=1007.13339.169870.0&scm_id=1007.13339.169870.0&scm-url=1007.13339.169870.0&pvid=11ad1020-0c48-446b-a963-7a7869552589&_t=gps-idcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller,scm-url:1007.13339.169870.0,pvid:11ad1020-0c48-446b-a963-7a7869552589,tpp_buckets:668%230%23131923%230_668%23808%234094%23757_668%23888%233325%233_668%232846%238107%2315_668%232717%237563%23579_668%231000022185%231000066055%230_668%233468%2315615%23684

that folks have used for quite some time with very good results.

Good PTZ cams are more expensive than comparable non-PTZ cams. That is just how it is.

 

[Elmojo]

So what would it take to satisfy the requirements of the first camera I listed? The primary "garage" camera, I mean.
Is this a $250 camera or a $500 camera?
With the myriad options out there, surely there's something that would be a good fit without breaking the bank.
I've been using an old Vstarcam c7824wip, and for the most part it's been doing most of what I want. I'd just like a little better resolution, some optical zoom if possible, and WDR for looking out through the garage door during the day.
That doesn't seem like an unreasonable list of features.

 

[sebastiantombs]

samplenhold just gave you a link to one that's under $200. It's PoE, not WiFi, but will take an SD card.

 

[samplenhold]

Again, why would not the cam @HMC8403 pinned work? Or the one I pinned?

"I do need it to have a decent zoom, since I want it to be able to see inside the garage normally, but also zoom out through the doorway to observe the driveway on occasion. This will also require some real WDR to handle the lighting/exposure difference" is what you stated but you do not define "decent zoom". For a lower end PTZ cam, that is the option that will impact the price the most. Search this site for the Amcrest PTZ cams that a few folks like. They are Dahua OEM cams and are close to the Dahua versions and are quite a bit less costly.

 

[HMC8403]

There is also this one:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32809021863.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000060.2.3e5a2620SXmjrA&gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller&scm=1007.13339.169870.0&scm_id=1007.13339.169870.0&scm-url=1007.13339.169870.0&pvid=11ad1020-0c48-446b-a963-7a7869552589&_t=gps-idcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller,scm-url:1007.13339.169870.0,pvid:11ad1020-0c48-446b-a963-7a7869552589,tpp_buckets:668%230%23131923%230_668%23808%234094%23757_668%23888%233325%233_668%232846%238107%2315_668%232717%237563%23579_668%231000022185%231000066055%230_668%233468%2315615%23684

that folks have used for quite some time with very good results.

Good PTZ cams are more expensive than comparable non-PTZ cams. That is just how it is.

I actually looked into this one but found out it was indoor only.

 

[Elmojo]

I'm sorry, in my effort to shorten my rather long initial post, I guess I left out a few important details.
I appreciate the suggestions of those 2 models, and in fact I had found those previously in my own searches, but they didn't really have the zoom I was hoping for.
I would like to have at least a 5-7x zoom in order to see what's coming down my rather long driveway. I should have been more clear about that, sorry.
If the zoom is lower, say only 3-4x, then I would want a higher native resolution, in order to do a bit of digital zooming in a pinch.

I did run across this one. It's considerably more money, and I know nothing about that brand, but it seems to have the specs I'm looking for. Anyone know anything about it? Garbage or worth considering?

 

[samplenhold]

Amazon.com : Amcrest 4MP Outdoor PTZ POE + IP Camera Pan Tilt Zoom (Optical 12x Motorized) UltraHD POE+ Camera Security Speed Dome, CMOS Image Sensor, 328ft Night Vision, POE+ (802.3at) - IP66, 4MP, IP4M-1053EW : Camera & Photo

Amazon.com : Amcrest 4MP Outdoor PTZ POE + IP Camera Pan Tilt Zoom (Optical 12x Motorized) UltraHD POE+ Camera Security Speed Dome, CMOS Image Sensor, 328ft Night Vision, POE+ (802.3at) - IP66, 4MP, IP4M-1053EW : Camera & Photo

www.amazon.com

This is a Dahua OEM. Some folks here have used it. I have no experience with it.

 

[wittaj]

If the zoom is lower, say only 3-4x, then I would want a higher native resolution, in order to do a bit of digital zooming in a pinch.

It would be nice if that is how it works, but it isn't. Look at a cell phone camera for example. My cell phone has a 12MP camera with an 8 times zoom and the quality is horrible when zoomed in. Sensor size is much more important than MP.

Heck even a nice Dahua 4MP cam with a 1/2.8" sensor will look like pixelated crap with a digital zoom.

If cost is a big factor, which it sounds like, you will be much better off with a 2MP than a crammed in 4MP or higher.

 

[jon2]

how about this one Andy will have them in stock
Review-Dahua SD42212T-HN 2mp Starlight 12x PTZ | IP Cam Talk

 

[Elmojo]

Thanks, but that's over the budget, has no IR, and the link says it's no longer available anyway. :/

 

[sebastiantombs]

I'm not trying to be insulting with this, but think about it for a minute You have a set of nice requirements/wants and a budget goal. You're posting on a board populated with professional video surveillance people, advanced amateur surveillance people and some serious hobbyists. If such a camera actually existed don't you think we'd all be using it instead of spending money, as in $100 and up, for fixed focal length cameras and well into the hundreds for PTZ cameras? Unfortunately, you're looking for a Unicorn or a very low end, consumer grade, poor performing, camera.

 

[Elmojo]

Oh, I fully understand. That's why I came here, because I figured that if anyone would know what to pick, it would be you folks. I just think that maybe the standards here are a bit higher than what I'm looking for. As I said in the OP, this is not a serious security setup. I don't require a hardened installation, or super hi-res imagery, or advanced facial recognition. All I want is a few basic cameras at a reasonable price. I totally get that nothing comes for free. It just seems that this forum is sort of focused on a single brand (Dahua). I may just try a couple other cams on my own, and will report back if I find something that works well enough for my purposes. I'm sure there are others who would benefit from that info.
That being said, I don't mind spending a little more if there's a cam out there that ticks the boxes, but so far I haven't really seen it. The closest I've found is this one, but I'm not sure of the brand, and no one has commented on it.

 

[sebastiantombs]

The basic cameras here, in fact almost all the cameras discussed here, do not have advanced AI features as a rule. There are some that include basic AI functions, people or vehicle recognition, but they are not at all high end cameras and results vary with those features. That camera you linked to has a 1/2.5" sensor for a 5MP picture. That results in poor night performance. If you're looking for "toy" level cameras, have at it, but you asked for a good camera. When looking at any camera, chase the sensor size not the megapixels. That provides best performance under all conditions, but especially with low light.