Need help picking 9 cameras

[havjoe]

I've identified the need for 9 cameras to have good coverage on a large property.
Here's what I'm looking for:

* One PTZ with awesome night vision. I'm looking to be able to view wide angle as well as zoom into around 60 feet away into the street to capture crisp detail. I don't need invisible/covert IR for this one. This will be mounted high, maybe 8ft high on a gate.
* One 4mm fixed lens with awesome night vision. Again, I don't need invisible/covert IR for this one either. It will not have a wall to be mounted on, I need to somehow mount it to a tree or steel rods staked into the backyard.
* Two 2.8mm wide angle fixed lens with invisible (940nm) IR. These will be mounted on walls or eaves, and I'll be painting them dark brown to blend in. They are covering outdoor guest/social areas, so I don't want for the little red eyes to cause attention. I don't want guests to feel "watched".
* One 4mm fixed lens with invisible (940nm) IR. This too will be painted dark brown and installed on the eaves (to blend in), as they are covering outdoor guest/social areas.
* One 3.6mm fixed lens with invisible (940nm) IR. This too will be installed on the eaves covering outdoor guest/social areas.
* Two 6mm fixed lens with invisible (940nm) IR. Same story here. An eaves installation covering outdoor guest/social areas.

Any recommendations? Any insights?
For the invisible IR cameras, is it better to get a normal IR camera and turn-off the IR and use external 940nm emitters?
Or is it better to get the 940nm IR built-in to the camera? Should all the cameras be IP cameras?

By the way, I'm looking for high resolution for all these cameras in the day time and especially at night. I am thinking 3MP is my minimum resolution.

Would love some help!

Thanks!!

 

[nayr]

i dont follow the logic, you dont want guests to feel like they are watched? but only durring the nighttime? Somehow in the daytime they wont mind seeing cameras and its only night time that it will bother them? Are any of these cameras your painting dark brown going to be exposed to sunlight? because your very likely to overheat the cameras painting them a dark color and sticking em in the sun.. they are white for a good reason.

2.8mm optics are almost never appropriate to use outdoors.. they can only see mebe a dozen feet at night well enough to identify anything.. unless its in an enclosed space where nothing far from the camera will ever be seen they should be avoided at all costs outside.

All cameras should be IP, and all the ones with 940nm built in are junk looking for the gullible to purchase them.. there is a good reason why none of the big camera manufacturers have any models using 'invisible IR' as 940nm IR is a waste of electricity.. its a gimmick, and you've taken the bait.

tip: people are not put off by external security cameras, every business you walk into has you on camera, most every intersection you drive through gets you on camera, they are ubiquitous and nobody pays them any regard.. it'd be like saying airplanes flying over people's heads will make them uneasy.. mebe it did shortly after they first invented the aeroplane and they were pretty much all military tools of destruction; but that has not been the case for a very long time.

 

[havjoe]

i dont follow the logic, you dont want guests to feel like they are watched? but only durring the nighttime? Somehow in the daytime they wont mind seeing cameras and its only night time that it will bother them?

I appreciate your point of view nayr. Let me clear things up. I want to have cameras on the inside of our property (it is a large property) to be able to view and record all of the main entry points around the property’s perimeter. At the same time, I really want to my home to feel like a home, and not a business or a place being monitored. At night time, I feel that the red lights of security cameras that I’ve seen are too noticeable and creepy for guests while entertaining, etc. Hence the reasoning behind the “invisible” IR. In the day time, the red lights are a non-issue. The only issue then becomes the glaring white color of many of the cameras out there. Hence, my desire to paint them to blend in to the eaves. It’s all purely aesthetic.

Are any of these cameras your painting dark brown going to be exposed to sunlight? because your very likely to overheat the cameras painting them a dark color and sticking em in the sun.. they are white for a good reason.

Good point! Yes, one or two of them may be exposed to direct sunlight. I’ll rethink their location. That being said, I’ve seen dark grey and black cameras being sold online. I just wasn’t sure if Hikvision, Dahua, and the other top makers sell them in colors other than white.

2.8mm optics are almost never appropriate to use outdoors.. they can only see mebe a dozen feet at night well enough to identify anything.. unless its in an enclosed space where nothing far from the camera will ever be seen they should be avoided at all costs outside.

Ok, good to know nayr. What is the minimum wide angle you’d use if you wanted to see and identify clearly at night?

All cameras should be IP, and all the ones with 940nm built in are junk looking for the gullible to purchase them.. there is a good reason why none of the big camera manufacturers have any models using 'invisible IR' as 940nm IR is a waste of electricity.. its a gimmick, and you've taken the bait.

Thanks for the insight on the built-in 940nm. What do you think about external 940nm light emitters and then turning-off the visible IR on the camera? Reading online, it seems to be something that is not too uncommon for covert recording.

 

[nayr]

outdoors the problem at night is light, and going for 940nm gives you a small fraction of illumination per watt.. so all things equal, and they are.. a 850nm is 2-3x more effective and to get equivalent lighting capabilities requires 2-3x more emitters of the same power.

most colored cameras are plastic housing, but metal ones are pretty much exclusively white.. the metal ones are better outside in the long term.

use https://ipvm.com/calculator and keep ppf > 100 for adequate levels of night time ID capabilities.. the lens depends on the distance to the target areas.. say you want to watch a driveway but the best vantage point is 25ft away front the front doors.. well your going to need to skip wide angle and use zoom if you want to get good video of someone breaking into that car (6-8mm).. 4mm is about the widest id go in most places outside, and thats if the camera is right on a target area like a door/gate/sidewalk.. 2.8mm is starting to give a bit of fisheye effect on most cameras and does alot better inside where 90 degree corners are abundant.

 

[Kawboy12R]

If you want your cams to be unobtrusive to guests, pick cams with good low-light ability and turn off the IR in the cameras. Most later model Hiks and I assume Dahuas can do that. Then use your normal white lighting to enable the cameras to see. The cams won't be glowing and sticking out like sore thumbs to those that might focus on that and feel uncomfortable. Offbrand Chinese cams (Longse, etc) can't turn off their IR via a software setting.

And yes, you can use 940nm illuminators with the built-in IR turned off. I've done that to good effect where mounting a big floodlight isn't more eyesore that it's worth.

 

[FrankOceanXray]

Why IR and not just some good landscape lighting? Along the lines of kawboy.... good night vision cameras coupled with appropriately, astheically pleasing and security minded lighting.

I have a camera that never switches to night mode due to good lighting.

 

[havjoe]

Why IR and not just some good landscape lighting? Along the lines of kawboy.... good night vision cameras coupled with appropriately, astheically pleasing and security minded lighting.

I have a camera that never switches to night mode due to good lighting.

Ok, that sounds really good, FrankOceanXray. I will explore this, I like its aesthetic bent.
Thanks!

 

[FrankOceanXray]

Ok, that sounds really good, FrankOceanXray. I will explore this, I like its aesthetic bent.
Thanks!

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