new BI setup - camera advise

[ray-zin]

Hi All.

I'm just about ready to start my move over to BI and digital cameras.
I intend to do it in 2 stages. The first stage is to bolster where I currently have very little
camera coverage - Property perimeter, which is the most important for crime in our area.

I currently have 8 analog Cameras on a Dahua DVR.

So to begin with I'll get a BI compatible PC, poe switch and a few IP cams. (all of which i've been researching here on there forums.)

I'll also stream the current DVR to BI as per Fenderman's earlier advice. Eventually I'll phase out the DVR once I have enough cash to replace all the cameras and cabeling.

I hope to end with around 12 cameras.

My first phase of the change over to BI will include getting somed decent cameras to monitor my perimeter wall. I'm less bothered about
id'ing perps than I am about monitoring for property breaches etc. (On the boundary - that is.)
So these cameras will be around 3.5 meters (11 ft) up (1 meter (3 ft) above the top of my wall looking over the wall.) - aimed parallel to look
up and down the wall.

As per the attached / below perimeter diagram I'm looking for advice on cameras and placement based on the distances needing coverage.
In terms of cameras...
I'm thinking these or a combination of these: (They seem very hightly rated here and I've contacted Andy for prices).
2 X IPC-HFW5231E-Z5 - 2mp bullet
2 X IPC-HFW5231E-Z12 - 2mp bullet

On the picture below. The RED highlighted area is where I'm looking to cover/view with the cameras outside my wall.



The idea i have is to have some good zone crossing logic/settings to create alerts for these and to also be able to see clearly enough over the distances shown, both day and night. (Perp id at face/head height is not required for these cameras.)

At the moment I have an entry level Dahua camera mounted where I have the bottom left Z12 earmarked for. And I can't see a damned thing at night beyond around 20 meters (60 ft).

As this is the first phase and I'll be running the cables on one side of the property from 1 poe switch I may actually move the one camera as follows: (To avoid more than 100m cable run to the furthest camera)



Any advise / comments on the below will be hightly appreciated.

I've also read and bookmarked a bunch of threads here in terms of hardware advise and I'm sure I'll be asking for some clarifications on those soon also.

Thanks for your time.
R.

 

[bp2008]

You can often get away with more than 100 meters if the cable is good quality. Dahua designs some cameras and PoE switches for extended range (beyond 500 meters for a single cable run).

Or you can break up a long run by putting another switch in the middle. The last switch before the camera is the only one that needs to be PoE.

How much light do you have there at night? 200 feet is too far for the camera's built-in IR to do well. You might want to invest in additional outdoor lighting as well. White light and IR cost similar amounts to install, so you might as well use white light in my opinion. Since this looks like a business property and not a residential area, I doubt anyone would complain about having bright lights on all night.

For simple intrusion detection, thermal cameras do a good job since they won't be bothered by rain, snow, shadows, headlights, etc. But they are beyond worthless for identification, and pretty pricey, so not a lot of people appreciate them like I do. (on sale for $234) FLIR TCX T4325BN Thermal IP camera

 

[ray-zin]

Thanks bp2008 for your response. You've just sent me off on a thermal camera research mission. lol.
I never realized that thermal was even an option price wise. - I may get one one like yourself just to play with. We are pretty hot here most times of the year so I wonder how effective it would be.
Regarding the 200ft mentioned above. It would actually be half that as I'd have 2 cameras to cover the distance. 1 pointing down the road and another pointing up. (on the longest stretch) .
Do you think the above mentioned cameras would cover the distances required without additional lighting.
The top stretch (130 ft.) does actually already have lighting on the outside of the wall all along the wall. (I will also add another camera on the top right corner at a later stage pointing down toward the left again. - But for now I'm looking at starting my BI adventures with the above-mentioned configuration. I'm hoping the camera's will be sufficient.

 

[bp2008]

Very warm weather does limit the effectiveness of a thermal camera as it makes people blend in more with their surroundings. I had a few warm-weather example videos in that thread.

I haven't personally tested a Z12, and my Z5 is installed in a place with lots of other cameras and a fairly bright illuminator helping out. This is at about the middle of its zoom range. The dog is 100ft away and the house in the background is ~210 feet.

So I'm guessing you'll be fine without additional light, particularly if there is any ambient light at all.

 

[ray-zin]

Perfect. Thanks so much. Judging by the image you posted above I'll be more fine with 2 x z5s and 2 x z12s.

The z12s could be overkill but as this is just phase 1 of my project I will soon find out id they are not better suited in other areas.

I guess that's part of the fun of a diy setup. Getting to understand every part of the setup and what works where ;-)

Thanks for the advice.

 

[bp2008]

Yup. According to specs, the Z5's IR is good for up to 100 meters. Of course we all know how camera manufacturers exaggerate that. Z12 is specced for up to 200 meters, which I think means it is more tightly focused toward the center, and not necessarily brighter overall.

Another thing to note is that the Z12's larger zoom range also includes being able to zoom wider than the Z5, making the Z12 a more flexible camera.

Z5 horizontal FOV: 35° - 12°
Z12 horizontal FOV: 59° - 5°

 

[ray-zin]

Hmmmm... So maybe with the negligible price difference it would make more. Sense to get 4 z12s?