Newbie with some basic questions

N

Nidstang

n3wb
Oct 1, 2023
18
3
Australia
Hi all

I've managed to get a camera system up and running from scratch using all the information here. It's taken me a solid 3 or 4 months of research, ordering and setting everything up, but I got there in the end! My brain is fried from scouring forums.

I have a bunch of niggling questions which I think are easy to answer, and don't want to open new threads for these, hope this is OK. I'm not 100% on forum etiquette lol.

Also I have a 940nm illuminator which I will be testing out down the track in case people are interested.

Here is my setup:
  • Blue Iris installed on my server PC and BI android app on my phone
  • Using CodeProject.AI for LPR.
  • OpenVPN on my router
  • Cameras are blocked from the internet in my router
  • Currently have one each of 5442T-ZE, 5842T-ZE, COLOR4K-T 3.6mm and 5241E-Z12E for testing around the place

NETWORK:
1. I have only configured a LAN connection in the BI app, then use OpenVPN. Is there a way to receive push notifications, or must I configure a WAN connection and use port forwarding? I've heard port forwarding is bad, but then you need it for things like Uptime Watchdog. What is the common setup here?

2. Is it OK to have my phone connected to OpenVPN all day while at work? (if required to receive notifications).

3. Below are default settings on the router, are any of these a concern and should I disable them? I have port forwarding turned off elsewhere.
Screenshot 2024-01-17 180308.png

4. Should I disconnect my home server from the internet? What is normal practice?

5. Apparently in Australia, no mobile network providers offer email-to-sms/mms services. You must subscribe to a 3rd party and pay per msg. Is anyone in Australia running a setup like this and who are you using? Best pricing I have seen is 34c to 39c per MMS, which could quickly snowball out of control if I mess up my trigger/alert settings which is likely lol.
 

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Continued....

BI APP:
6. I've had occasional issues with the android BI app, where it will consume a massive amount of data upon opening and auto-login, fail to load anything, and hang for minutes at a time. Clearing the cache doesn't help, but clearing data does - which means I must then reconfigure the app. Anyone else had this issue?

BI DESKTOP:
7. When using timeline view to export clips, if I'm inactive for a minute or so the view resets to live view and I must do it all again finding the spot and start/end points. Which sucks when I'm trying to export multiple views of the same event. Can this be prevented?

8. Are all the 'trigger' settings mutually inclusive i.e. if you have all the advanced settings on, does the object need to be the correct size/contrast AND travel X pixels AND cross zone before triggering? I believe this is the case from testing but want to confirm.

9. Is there a way to 'test' trigger settings on old footage, but without affecting the camera and making it restart every time? Will cloning a camera so I can play with trigger settings against old footage work?

10. The files (jpg and dat) saved in the Alerts folder show the 'starting hour' of the recording, but then the numbers after that seem to be jibberish (see pic). Can it be changed to show timestamp? I'm relying on the Windows 'date modified' field for time stamp, but it doesn't show seconds, and I can see this being unreliable if things get moved around etc.

This also applies to exported clips - these don't have the 'jibberish' numbers but just a numerical suffix. I'd like the timestamp on the filename. Is this possible to automate?
View attachment 183069

CAMERAS:
11. Is there a way to overlay settings using either the camera GUI or BI? For example overlay resolution or BI triggered state or if it's running in day/night mode? Things that will help me troubleshoot my settings and provide history.
 
Keep in mind that these cameras are designed around 850nm, so the effective range of 940nm will be greatly reduced to not even being seen.

The 4K/T doesn't even see infrared and the Z12E has been shown to not even see 940nm.

OpenVPN replaces the need for port forwarding.

Many here leave their OpenVPN on all day - comes down to your mobile provider.

You will still receive push notifications from the paid BI app without the VPN connected, it just won't have photos. That is why most of us the Pushover app which can get photos regardless, and then instead of leaving OpenVPN on all day, we only use it if the push gives us a reason to have to remote in.

You don't want to use email to SMS - all the providers have been tightening algorithms and for most of us they quit working out of BI - plus you mention previously in your questions about push notifications - if you do push, no need for SMS also.

I have not experienced what you have with the BI app, but most of use the UI3 that is native to BI - faster and cleaner. The paid BI app is only needed if you use two-way talk cameras or want push notifications. But with the Pushover app, that takes care of that.

Most turn off the move X number of pixels and reset at X% - only use those if you have false triggers you are trying to avoid, especially if you are using CodeProject - you want CodeProject to reject the motion.
 
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Awesome I didn't see mention of the Pushover app on my travels, but it looks like what I need. I could never get the push notifications to work in the BI app, but I didn't follow their Remote Access Wizard because I think it wanted to enable UPnP or forward ports and I don't understand these things well enough to be comfortable yet. But that's redundant now, looks like Pushover is the go.

Yes I've disabled Object Detection on my LPR, because I found that since the full vehicle is not on screen, and not there for long, BI doesn't have enough time to determine that it's a discrete 'object'. The basic motion detection has been working well. Sounds like you're saying do this for all cameras, I'll play around with it. But then this means I can't use zone crossing correct, because BI must first detect there is an 'object' there before it crosses zones?

Thanks for the feedback. Well that answers a good chunk, if anyone can comment on 3, 7, 9, 10 & 11 it would be appreciated :thumb:

The 940nm is 13W, and was detected by the 5442 and Z12E. It was really bright like a floodlight to 30m away, but whether this is because they mislabeled the unit at the factory lol or if it is also emitting 850nm wavelengths I'm yet to determine. There is still a red glow so I'm suspicious.. I won't have time to check it out for a long while.
 
Nidstang said:
The 940nm is 13W, and was detected by the 5442 and Z12E. It was really bright like a floodlight to 30m away, but whether this is because they mislabeled the unit at the factory lol or if it is also emitting 850nm wavelengths I'm yet to determine. There is still a red glow so I'm suspicious.. I won't have time to check it out for a long while.
Click to expand...
Humans generally can't see a weak 940 but if it's bright (powerful) enough, they'll likely see a dim glow in total darkness. Pretty much the same with most cams that are designed to see any IR in the first place......they see 850 best but can see 940 if it's bright (powerful) enough.
 
TonyR said:
Humans generally can't see a weak 940 but if it's bright (powerful) enough, they'll likely see a dim glow in total darkness. Pretty much the same with most cams that are designed to see any IR in the first place......they see 850 best but can see 940 if it's bright (powerful) enough.
Click to expand...

I had read the same thing. Factory default is full power, my plan is to dial it down and see if I can find a balance between red-glow visibility and illumination. I've seen some posts about cameras not being able to detect 940nm etc but in my very brief search haven't located real world results using a decent wattage 940nm illuminator yet. My application is a narrow beam over a short distance, so feel I can get it to work for me but time will tell.
 
Do keep in mind that the camera can see 940nm if you are on auto/default settings as the shutter is slowed way down.

Once you dial in the settings (shutter faster than 1/60s and more like 1/120s) to minimize blur/ghost of moving objects, that is when you will really notice that the range of 940nm is very small for these cameras designed for 850nm.

For example the Z12E is used by many here for plate reading, so at night we are running 1/1000 or 1/2000 shutters and a plate held 20 feet away from only 940nm IR could not be seen.
 
wittaj said:
For example the Z12E is used by many here for plate reading, so at night we are running 1/1000 or 1/2000 shutters and a plate held 20 feet away from only 940nm IR could not be seen.
Click to expand...
Is there a post with the Z12E test? I knew I shouldn't have mentioned this, I'm only interested in my questions :( The illuminator is just something to play around with and a nice-to-have if I get it working.
 
You arent going to notice any difference in the visual intensity of the LED's looking at them with the IR illuminator at 10% or 100%
 
It is good you mentioned it because in the future you would say the image sucks at night and you will add that you have external IR and we would all troubleshoot only to not be able to help because 940nm was not mentioned :lmao:

Here is the thread that tested it. And my bad, it was the 740nm that the cameras can't see, but it showed that 940nm had trouble with contrast and the range isn't as effective.

Poor IR contrast in new Tennessee license plates

I've noticed an issue with nighttime capture of new 2022 Tennessee license plates. The white lettering on a blue background washes out almost completely in IR light, making the plates barely readable. Has anyone encountered similar issues with other plates? I'm wondering if additional IR...
ipcamtalk.com ipcamtalk.com
 
@wittaj Ah OK I saw that thread, but just glanced over it. I didn't want to get into this, but I did 15 mins of testing using the Z12E, same night-time shutter settings, and it looked promising. But there are a hundred variables and it will be the last thing I do as I've only scratched the surface of using Blue Iris. Also the scenario you mentioned would never happen, I'm too pedantic with details :paranoid:

Any feedback on 3, 7, 9, 10 & 11 would be awesome :headbang:
 
Nidstang said:
Hi all

I've managed to get a camera system up and running from scratch using all the information here. It's taken me a solid 3 or 4 months of research, ordering and setting everything up, but I got there in the end! My brain is fried from scouring forums.

I have a bunch of niggling questions which I think are easy to answer, and don't want to open new threads for these, hope this is OK. I'm not 100% on forum etiquette lol.

Also I have a 940nm illuminator which I will be testing out down the track in case people are interested.

Here is my setup:
  • Blue Iris installed on my server PC and BI android app on my phone
  • Using CodeProject.AI for LPR.
  • OpenVPN on my router
  • Cameras are blocked from the internet in my router
  • Currently have one each of 5442T-ZE, 5842T-ZE, COLOR4K-T 3.6mm and 5241E-Z12E for testing around the place

NETWORK:
1. I have only configured a LAN connection in the BI app, then use OpenVPN. Is there a way to receive push notifications, or must I configure a WAN connection and use port forwarding? I've heard port forwarding is bad, but then you need it for things like Uptime Watchdog. What is the common setup here?

2. Is it OK to have my phone connected to OpenVPN all day while at work? (if required to receive notifications).

3. Below are default settings on the router, are any of these a concern and should I disable them? I have port forwarding turned off elsewhere.
View attachment 183068

4. Should I disconnect my home server from the internet? What is normal practice?

5. Apparently in Australia, no mobile network providers offer email-to-sms/mms services. You must subscribe to a 3rd party and pay per msg. Is anyone in Australia running a setup like this and who are you using? Best pricing I have seen is 34c to 39c per MMS, which could quickly snowball out of control if I mess up my trigger/alert settings which is likely lol.
Click to expand...
If these are basic questions then I'm in way over my head haha :). I'm new as of yesterday.
 
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