Security Light sensor switch and Security Camera are Fighting!

[sparker1]

Hello all. New member here.

I have recently installed a security camera under the eave of my home. I didn't think it would matter that it was placed about half a metre and in front of an existing light sensor switch for some security lights. You can guess that it did.

Anyway, the security lights started coming on for no apparent reason. I found that If I switched off the camera the security lights went back to normal. I even covered up the "eye" of the sensor with duct tape but they still came on.
A little googling tells me that the sensor is picking up the heat from the camera and causing the lights to switch on. I believe the sensor picks up infrared heat. I am guessing that infrared must be able to penetrate the duct tape, so the lights kept coming on even when the sensor was covered.

It was quite an effort for me to install the camera. I am 71 years old and there were times when I was crawling through the roof cavity/taking off roof sheeting that I thought I was going to croak. I don't want to go through much of that again.
My question is this: I can move the camera back behind and to the side of the sensor (about 300 mm) but will the sensor still pick up the heat from behind it? The sensor is only supposed to have a 180 degree field in front of it.

This is a similar sensor switch

https://hpm.com.au/product/indoor-movement-sensor-180/

Here are some photos.

 

[alastairstevenson]

A little googling tells me that the sensor is picking up the heat from the camera and causing the lights to switch on.

I think it's more likely that the PIR is reacting in some way to the IR illumination from the camera.
Is there anything in view that would move with a breeze, plants, bushes, branches etc when strongly illuminated by the IR from the camera?
That's what PIRs detect - changes in the IR from the scene they are pointing at.

Assuming you are recording the video - if you review playback when the light comes on, do you see movement in the scene from plants, bushes, tree branches etc?

In the camera web GUI, can you shut down the IR and see if the effect goes away?
Admittedly the camera will consume a few watts less when IR is off.

 

[TonyR]

Specs say it's PIR (Passive Infrared) so it's likely picking up IR radiation from the cam, IMO.
What @alastairstevenson suggested (turned off cam's IR in its webGUI) is an easy and great way to determine that for sure.

If that proves out, could you move the cam behind the 180 degree detection range of the PIR sensor, like near the downspout as below?

EDIT: you might also have to adjust cam down a tad to prevent IR reflection off more of the white soffit....maybe not.

 

[crw030]

Maybe try to locate a “dual technology” motion sensor to replace that passive one. Sometimes they are also called pet immune motion detectors, but basically they combine microwave and PIR as a combo to “detect” motion. I doubt an IR camera, that is getting warm nor pointing at something that might be moving slightly (like a bush) would trip such a sensor.

 

[TonyR]

I doubt an IR camera, that is getting warm nor pointing at something that might be moving slightly (like a bush) would trip such a sensor.

I think the dual tech sensor is a great idea.
FWIW, it's not camera "heat" as you or I would sense readily, we're talking infrared radiation that the cam's IR LED's emit and the PIR sensor detects, so I think that's wherein the issue lies....IMO.

 

[crw030]

we're talking infrared radiation that the cam's IR LED's emit and the PIR sensor detects

Yeah for some reason I thought Camera IR (850nm) would be far enough away from human body heat IR (10,000nm) that the PIR wouldn't be optimized to sense it. I thought maybe if the camera was "warming up" (like when the IR kicks on, or simply from running) it might emit heat that could be mistaken for a person, but wouldn't be moving if that was the case.

Whatever the cause that's why I was thinking a dual-tech motion detector might be able to avoid those issues. Simple PIR sensors by cheap design will give you more false positives. I really need to install my Bosch Tri-Techs (which are technically just PIR + Microwave + "PIR Look down") because they have been sitting in a box for at least a year.

 

[sparker1]

Well, I made a shield for the camera out of some zinc sheet. It is just a rough "proof of concept" type of affair at the moment. It seems to have worked so I'll see how it goes for a few more nights and then, if it works I will move the camera over near the downpipe or, if I am feeling lazy, maybe I'll just make a more professional version of the shield. Many thanks to all who helped me.

 

[sparker1]

Bad news. It didn't work. So I once again turned off all the cameras. Then I wound back the timer on the PIR to give me some relief. It still kept coming on without any trigger. Then I turned the PIR bevel right around so that it faced the eave to rule out any possible movement trigger and the damn thing still kept coming on and no amount of winding back on the timer would affect it. It would stay on for around 5 minutes no matter what. At least now I know it's the PIR and not camera/PIR having an infrared/heat fight. Sorry to have wasted everybody's time on what is now a simple replacement of the PIR.

 

[rocky500]

Its your sensor that has a broken cover. Mine did the same on/off all the time and I replaced with a new sensor with its cover intact and all was good.

 

[sparker1]

You're right. The break in the cover was made worse by me when I taped it over and then I removed the tape which pulled more of it out.
I keep fixing things until they're completely broken.

 

[c hris527]

Its your sensor that has a broken cover. Mine did the same on/off all the time and I replaced with a new sensor with its cover intact and all was good.

Nice Catch

 

[TonyR]

Its your sensor that has a broken cover.

Good eye, man.