system upgrade help/new desktop

[dholtz9]

Hello,
What a great forum- thanks for all the posts!
I am ready to upgrade from my i7-6700 4ghz, 4 core, 8 proc. machine. (4.5 years old) I need help to pick a new machine in the $1,000-$1,300 range. I have read the wiki, etc. Still not easy to choose one without extra hardware i don't need.
I am running 17 cameras, from .9-8.3 Mpixels.
I would love help setting it up correctly from a fresh install- i don't mind paying a consultant if someone is interested. My main concern is CPU usage and how/where to store the files. I have seen the posts on how to do it myself, but would appreciate an expert this time around. The next step would also be to help analyze why i miss recordings and replace some cameras. In other words- master plan for upgrading an older system that's been pieced together.
I am in Northern San Diego if someone happened to be local- but not required.
Thank you!

 

[wittaj]

That current machine is more than capable.

I suspect you are not running EVERY optimization in the wiki.

Substreams are a must.

A member here is running 50 cameras on a 4th generation CPU at 30% CPU,

I have more cameras than you on a 4th generation running at sub 15%CPU.

Post a screenshot of your BI camera status tab that shows the FPS, MP, etc.

Optimizing Blue Iris's CPU Usage

Blue Iris uses a lot of CPU time. In most Blue Iris installations, your CPU is the limiting factor which determines how many cameras you can have. As such, it is extremely important to optimize your configuration to ensure you can get the most out of your system while consuming the least...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[TVille]

I have 12 cameras, 2 to 4 MP, running on the machine that you say is uderpowered. Running DeepStack AI (improves motion detection) and OpenALPR (Automatic License Plate Reader), I run around 10% CPU. I only have 8 GB ram. You need to go through the link @wittaj has above.

 

[sebastiantombs]

I've got 20 cameras running on that exact processor. CPU utilization is between 10% at night and 25% during the day. 15Mb/ps and around 200MP/ps. Out of curiosity, how much memory is in the machine? 16GB is probably where you want to be with that.

 

[wittaj]

Yep you are not using the substreams...with the substream almost any tower intel CPU will work... You could buy the same one or a 4th generation, or spend more for a newer one. That is your choice. Just make sure it is intel and in a tower/Desktop and not a mini or laptop.

Sub Stream Guide

.substreamGuide td { border: 1px solid #000000; } .substreamGuide a { color: #0080ff; } .substreamGuide code.inline { margin: 0; background: #f6f6f6; border: 1px solid #e0e0e0; border-radius: 0px; padding-top: 1px; padding-right: 3px; padding-bottom: 1px...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[sebastiantombs]

Looking at the frame and key frame rates begs the question, what kind of cameras? Some may not be capable of sub streams and some of yours need to be set to matching frame and iframe rates to get a key frame rate of 1.

 

[dholtz9]

Thank you! Another thing I overlooked- I frame. I need to spend some time on these items.
suggestions on where to buy pc from? Brand?
Thx!

 

[SouthernYankee]

Buy a business grade DELL or HP computer off of EBAY.
If your computer set up correct is more than enough to do the job.
I run an OLD i7-4790 with way more load than you at under 20% with 700 MP/Sec

 

[dholtz9]

this seems like a lot for the money. any reason besides price not to get it?

2021 Newest HP Pavilion Desktop, 10th Gen Intel Core i7-10700F 8-Core Processor, AMD Radeon RX 550, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD + 2TB HDD, DVD, Wi-Fi, HDMI, Bluetooth, Windows 10 Home, KKE Mousepad, Silver

Amazon.com: 2021 Newest HP Pavilion Desktop, 10th Gen Intel Core i7-10700F 8-Core Processor, AMD Radeon RX 550, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD + 2TB HDD, DVD, Wi-Fi, HDMI, Bluetooth, Windows 10 Home, KKE Mousepad, Silver: Computers & Accessories

Amazon.com: 2021 Newest HP Pavilion Desktop, 10th Gen Intel Core i7-10700F 8-Core Processor, AMD Radeon RX 550, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD + 2TB HDD, DVD, Wi-Fi, HDMI, Bluetooth, Windows 10 Home, KKE Mousepad, Silver: Computers & Accessories

www.amazon.com

 

[TVille]

this seems like a lot for the money. any reason besides price not to get it?

2021 Newest HP Pavilion Desktop, 10th Gen Intel Core i7-10700F 8-Core Processor, AMD Radeon RX 550, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD + 2TB HDD, DVD, Wi-Fi, HDMI, Bluetooth, Windows 10 Home, KKE Mousepad, Silver

Amazon.com: 2021 Newest HP Pavilion Desktop, 10th Gen Intel Core i7-10700F 8-Core Processor, AMD Radeon RX 550, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD + 2TB HDD, DVD, Wi-Fi, HDMI, Bluetooth, Windows 10 Home, KKE Mousepad, Silver: Computers & Accessories

Amazon.com: 2021 Newest HP Pavilion Desktop, 10th Gen Intel Core i7-10700F 8-Core Processor, AMD Radeon RX 550, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD + 2TB HDD, DVD, Wi-Fi, HDMI, Bluetooth, Windows 10 Home, KKE Mousepad, Silver: Computers & Accessories

www.amazon.com

What problem are you trying to solve? Computer to run 20 cameras is less than $400 on eBay. For that I would get, at least: i7-6700, 16GB ram, and buy an additional hard drive or two for video storage. The Wiki on here has a storage calculator. I bought this computer on ebay, with only 8 GB ram for $335 or so last month.

The computer you linked to is way more than needed, and too small at the same time. It does not appear to have enough hard drive space for video storage.

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

 

[wittaj]

And the F means that the CPU lacks the integrated graphics that are usually found in Intel CPUs and thus requires a discrete graphics card. Granted this one comes with a card.

But I agree with others and I have mentioned it as well, the machine you have is quite capable of running BI just fine. It sounds like you need to follow the optimizations to get it to reach its full potential.

You could buy 2 or 3 very capable computers coming off a business lease that will work fine.

Many of us buy refurbished computers that are business class computers that have come off lease. The one I bought I kid you not I could not tell that it was a refurbished unit - not a speck of dust or dents or scratches on it. It appeared to me like everything was replaced and I would assume just the motherboard with the intel processor is what was from the original unit. I went with the lowest end processor on the WIKI list as it was the cheapest and it runs my system fine.

Many of us here would take the existing computer you have that you think you need to update!

If you are looking to spend the money, then go for it, but we are trying to save you that money and spend on something else.

 

[Flintstone61]

Heres a brand new machine, supposedly. This is the machine recommended for surveillance by one of the Forums founders.

HP 4BM69UT EliteDesk 800 G4 SFF Desktop Computer i5-8500 8GB 1TB HDD Win 10 Pro 192545407908 | eBay

Powered for the enterprise, the HP EliteDesk 800 SFF is one of our most secure and manageable PCs featuring high performance and expandability in a space-saving, stylishly designed chassis for the modern workplace.

www.ebay.com

You can find the same ones used on ebay for less. then you could upgrade it with Surveilance drives and RAM, And still have money for a new camera.
heres a used one with a hotter Chip

HP EliteDesk 800 G4 Intel Core i7-8700 @ 3.20GHz 8GB DDR4 256GB SSD SFF | eBay

Model: HP EliteDesk 800 G4 SFF. Point of Sale Systems. Tablet Parts & Accesories. Smartphone Parts & Accesories. iPod & MP3 Players. TV Boards & Parts. Ink & Toner. Server Parts & Accesories.

www.ebay.com

yet another. I have this machine.

HP EliteDesk 800 G4 SFF (i5-8500 3.0GHz, 16GB Ram, 256GB SSD, Windows 10 Pro) | eBay

HP EliteDesk 800 G4 SFF (i5-8500 3.0GHz, 16GB Ram, 256GB SSD, Windows 10 Pro). Condition is "Used". System has been tested and works as designed. Shipped with USPS Priority Mail.

www.ebay.com

It has 2 full sized drive bays for 2 big surveillance drives. and the OS is down on the motherboard on a NVME drive or SSD. I have 15-16 cams split up between two drives and the system is very responsive...with 24 GB of Ram.

 

[sebastiantombs]

Any machine with a graphics card, hopefully in addition to having onboard Intel for QuickSync, should have an NVidia, CUDA capable, card not a Radeon. That way DeepStack can use that card for image processing which seems much more reliable than the CPU version of DeepStack. Again, I'm running 20 cameras on the exact same processor that you currently have, using DeepStack GPU version on an old GTX970, and have the CPU usually at or below 20% utilization. You're trying to swat a fly with a sledge hammer. It's your money, but it seems a shame to waste it. Yes, I'm a cheap old SOB.

 

[Holbs]

I mean... many here have said your current system is more than enough to accomplish what you want. Do not upgrade unless you are one of those folks who has money to toss down the toilet.
For storage, the optimum solution is installing a 3.5" Western Digital Purple (not red, not green, not pink, not neon green but Purple) hard drive (not SSD, not gaming HD, but a dedicated made-for-cameras WD PURPLE ). They come in 2, 4, 8, 10, 12+ TB sizes. Save your $$$ of upgrading your computer & cpu, and spend money on largest TB sized HD you can afford.
Whalla!

 

[dholtz9]

Thank you all! Really helpful! Nice to get feedback and confirmation on this. Glad to hear my current machine is still a good rig.
I am working on 3 systems. And for 1, a budget of $1300. How important is purple drive vs what comes normal? It seems better to buy less expensive and do my own upgrade- especially on hard drive?
How about this one below for as much bullet proof/oversized for 20 cameras, and no work to install a drive?
Thank you-
Daniel

2021 Latest Dell OptiPlex 3080 SFF Desktop Computer - 10th Gen Intel Core i7-10700 up to 4.80 GHz CPU, 16GB RAM, 256GB SSD + 4TB HDD, Intel UHD Graphics 630, DVD Writer, Wireless Mouse, Windows 10 Pro Amazon.com: 2021 Latest Dell OptiPlex 3080 SFF Desktop Computer - 10th Gen Intel Core i7-10700 up to 4.80 GHz CPU, 16GB RAM, 256GB SSD + 4TB HDD, Intel UHD Graphics 630, DVD Writer, Wireless Mouse, Windows 10 Pro: Computers & Accessories

 

[Flintstone61]

It all depends on what type of Drive the 4TB HDD is. If its an SMR drive, it has slower read write perf. So in my personal experience, the 6TB Blue drive was an SMR drive. I replaced with a 8TB Purp drive.
no more hesitancy to replay last nites escapades from BI, whilst the 15 cams were writing data. Huge diff in my case. i thought it was RAM, so I maxed it (32GB), then I added an old WD 5TB and it helped some, but if you were calling on a camera from the Blue drive, it still sucked ass. YMMV

WD Sets the Record Straight: Lists All Drives That Use Slower SMR Tech

WD drops the deets

www.tomshardware.com

 

[Flintstone61]

If You have a Gihugically fast system bottlenecked by a low performing Spinner, it cancels out all the high end thruput.

 

[dholtz9]

How would I know? Is that the case with my current system- after all the optimizations listed?
So it sound like purple is worth it?

 

[Flintstone61]

If you can swing it, its a huge difference. At least in my case. I have a i5-8500, HP Elitedesk running DDR4, and I had upgraded from an i7-3770 ( 4 generations older) Optiplex. and I carried over the Blue drive, and was underwhelmed. Actually quite pissed off. So I went for broke and got the Purp drive. And The system became more responsive like right now.

 

[Flintstone61]

4TB will run some cameras. maybe 4-6 without issue. but if your talking 20 cams, you'd be better off with 2-5400 RPM Purps, or 1- 7200 RPM Purp. If I go for 20 cams, ( currently 15 on Work system), I'm pulling the 5TB WD Blue drive, and getting another 8TB WD Purp drive. But consider, with 100 residents I have motion events somewhere every 30 sec. until maybe midnite. SO BI is getting a work out