The neighbors who ask....

[sdkid]

Many of my neighbors have asked about my cameras. Most often that is along the lines of "Where'd you get your system at?" or "What brand system is that?". They are always confused when I tell them I have just been buying individual cameras as I go and adding them to my video storage (BlueIris) machine.

My latest inquiry....



I told her I was out of town, and would be happy to look at it when I get back. Of course-- the way she asks points to a lack of knowledge right away. She clearly already bought "a system", and is thinking she will get beautiful footage just by placing the cams in the right spots. We know placement is a vital consideration-- but her assumption seems to be that a cam is a cam is a cam....

So I asked her the burning question--- "To best advise you, can you get me the make/model of the camera system you bought?"

She replied with a photo:



Product link:

SecureAlert 4K Security Kit with 4 x Powered Wi-Fi Cameras & NVR Tower | SWNVK-800KH4

Monitor your property with the 4-camera, 4-channel 4K wireless security camera system with controllable red & blue flashing lights and SwannNet wifi connection.

us.swann.com

Oh boy... How do I tell her the "4K" cams will have tiny sensors that will never gather enough light, and the wifi system will be overloaded with data resulting in dropped video--probably at critical points, and that she should just take that back to wherever it came from?

Looking at the product link, the false marketing on this is unbelievable. Talking about how AWESOME the 4k picture is-- in color even at night. They add some fine-print that hints at the functional truth of these cams and system-- and the reliance on strong wifi at each location. Almost certainly, they will get little more than a blurry ghost-trails where someone walks at night-- but they will have beautiful color still-frame images. I already know these are going to be a nightmare.

My concern right now is that when I give her the bad news, I am just going to sound like a condescending know-it-all prick....LOL. I certainly don't know it all-- but I am pretty sure she won't like my suggestion of setting up a proper network for cams and a blueiris machine, as she wants some surveillance NOW.

So-- is there a tactful polite way to rip off the bandaid? LOL

 

[sebastiantombs]

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Just try to be non-technical with why that system is a toy is the only thing I can offer. Above all, don't be condescending about it. I guess a starting point would be the difference between that kind of system and a semi-professional/professional system.

 

[Parley]

Even in total darkness. Bwahahahahahaha. "The cameras plug into power while their video signal back to the NVR is wireless, making installation easy." So, are the cameras are powered by the NVR? Where exactly does the power come from?

 

[sdkid]

Even in total darkness. Bwahahahahahaha. "The cameras plug into power while their video signal back to the NVR is wireless, making installation easy." So, are the cameras are powered by the NVR? Where exactly does the power come from?

They show ac-adapters with barrel connectors--- and power extension cables.

 

[Old Timer]

So if you have to run power cables, why not go wired and actually make then useful?

Well, marketing always knows best
What ever it takes to sell them.

 

[sdkid]

So if you have to run power cables, why not go wired and actually make then useful?

Well, marketing always knows best
What ever it takes to sell them.

EXACTLY!! I think that is the main thing I will focus on-- that she will have to run wires anyway-- so it might as well be done in a way that works for the future.

 

[Old Timer]

With CAT5 or 6, you can run almost anything you might want to upgrade to.
Or even use balums and downgrade to analog. Nothing wrong with analog, just older
technology, and not use as much anymore (mainly low latency needs).

Of cource, I always run extra runs to main spots in case a cable gets damaged, or you want more goodies.

 

[sdkid]

Here's the update-- I broke the news to her-- she and her husband already started running those power cables... but they STOPPED based on what I told them...




I hope they are reading some of those new member posts right now....

 

[Arjun]

One of my neighbors was completely intimidated when I explained my setup. Instead of following my sound advice he decided to install one Ring doorbell in front of his house. And now his wife complains that she can't distinguish the person ringing her doorbell at 12 in the midnight. Whereas the other neighbors that followed my advice are very satisfied with their setups to date.

 

[Sybertiger]

I'd check to see if it's too late to return that system for a full refund. That would be a great start.

 

[Mike A.]

The harder part in convincing them probably will be when they see the difference in cost. That's how it usually goes with people who talk to me about it anyway... "Well then, we'll just try this to get started and see how it works out."

The system that they bought has a list price of $399. Probably paid ~$299 for it, maybe less on sale. Not going to get much in the way of decent NVR/POE cams for that. Double it and you're still not there. Triple it and you're starting to. So I understand the reluctance. And a lot of people are satisfied with much less than we are as far as performance. Just being able to see what's around the house at a pretty basic level is kind of impressive for most.

 

[Sammyf]

You could show them the “Typical picture of a perp…”-topics by Wittaj with the collection of captures with consumer grade cameras and prosumer cameras.

At least for me the conusmer grade topic was an eye opener to understand how unusable pictures you get with cheap systems. Especially when also browsing other camera captures -topics. I was having a Reolink system also by myself, for which I was happy until wanting to get AI and finding my way here. Luckily I found this site before upgrading to other Reolink, total cost (so far lol) is 5x of Reolink with AI, but I’m very happy with the system and have proper coverage. Obviously I also have more cameras than I would have got with a kit, which also makes the current setup more expensive.

 

[looney2ns]

Good luck with that @sdkid , been there done that with my neighbors and family, and it was a complete waste of my time in the end.
I don't know how many times I've left a URL to Ipcamtalk, in a Nextdoor post, that gets completely ignored.
But the flood of ring and nest crap captures continue to populate Nextdoor.

 

[wittaj]

^hey now your neighbors grandson installed them a sweet Night Owl system with awesome views of downspouts

 

[Holbs]

What I tell folks when they ask me about why I have so many cameras and why so much when Costco has a system for $300..
I want clear imperical facial ID and the EVENT evidence to give to the police so they can act on it. Not to laugh at it and roll their eyes saying 'here we go again'.
However, when I have mentioned IPCT and the science of cameras to folks who inquire, they get deer in headlights look. Understandable as I thought the same way back in the beginning. Sometimes, it feels like you are changing their religion or something.
If I pursue the opportunity to install cameras for my business, I plan on having footage side-by-side daytime & evening, static & motion, AI, DORI, etc...comparing Night Owl system type of cameras and Dahua. Let them decide once they see first hand. I'll show them on the lesser system "oh look...there is Elvis. No wait...it's that Sasquatch again, I think, making love to your car's back bumper". And then on a real system "oh look...there is Bob from next door stealing your gas out of your service trucks". Wonder which they would go for.

 

[dudemaar]

worse case tell them to spend $50 bucks more and get a much better system here.

Amcrest 5MP Security System 4K 8CH PoE NVR 4x 5MP Turret PoE Cam 2TB

AMCREST MODEL: NV4108E-IP5M-T1179EW4-2TB NVR FEATURES : Extraordinary Quality: Supports 8-Channel 1080p/3MP/4MP/5MP/8MP/4K Resolution Records 8-Channels @ 1080p/3MP/4MP/5MP/8MP/4K & Playback 8-Channel @1080p(30fps)/4-Channel @4MP(30fps)/2-Channel @4K(30fps) Record in Widescreen, Quick Access...

amcrest.com

at least you have the options for swapping out or adding some 2MP active deterrents from Andy down the road.

 

[RUMBLESTRIP]

I want clear imperical facial ID and the EVENT evidence to give to the police so they can act on it. Not to laugh at it and roll their eyes saying 'here we go again'.

I feel like the usefulness of this is a little exaggerated on the forum. None of this will unsmash your window, return stolen items, or bring family back from the dead. Might it lead to a plea deal, possibly. Might you get $20 reparations when that person gets out of prison, likely. Might that person have plotted their revenge for the last 18 months in their cell? You can bet your life on it, it's just a matter of whether they follow through or not.

I've only provided an ID once to a crime and I was worse off for it. I've only used surveillance to catch a vehicle thief once, and I won $20 after losing thousands. He was back on the street in under a year.

 

[Holbs]

I feel like the usefulness of this is a little exaggerated on the forum. None of this will unsmash your window, return stolen items, or bring family back from the dead. Might it lead to a plea deal, possibly. Might you get $20 reparations when that person gets out of prison, likely. Might that person have plotted their revenge for the last 18 months in their cell? You can bet your life on it, it's just a matter of whether they follow through or not.

I've only provided an ID once to a crime and I was worse off for it. I've only used surveillance to catch a vehicle thief once, and I won $20 after losing thousands. He was back on the street in under a year.

while camera recordings will not stop the CIA or KGB from stealing something out of your car or murdering someone in the house (that is not the purpose of cameras in the first place, alarms systems are)....
they will assist with the vagrant petty crimes in the area so a person can see what happened and hopefully by who. I, myself, have done such with my own security event. Once I was able to get a facial ID and in the act, the person was arrested a couple days later allowing me to get a year long protection order in place. This was...fall of 2019. So far, no repeat/revenge. I have this site to thank for that with advice given and suggested.
I've also helped one of my neighbors with camera captures to the police where they were fighting in the street and he was on meth or something, breaking those 60lb retaining wall stones over his head in a show of his manhood and then swinging and punching at her. So yea...cameras come in handy.

 

[RGL]

Personally, I think the best route with questions is "I'm sorry, but I really can't discuss anything related to my security precautions". It can bite you in the ass in a lot of ways, not just the one that you are experiencing right now.

Many of my neighbors have asked about my cameras. Most often that is along the lines of "Where'd you get your system at?" or "What brand system is that?". They are always confused when I tell them I have just been buying individual cameras as I go and adding them to my video storage (BlueIris) machine.

My latest inquiry....

View attachment 139070

I told her I was out of town, and would be happy to look at it when I get back. Of course-- the way she asks points to a lack of knowledge right away. She clearly already bought "a system", and is thinking she will get beautiful footage just by placing the cams in the right spots. We know placement is a vital consideration-- but her assumption seems to be that a cam is a cam is a cam....

So I asked her the burning question--- "To best advise you, can you get me the make/model of the camera system you bought?"

She replied with a photo:

View attachment 139072

Product link:

SecureAlert 4K Security Kit with 4 x Powered Wi-Fi Cameras & NVR Tower | SWNVK-800KH4

Monitor your property with the 4-camera, 4-channel 4K wireless security camera system with controllable red & blue flashing lights and SwannNet wifi connection.

us.swann.com

Oh boy... How do I tell her the "4K" cams will have tiny sensors that will never gather enough light, and the wifi system will be overloaded with data resulting in dropped video--probably at critical points, and that she should just take that back to wherever it came from?

Looking at the product link, the false marketing on this is unbelievable. Talking about how AWESOME the 4k picture is-- in color even at night. They add some fine-print that hints at the functional truth of these cams and system-- and the reliance on strong wifi at each location. Almost certainly, they will get little more than a blurry ghost-trails where someone walks at night-- but they will have beautiful color still-frame images. I already know these are going to be a nightmare.

My concern right now is that when I give her the bad news, I am just going to sound like a condescending know-it-all prick....LOL. I certainly don't know it all-- but I am pretty sure she won't like my suggestion of setting up a proper network for cams and a blueiris machine, as she wants some surveillance NOW.

So-- is there a tactful polite way to rip off the bandaid? LOL

 

[Holbs]

Personally, I think the best route with questions is "I'm sorry, but I really can't discuss anything related to my security precautions". It can bite you in the ass in a lot of ways, not just the one that you are experiencing right now.

I disagree. We live in neighborhoods and are suppose to look out (to a degree) for each other, even some neighbors are friends, as some of them have done for me. This would be different in a rural farm house setting. Seeing cameras out the front of the house is a basic deterrent. 1st line of defense....one that anyone walking by can see. There is no mention of the glock or shotgun, pitbull kill training, home alarm system that should remain private.