weather cam recommendation

wcleme11

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So I'm thinking about getting a camera to mount on my roof as a weather camera. I currently have 8 (7 Dahua's and 1 Ubiquiti) cameras total so this would be the ninth camera on my blue iris system. I really love the low light performance of the 5231's as they look fantastic during twilight hours. I would like something with a higher resolution though. They launch fireworks off the top of that butte on the right side of the pic below. It'd be cool to capture that this 4th.

What do you guys think would be the best out of the Dahua lineup for this application? Need to stay under $300.

 

wxman

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Wish I could recommend one, but I've had little luck with trying to make a weather cam out of Dahua. I would go with Hikvision. Much better color performance and automation. Dahua hates the sky for some reason. I haven't been able to get nearly the quality shots in auto mode that I've gotten for years with a 3mp Hikvision bullet. With Dahua, I have to adjust settings manually all the time to get the same quality that my old Hik is giving in auto mode. Can get by with it if only using it for real time weather watching where you'll be there to adjust everything manually, but not something you can just leave in auto mode to post images/video to the web 24/7..If that's the goal, then go with a Hikvision and you'll be glad you did!
 

Chase

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That would be an awesome spot for a PTZ.
 

CaliGirl

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wcleme11

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Wish I could recommend one, but I've had little luck with trying to make a weather cam out of Dahua. I would go with Hikvision. Much better color performance and automation. Dahua hates the sky for some reason. I haven't been able to get nearly the quality shots in auto mode that I've gotten for years with a 3mp Hikvision bullet. With Dahua, I have to adjust settings manually all the time to get the same quality that my old Hik is giving in auto mode. Can get by with it if only using it for real time weather watching where you'll be there to adjust everything manually, but not something you can just leave in auto mode to post images/video to the web 24/7..If that's the goal, then go with a Hikvision and you'll be glad you did!
Thanks for the suggestion. What particular model from Hikvision would you recommend?
 

wcleme11

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That would be an awesome spot for a PTZ.
I'd love to put a PTZ up there but I'm not sure I want to risk a $300+ camera up there with the crazy spring hail storms we can get here.
 

CaliGirl

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The Big black face Dahua PTZs are pretty beefy. And no sensitive areas directly on top. I don't think a hail storm would damage it at all. Even if they hit it from the side, it has very well-built metal. And a strong glass panel over the camera lens.
 

wxman

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Here you can see how my 5231 performs: Wind Turbine Live Camera - Zeewolde, The Netherlands - YouTube
Between 5:00 and 22:00 Shutter time is set to 1/3.

Like wxman said, when the clouds are much lighter then ground level, it compensates too much.
At least that's better then frying the sensor.
Do you have WDR on? If not, you should be able to crank that up and help flatten out the brightness extremes between clouds and ground. The bigger issue I've had with Dahua is when too much sky gets in the picture, the white balance goes crazy. All the blue from the sky tricks the processor into thinking there's strong florescent lighting in the scene and it cranks up the red channel to compensate...The end result is the sky turns purple and the grass turns redish/brown...

The Hikvisions will compensate some for this, but not nearly as extreme as the Dahua does, in my experience. Especially the 3mp Hikvisions where the increased vertical field of view allows you to keep lots of ground and sky both in the scene...With yours being mounted on a tall tower, you've got an unusually long distance view, which is allowing you to equally balance out ground and sky. This probably helps prevent white balance issues for you. For most people that have a more limited distance view however, it's difficult to equal out ground and sky coverage (because when doing so, the "close" horizon prevents them from getting enough distant sky in view to determine weather conditions)

Thanks for the suggestion. What particular model from Hikvision would you recommend?
As far as color reproduction and cloud/sky watching, the best I've found in my experience is the original 3mp DS-2CD2032-I (or the newer version of it supporting H.265 encoding, which is DS-2CD2035-I )...A little noisy at night, but daytime performance from a weather cam aspect is unmatched, in my opinion....There are newer versions of 3mp cams from Hikvision with ultra low light sensitivity that may actually work better, but I've yet to see them tested as a weathercam to ensure they handle the sky color properly. It seems they probably would, though.

You've got a fairly decent long distance view, so you may still be able to get enough ground and sky into the scene to use a Dahua without having white balance issues, although you'd definitely still benefit by having the extra vertical field of view from the Hikvision 3mp.

As others have mentions, your scene could also be an interesting one for a PTZ. Especially for zooming in on distant storm clouds and such. The Huisun mini-PTZ discussed on this board would ordinarily be a great match for this scene from a visual perspective (as it uses the same processor brand that Hikvision uses with the better color reproduction), however I can't really recommend them due to the high number of failure rates. The speed domes with wiper (sold under the name "Yunch") may be a good choice. They seem to be pretty solid, use the better image processor and the added wiper definitely has value for keeping the lens clear during stormy weather. So many times I've missed good views of the back side of storms because of water drops being splotched all over the lens.

Regardless of what you use, fixed or PTZ, I would recommend having some small cover over the camera to block most of the rain and hail from hitting it. Some put them under an overhang on their house. I have mine out in the middle of the yard on a post with a small piece of plywood on top of the post to shield the cam somewhat. Still gets some blowing rain on the lens, but not nearly as much as if it had no protection at all...That helps a lot for me since mine doesn't have a wiper....That would also allow some hail protection. I would imagine most of these cams would survive even golfball size hail without any protection, but if you're in one of those places that deals with the extreme stuff (baseball or softball size hail), then I'd say a cover is a must for any camera, unless it's specifically rated as "vandal proof" (which is typically only found in your very expensive grade cams).
 

Skipper-93

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Do you have WDR on? If not, you should be able to crank that up and help flatten out the brightness extremes between clouds and ground. The bigger issue I've had with Dahua is when too much sky gets in the picture, the white balance goes crazy. All the blue from the sky tricks the processor into thinking there's strong florescent lighting in the scene and it cranks up the red channel to compensate...The end result is the sky turns purple and the grass turns redish/brown...

The Hikvisions will compensate some for this, but not nearly as extreme as the Dahua does, in my experience. Especially the 3mp Hikvisions where the increased vertical field of view allows you to keep lots of ground and sky both in the scene...With yours being mounted on a tall tower, you've got an unusually long distance view, which is allowing you to equally balance out ground and sky. This probably helps prevent white balance issues for you. For most people that have a more limited distance view however, it's difficult to equal out ground and sky coverage (because when doing so, the "close" horizon prevents them from getting enough distant sky in view to determine weather conditions)
At the moment WDR is off. I have tried it, but that time it overcompensated.
I might have to try lower WDR levels.
 

wxman

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At the moment WDR is off. I have tried it, but that time it overcompensated.
I might have to try lower WDR levels.
The Dahua PTZ works best for me with WDR in the 10% to 30% range...Makes a huge improvement in the exposure. Anything more than that and it washes out the image and look unnatural; less than that and the ground is too dark and/or sky too bright.
 

wxman

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I can't say I have those problems @wxman with my SD59225U-HNI Starlight

I don't use it mainly for that purpose, but when I do I'm happy with it.
Hmm, yeah I guess I could probably get by with that shot, although I do see some white balance issues. Not as extreme as some of my examples, but that's likely because of those trees covering a good part of the right side of the screen. Gives it a lot of natural greens to help adjust by. You've definitely got blue in the sky, but the clouds on the left are a bit red/brownish rather than vibrant white with interior gray like cumulus clouds actually are, so it looks like the issue is "just starting"...I bet if you try zooming in a good bit on the sky (removing most of the trees/houses) the blue sky will start turning purple and the trees turning more fall colors.

Here's a current combined image from mine (left side is Hikvision bullet, right side is Dahua PTZ)...Notice how the Hik has a more natural light color (deep blue sky, white/gray clouds, bright green leaves) where the Dahua has an extremely "warm" color temperature look (clouds red, sky purple and trees look like they haven't been watered in 2 months)....I can go to manual white balance on the Dahua and make an exact match of the Hik when I use Red and Blue values approx 30 (give or take a few depending on time of day and conditions), but I have to keep adjusting the values throughout the day where the Hikvision automatically adjusts and keeps it's same color balance.

Hik_Dah.JPG
 

TVT73

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Hey guys, i also use the hdw5231r-z as weather Cam. But I adjust it for all time color Mode. I only needed to raise saturation and use manual shutter with 333ms.
I never had a color Problem, only the color saturation is at blc manual mode too low.

You can have a look at my project here.
 

wcleme11

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Leaning towards going with one of the Dahua starlight PTZ's for this. Even though the color accuracy might be slightly off its going to look much better during low light hours. The Hikvision DS-2DF8223I-AEL DarkFighter would be nice but at nearly twice the cost as the Dahua SD59225U-HNI its hard to justify. I don't think I can resist putting a PTZ up there even though its going to cost me more.
 

EMPIRETECANDY

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Leaning towards going with one of the Dahua starlight PTZ's for this. Even though the color accuracy might be slightly off its going to look much better during low light hours. The Hikvision DS-2DF8223I-AEL DarkFighter would be nice but at nearly twice the cost as the Dahua SD59225U-HNI its hard to justify. I don't think I can resist putting a PTZ up there even though its going to cost me more.
SD59430U-HNI
SD59225U-HNI
SD49225T-HN
All ok.
 

wcleme11

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Get the SD59230U-HNI. :)
Zoom on that would be awesome for OPs location.
I might just do that. I have to make another cable run into my attic first. Spray in fiberglass insulation up there so it's no fun. That's actually the easy part. Hard part is convincing the wife I need another camera :)
 

wxman

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Leaning towards going with one of the Dahua starlight PTZ's for this. Even though the color accuracy might be slightly off its going to look much better during low light hours. The Hikvision DS-2DF8223I-AEL DarkFighter would be nice but at nearly twice the cost as the Dahua SD59225U-HNI its hard to justify. I don't think I can resist putting a PTZ up there even though its going to cost me more.
True, if you're sold on getting a PTZ and low light is of more concern that color accuracy, then the Dahua will probably be a better choice since there's no "budget low light PTZ" available yet from Hikvision. Also, as long as you keep enough of the ground in view, that will minimize the color issues a great deal. Like I mentioned before, looks like your horizon is a pretty good distance away, so you should be able to get a lot of ground and sky into the same scene.

The other drawback to consider is the auto focus issues in low light which may require you to manually adjust focus with each pan/tilt/zoom change at night, depending on how much ambient light is available. Though again, probably not much of a deal breaker since I imagine you wouldn't be using auto tracking and thus would be at the interface to adjust the focus manually when moving the cam.

On the Dahua line, the only real benefit to 59225U over the cheaper SD49225U is the auto tracking and image stabilization. If you're not pole mounting to where the image will be shaky and have no need for auto tracking, then the 49225U would save you good bit. May be worth going with the 30x in your case as you would probably be able to put the added zoom to better use. Also of note, the 30X not only increases your ability to "zoom in" closer, it also increases the "zoom out" range as well (ie. a larger field of view when zoomed completely out allowing more scene into the picture than the 25X cams can do when zoomed out all the way). This may be useful as well for better scenic shots and for making it easier to get more ground into the picture to minimize color issues.

If there's any other questions or anything I can help with, just let me know. Whatever you decide, I'll be anxious to see examples of how it's working and the pros/cons you note with the solution that you go with. Weather monitoring is much more complicated on a cam because of a number of factors and the more we learn about the good and bad a particular cam performs in different scene types, the easier it is to make recommendations to others in the future.
 
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