Worlds First Review - Dahua DH-IPC-HDW5849H-ASE-LED / IPC-Color4K-T - 2.8mm Turret

[wittaj]

I agree ^^^^^^
Using IE hasn't really changed anything with regards to problems for me either.
Day/night change didn't work again last night.
It still reverts condition setting and exposure to defaults when applying IVS rules.

My 5442-Z4E did that when I first set it up. I got all the parameters dialed in and then I added an IVS rule and the parameters all went to default.

I now set up the IVS rule first and then dial it in for exposure, etc.. Even when I changed IVS rules later, as long as there was one in there they would stick.

I just tested it with my 4K-T and the exposure and other settings held by applying IVS rules after I already had one set up.

 

[sebastiantombs]

It's always been my habit to do IVS last so I have the best video available when I add it and can see, better, what I'm doing. This is the only camera I've ever had that saving the first IVS rule resets other settings.

 

[looney2ns]

My 5442-Z4E did that when I first set it up. I got all the parameters dialed in and then I added an IVS rule and the parameters all went to default.

I now set up the IVS rule first and then dial it in for exposure, etc.. Even when I changed IVS rules later, as long as there was one in there they would stick.

I just tested it with my 4K-T and the exposure and other settings held by applying IVS rules after I already had one set up.

But it shouldn't be that way.

FYI: Setting up DST with time set for 12hr, still does not work correctly.
You have to set it with 24hr selected then toggle back to 12hr.

 

[wittaj]

But it shouldn't be that way.

FYI: Setting up DST with time set for 12hr, still does not work correctly.
You have to set it with 24hr selected then toggle back to 12hr.

My DST still doesn't work correctly even trying that 24 hour trick.

 

[looney2ns]

I just tried @Wildcat1 live profile change test like in his video.. No joy for me.

 

[IAmWatchingYou!]

Yes 2.8 should be fine. There is a focus distance difference between the 4K-T and say a 5442 at same focal length but it’s a matter of a couple of feet. Therefore depending on height, location, distance to target etc then this should work for you.

The key is in matching the cam to location and desired end capture targets then dialing in the camera as I’ve shown many times. I’m going to review the JPG you sent, please attach from camera outputs directly, not screenshots so we can get the best look at quality you are seeing

& @EMPIRETECANDY

Here was a capture directly from the camera that I posted earlier:

https://ipcamtalk.com/attachments/20221019_122501-png.143174/

I can't get a reasonably in-focus image for anything closer than about 10'. I'm not really sure how the "close focus distance" that you mentioned is calculated, but if the review on page 1 of this thread, you say 18-20ft. If this really means that a subject needs to be 18-20 feet from the camera to be reasonable in-focus, that would be a deal break for this camera in any situation besides an overview camera that sits far away from any passing subject. I don't see anyone else here that's posted images from this using it as a security / ID camera near an entrance or vestibule, so maybe that's why I'm the first to really be hit by this issue.

The "clear focus distance" for the 5442 looks a ton better (4.27ft w/ 2.8mm), but I'd lose the large sensor of the 4kX. If I go down to 1/1.8 but with 4MP, I'm wondering what the difference would be in low light? Attached is a camera screenshot from last night under complete darkness besides some minimal lighting from the neighbors. The Reolink was almost a black image when in color mode.

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

www.dahuasecurity.com

or

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

www.dahuasecurity.com

Since the 4KX isn't usable, I'm going to do some more searching here, but I'd love to see images from the 5442 used as an entry camera before swapping these out. Wishing I had a Hikvision here to compare as well.

 

[samplenhold]

If this really means that a subject needs to be 18-20 feet from the camera to be reasonable in-focus, that would be a deal break for this camera in any situation besides an overview camera that sits far away from any passing subject.

Yes, a 2.8mm IS a wide-angle, overview cam. But being an 8MP cam, you can get some decent face shots (enough pixels on the face) at 18-20 feet. If you are trying to get a face ID of someone messing with your car in your driveway, and they are 20-30 feet away, then you really need something like a 6mm focal length.

 

[CCTVCam]

Wow I really opened a can of worms there....

I still think the camera is sub par compared to the 4KX. For sure Andy, you have some lovely pics of the street below. However, not many people are mounting these 4 or 5 stories up!. I really really want to love this camera as it would probably be my go to and the 4Kx like a lot of people, doesn't meet my needs for form factor. Turrets are ok but when in reach far too easy to move out of the way. As an overview mounted high, maybe the form factors ok but as a main camera at 6.5-7 feet, it's far too easy to walk up and twist the mount.

The issue I see is the performance of the 4Kt still doesn't match the 4KX. It's often blurry, the DOF is very shallow, the image is often very contrasty, which wouldn't be bad necessarily if it had the dynamic range to cope, but it appears often dark areas are too dark and lose detail.

Sorry to be at all critical. This isn't aimed at you but at Dahua. They promised us a turet 4kx but what we got was a new 4K that seemingly doesn't deliver the same performance as the X. It's a real shame they don't just use the same components. I so want to buy these but atm, as I have a little money coming and hopefully might be able to get a couple. However, I don't feel the performance of the T version is up to scratch. Poor focus and a shallow dof means it's going to be very difficult to get the quality of shot and is going to making the mounting to main point of protection very critical. I still think Dahua need to look at a redesign but am happy to be convinced otherwise.

 

[Wildcat_1]

& @EMPIRETECANDY

Here was a capture directly from the camera that I posted earlier:

https://ipcamtalk.com/attachments/20221019_122501-png.143174/

I can't get a reasonably in-focus image for anything closer than about 10'. I'm not really sure how the "close focus distance" that you mentioned is calculated, but if the review on page 1 of this thread, you say 18-20ft. If this really means that a subject needs to be 18-20 feet from the camera to be reasonable in-focus, that would be a deal break for this camera in any situation besides an overview camera that sits far away from any passing subject. I don't see anyone else here that's posted images from this using it as a security / ID camera near an entrance or vestibule, so maybe that's why I'm the first to really be hit by this issue.

The "clear focus distance" for the 5442 looks a ton better (4.27ft w/ 2.8mm), but I'd lose the large sensor of the 4kX. If I go down to 1/1.8 but with 4MP, I'm wondering what the difference would be in low light? Attached is a camera screenshot from last night under complete darkness besides some minimal lighting from the neighbors. The Reolink was almost a black image when in color mode.

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

www.dahuasecurity.com

or

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

www.dahuasecurity.com

Since the 4KX isn't usable, I'm going to do some more searching here, but I'd love to see images from the 5442 used as an entry camera before swapping these out. Wishing I had a Hikvision here to compare as well.

First let me clear up the Close Focus Distance (CFD) piece. The original, pre-production unit had a CFD closer to approx 18ft to 20ft however as I've mentioned many times and in the video, since receiving the production units that CFD has been adjusted closer to approx 16ft for 3.6mm and 8ft for the 2.8mm. The 2.8mm was adjusted closer for production due to the feedback and recommendations I made to Dahua engineering that a) 18ft CFD on a 2.8mm is WAY too far and b) that I wanted it adjusted as close as possible to 6ft (knowing it would never hit anything under that). Dahua engineering re-worked the units and were able to sufficiently get to 8ft CFD on 2.8mm which as I've mentioned, absolutely is not approx 5ft of the 5442 BUT still acceptable for a 2.8mm and WAY WAY better than 18+ft for this focal length. Now onto the 'what should you expect focus wise' piece for CFD, similar to what you said, Yes, at a high level anything closer than 8ft would be expected to be out of focus. However with installation height, angle and distance to target all being factors, this can improve the ability for the camera to work closer due to distance to target being taken up by those variables I just mentioned. However in a straight line head on to target your CFD would be expected be the 8Ft for the 2.8mm Turret & 16ft for the 3.6mm turret. Hope that helps. Also in looking at the quality of the image you provided, the camera does need dialing in for sure. For reference here what are the distance markers to the box and then the fence ?

HTH

 

[looney2ns]

& @EMPIRETECANDY

Here was a capture directly from the camera that I posted earlier:

https://ipcamtalk.com/attachments/20221019_122501-png.143174/

I can't get a reasonably in-focus image for anything closer than about 10'. I'm not really sure how the "close focus distance" that you mentioned is calculated, but if the review on page 1 of this thread, you say 18-20ft. If this really means that a subject needs to be 18-20 feet from the camera to be reasonable in-focus, that would be a deal break for this camera in any situation besides an overview camera that sits far away from any passing subject. I don't see anyone else here that's posted images from this using it as a security / ID camera near an entrance or vestibule, so maybe that's why I'm the first to really be hit by this issue.

The "clear focus distance" for the 5442 looks a ton better (4.27ft w/ 2.8mm), but I'd lose the large sensor of the 4kX. If I go down to 1/1.8 but with 4MP, I'm wondering what the difference would be in low light? Attached is a camera screenshot from last night under complete darkness besides some minimal lighting from the neighbors. The Reolink was almost a black image when in color mode.

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

www.dahuasecurity.com

or

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

www.dahuasecurity.com

Since the 4KX isn't usable, I'm going to do some more searching here, but I'd love to see images from the 5442 used as an entry camera before swapping these out. Wishing I had a Hikvision here to compare as well.

5442 3.6mm fixed lens, mounted 6.5ft from the floor.

 

[Wildcat_1]

I just tried @Wildcat1 live profile change test like in his video.. No joy for me.

Thanks for the update from your system @looney2ns. What you're experiencing certainly is strange.

Quick update and thoughts from me. With a limited number of people seeing issues vs larger shipping quantity of the product plus inability to be able to replicate across multiple units, this seems (and I do mean seems, cannot stress that enough as there aren't enough data points of the issue at this time) to be pointing more to difference(s) in the environment / system(s) being used to configure and upgrade the cam IMO. As I said to @sebastiantombs I've tried a total of 5 browsers (some of those browsers of course featured in the video yesterday) across different systems (now tested on 2 different Mac's running different OS's + 2 Windows machines - 1 virtualized, 1 regular standalone) on 3x cams and multiple default and configuration setup scenarios (IVS first, settings later, IVS last, settings first, different AI options no standard IVS etc etc.) up and down the FW chain and I'm not seeing any of the issues (other than those I mentioned yesterday, already filed and with the exception of Microsoft Edge that I never recommend be used). This is across over a month of testing the cams and a week in testing them against specific scenarios. Therefore, this could point to something within the OS (Windows etc itself) and associated version, browser version, browser security/privacy config (block vs allow on page/script denial/html content blockers etc which could suggest why play back of recorded footage isn't working in a browser in @looney2ns case) or even interdependencies of other OS level, browser centric plugins (already installed for other cams on people's systems) as the issue. Just throwing out relevant ideas as like others, I don't have a system that shows these issues to dive in deeper unfortunately.

Due to the above, the only other suggestions I have at this time for those experiencing this would be the following;

1. Uninstall Web Rec fully in case there are underlying issues with other plugins on your system - DahuaWiki
2. Then delete the entire webrec directory (C:\Program Files\) if still in place after uninstall and reboot your system after that
3. Look to fully factory default the camera in IE (follow the steps already provided), roll back to 8/2x FW (If you have it), factory default there and then re-upgrade to 9/22 at that point (using IE again for this continuing test). This ensures we go back down a FW level before installing new rather than just installing the same FW over the top
4. Go back into your browser and access the camera, if prompted for plugin(s), download it BUT do NOT install the plugin(s) without first closing, exiting, force quitting the browser so its not in system memory or consuming resources along with holding any other plugins open at the time you install the plugin (downloaded from first accessing the cam through the browser)
5. Separately, if you have access to the same versions of OS and browser that I showed and noted, test those as well.

As I mentioned, not enough data points to categorically state root cause for the few that have seen the issue but I don't believe its HW related at this time.

HTH and will continue putting the cams through their paces and see if I can find anything further

 

[Wildcat_1]

Also, quick update on the Night Video Revisit, just wanted to let people know that I'm still working it just wanted to make sure I took time to do the separate testing yesterday that I uploaded here. I will update all of you as soon as the Night Video is ready and uploaded. Thanks

 

[IAmWatchingYou!]

Wow that looks great! Thanks for sharing that pic @looney2ns from the 5442. That's definitely usable in an entryway and doesn't have the close focus issue of the 4KX. I'm wondering how that would look at at night with the front lights on without IR in both color and b/w?

Is that this camera in the link below? I see they have the Loryta brand name attached to it, so I'm wondering if it will still take Dahua firmware? I'll have to read up on the threads here to see if there's any issues I might face. I need IVS rules for push notifications and SD recording in the closest region for human detection, and another IVS rule just for SD recording out in the street on vehicle and human detection. The view would be similar to your setup, except only about 20 feet to the street.

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

www.dahuasecurity.com

Amazon.com : Loryta IPC-T5442TM-AS 2.8mm Fixed Lens 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Eyeball AI Network Camera English Version : Camera & Photo

Amazon.com : Loryta IPC-T5442TM-AS 2.8mm Fixed Lens 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Eyeball AI Network Camera English Version : Camera & Photo

www.amazon.com

I'm wondering is there any reason not to go with the Verifocal version for a few dollars more, at least for camera #1 so I can figure out what I'm going to need where - 2.8 or 3.6? The two cameras are very close in spec. The Verifocal has .001/.0001 lux less min illumination. The Verifocal has slightly better close focus, but less range on the IR. (I'd prefer not to use IR if possible and rely on outdoor lighting).

Varifocal WizMind

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

www.dahuasecurity.com

https://www.amazon.com/EmpireTech-IPC-T5442T-ZE-Vari-Focal-Eyeball-Starlight/dp/B08C77TNY9/

 

[sebastiantombs]

I can tell you that a varifocal is great for testing for focal length. I can also say there is a significant difference between the varifocal and a fixed lens from my experience with the 5442. The multi elements of lens needed to provide varifocal make a significant difference in low light capability. The varifocal still has good low light capability but if you want the best low light capability a fixed lens is the only way to go. All too often the specs from manufacturers are, shall we say, a little on the optimistic side. Don't take them as being totally accurate.

 

[Wildcat_1]

Wow that looks great! Thanks for sharing that pic @looney2ns from the 5442. That's definitely usable in an entryway and doesn't have the close focus issue of the 4KX. I'm wondering how that would look at at night with the front lights on without IR in both color and b/w?

Is that this camera in the link below? I see they have the Loryta brand name attached to it, so I'm wondering if it will still take Dahua firmware? I'll have to read up on the threads here to see if there's any issues I might face. I need IVS rules for push notifications and SD recording in the closest region for human detection, and another IVS rule just for SD recording out in the street on vehicle and human detection. The view would be similar to your setup, except only about 20 feet to the street.

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

IPC-HDW5442TM-ASE

www.dahuasecurity.com

Amazon.com : Loryta IPC-T5442TM-AS 2.8mm Fixed Lens 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Eyeball AI Network Camera English Version : Camera & Photo

Amazon.com : Loryta IPC-T5442TM-AS 2.8mm Fixed Lens 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Eyeball AI Network Camera English Version : Camera & Photo

www.amazon.com

I'm wondering is there any reason not to go with the Verifocal version for a few dollars more, at least for camera #1 so I can figure out what I'm going to need where - 2.8 or 3.6? The two cameras are very close in spec. The Verifocal has .001/.0001 lux less min illumination. The Verifocal has slightly better close focus, but less range on the IR. (I'd prefer not to use IR if possible and rely on outdoor lighting).

Varifocal WizMind

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

IPC-HDW5442T-ZE

www.dahuasecurity.com

https://www.amazon.com/EmpireTech-IPC-T5442T-ZE-Vari-Focal-Eyeball-Starlight/dp/B08C77TNY9/

@IAmWatchingYou!
Don't want to steer this 4K-T thread of course so please use the 5442 threads we have on the forum for continuing that conversation but quickly, if you want to see how the 5442T-ZE (varifocal 5442) handles with NO IR and 1x external bulb on, + B&W mode, take a look at the video I published when I was reviewing the Dahua Doorbell. Video link is below but again for 5442 please either look at the existing threads there OR start a new one so we don't confuse the 4K-T cameras being discussed here. Thanks

​

 

[wittaj]

Is that this camera in the link below? I see they have the Loryta brand name attached to it, so I'm wondering if it will still take Dahua firmware? I'll have to read up on the threads here to see if there's any issues I might face. I need IVS rules for push notifications and SD recording in the closest region for human detection, and another IVS rule just for SD recording out in the street on vehicle and human detection. The view would be similar to your setup, except only about 20 feet to the street.

As I mentioned, EmpireTech and Loryta and Andy's cams and are true Dahua OEM and you can flash it with Dahua firmware if you want, but then you would lose Smart IR, so you would want to stay with the firmware that we have worked on here to provide that. The firmware Andy provides his customers is newer and better than what you can find on the Dahua website...

 

[IAmWatchingYou!]

That's great regarding the firmware - good to know! So trying to keep this thread relative to the 4KX, the competing model to this 4KT from Hikvision is the DS-2CD2387G2 turret. It looks like @EMPIRETECANDY used to sell these. So, I'm wondering what happened that he switched to the Dahua 4KX. @EMPIRETECANDY if you still have a 2387G2 around, I would be helpful to see the 4KX close focus vs the DS-2CD2387G2 close focus. Some input on the AI of the 4KX vs DS-2CD2387G2 would be great too. @triumph202 in a another thread said the Hik human and vehicle detection is "Amazing". I see some other threads where people were complaining about the human / vehicle detection in the 5442 series.

 

[wittaj]

That's great regarding the firmware - good to know! So trying to keep this thread relative to the 4KX, the competing model to this 4KT from Hikvision is the DS-2CD2387G2 turret. It looks like @EMPIRETECANDY used to sell these. So, I'm wondering what happened that he switched to the Dahua 4KX. @EMPIRETECANDY if you still have a 2387G2 around, I would be helpful to see the 4KX close focus vs the DS-2CD2387G2 close focus. Some input on the AI of the 4KX vs DS-2CD2387G2 would be great too. @triumph202 in a another thread said the Hik human and vehicle detection is "Amazing". I see some other threads where people were complaining about the human / vehicle detection in the 5442 series.

Here was a comparison with the 4K bullet version versus the Hik

Worlds First Review - Dahua - IPC-Color4K-X / DH-IPC-HFW5849T1-ASE-LED - Full Color 4K Camera

Thanks for guys' support, we will bring more new cams here for fun. :D Andy, I am also in the market for a 4K varifocal with the 1/1.2" sensor. Let us know if Dahua is working on such an animal. ;)

ipcamtalk.com

 

[Wildcat_1]

Here was a comparison with the 4K bullet version versus the Hik

Worlds First Review - Dahua - IPC-Color4K-X / DH-IPC-HFW5849T1-ASE-LED - Full Color 4K Camera

Thanks for guys' support, we will bring more new cams here for fun. :D Andy, I am also in the market for a 4K varifocal with the 1/1.2" sensor. Let us know if Dahua is working on such an animal. ;)

ipcamtalk.com

Beat me to posting it @wittaj

 

[EMPIRETECANDY]

Today's sales we sold 49pcs 4KT, thanks for guys support! The cameras we sold are industrial levels, sure they are not as convenient as the consumer cameras. But after some further settings, will give you gthe best pics, sure need some skills and time to adjust the settings. Here has lots of talking of the settings, so can spent sometime to watch and trying on your cams.

For the issues talked here, i will make some collection, can add to the later fw if we can do.