How much of a difference do you really get over a recent 1/2.9" sensor camera, a 1/1.8", a 1/1.2" camera or maybe even 1/1" (not seen one, yet)? I have some 7 year old Hivision cams that got good ratings at that time. I replaced more than half of them with cams from Andy at at about twice the cost (5241 for license plate, 5442 for others). It made a huge difference. But I am not sure how much can be attributed to sensor size and to just general improvements. In particular, I am looking at replacing backdoor cams and more urgently adding an indoor cam. Indoor for the worst lightning is like Indoor.png. This is from a cheapy indoor amcrest cam. The back is like back.png. Bright light from the backdoor light. We have other motion sensor lights that come on illuminating the back part when there is motion.
1/2.9" vs 1/1.8" vs 1/1.2" Camera
- Thread starter rfj
- Start date
A BIG difference over time as technology has improved sensor performance.
Look at these two threads showing the improvements of the 5442 series from when it first came out to now. Even though they are both the same sensor size, the improvements are night and day different and the newest sensors let in way more light.
ipcamtalk.com
ipcamtalk.com
Look at these two threads showing the improvements of the 5442 series from when it first came out to now. Even though they are both the same sensor size, the improvements are night and day different and the newest sensors let in way more light.
Mini-Review - 5442-ZE-S3 AKA T54IR-ZE-S3 - Replacement to 5442-ZE
As many of us are aware, Dahua decided to keep the same model numbers of some of their most popular models like the 5442-Z12E and the 5442 series cameras, but they have been updated with a newer GUI and specs that on paper show better than the previous version as was discussed in this thread...
Mini-Review - 5442-Z4E-S3 AKA B54IR-Z4E S3 - Replacement to the 5442-Z4E
As many of us are aware, Dahua decided to keep the same model numbers of some of their most popular models like the 5442-Z12E and the 5442 series cameras, but they have been updated with a newer GUI and specs that on paper show better than the previous version as was discussed in this thread...
mat200
IPCT Contributor
- Jan 17, 2017
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Hi @rfj
semi-conductors still have rapid advancements .. so yes, the newer chips do make a difference as does the firmware written for them .. as well as the larger sensor chips.
The issue appears to be the oems and vendors are able to sell "more MP for cheaper" to many consumers as the buyers do not know how to evaluate security cameras on more nuanced technical specs .. while we try to share what we have learned in this regards, the typical consumer still want more MP for cheaper .. sigh.
So, in my book .. if you need low light performance .. start at 4MP 1/1.8" sensors or 8MP 1/1.2" sensor camera models .. if you have a lot of light, then it is less of an issue. ( again general rule of thumb here and works well for most of us )
And even with the advancements, it still isn't enough to deviate from this ideal MP/sensor size ratio:
CanCuba
Known around here
As already pointed out, the difference is night and day between 1/2.9" and a 1/1.8" or 1/1.2" sensors.
I'm swapping out Dahua 2431 variants with a 1/3" sensor to Dahua 5449 1/1.8" sensors. Not only is the night image much, much better but the technology is much, much better on the newer/more expensive cams.
Face detection, better detection of humans and vehicles, etc, etc
I'm swapping out Dahua 2431 variants with a 1/3" sensor to Dahua 5449 1/1.8" sensors. Not only is the night image much, much better but the technology is much, much better on the newer/more expensive cams.
Face detection, better detection of humans and vehicles, etc, etc
Thanks. I don't care about face detection, detection of vehicles (hopefully no one drives it into our house), etc. So is this what you are buying (of maybe the bullet version of it). Looks like it has visible lights which is not what I want for an indoor cam (when someone is walking out from one room to another room and lights are coming on).
You would want the 5442 series that has infrared.
CanCuba has enough light to be seen from the Space Station LOL.
CanCuba has enough light to be seen from the Space Station LOL.
So everyone is mentioning Dehua, especially the 5442. Are there any others from Hikvision, Amcrest, Foscam, etc. that perform similarly, so probably have a big sensor, some decent chip and firmware, IR light, etc?
Amcrest is made by Dahua, but most models are made with cheaper sensors and lessor quality materials (plastic versus metal) to keep costs down.
Hikvision has cameras that are 4MP on the 1/1.8" sensor, but most prefer the 5442 performance along with the GUI. I have both and prefer the 5442.
Foscam...forget about it LOL.
You could try Axis, but be prepared to open up your wallet.
Most find the 5442 to be the overall best camera in terms of quality, price, and performance day and night.
Hikvision has cameras that are 4MP on the 1/1.8" sensor, but most prefer the 5442 performance along with the GUI. I have both and prefer the 5442.
Foscam...forget about it LOL.
You could try Axis, but be prepared to open up your wallet.
Most find the 5442 to be the overall best camera in terms of quality, price, and performance day and night.
Which one of the HiVision and Amcrest dome cameras are the most similar to the 5442? This is for indoor usage and because of that, I don't want any dome cam that has visual illumination but just IR lights. 4MP seems plenty enough for my purpose. I just want to see our dog and anything else that might be going on inside the house.
Inside the house and for dog watching isn't as critical. Indoors you get to take advantage of the IR bounce off the walls so you can get by with a lessor sensor if that is where you want to save some costs.
Obviously a camera on the ideal MP/sensor ratio will be better, but a cheaper one will work for that use case.
Obviously a camera on the ideal MP/sensor ratio will be better, but a cheaper one will work for that use case.
So what would be a good alternative from HikVision/Amcrest/etc. compared to the 5442 for those kind of applications? I am not looking for a definitive change but some cams that I should consider for this application.
mat200
IPCT Contributor
- Jan 17, 2017
- 16,078
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Hi @rfj
Any particular reason for Hikvision and / Amcrest brands ?
Amcrest has Dahua OEM cameras .. you can look to see what cameras they currently have available and compare the specs with the Dahua OEM camera models.
Start with looking at the sensor size .. typically not seeing a lot of larger sensor model cameras available from Amcrest.
Hikvision .. same, start with checking the sensor size .. this is perhaps a good first round way to filter cameras models right now.
Annke typically has Hikvision OEM cameras, so if you can get those you can look to see what they have available.
The main reason for inquiring about Hikvision and Amcrest is because they have a high reputation on this forum and integrate well with BlueIris. I was hoping that maybe for indoor usage they have some more cost effective alternatives to the dome 5442. I did ask Amcrest for a cam with 1/1.8" or larger sensor (and IR for 30', dome/turret, PoE) and they responded with Amcrest 4K Outdoor Security IP Turret PoE Camera IP67 IP8M-T2599EW I told them I wanted a camera with a larger sensor and they sent me a link to a cam with a 1/2.8" sensor. I guess it's bigger than 1/2.7" 
Actually 1/2.8" is smaller than 1/2.7" LOL. But it wouldn't surprise me that they think otherwise LOL.
I don't think Amcrest sells anymore a 1/1.8" sensor camera. In recent years they (and maybe Dahua) have been trying not to have similar cams that people could buy the cheap Amcrest and flash Dahua firmware on it.
As I said, about anything will do indoors unless it is a large warehouse, so go with a sub $70 5MP LOL
I don't think Amcrest sells anymore a 1/1.8" sensor camera. In recent years they (and maybe Dahua) have been trying not to have similar cams that people could buy the cheap Amcrest and flash Dahua firmware on it.
As I said, about anything will do indoors unless it is a large warehouse, so go with a sub $70 5MP LOL
I used to have an Amcrest Turret T2599EW camera installed in the front yard corner until I replace it with a Color-4K-X from Andy few years ago. The 4K-X image is only slightly better than the Amcrest T2599EW during the day, but there is no match with the 1/1.2 sensor vs the 1/2.8 sensor at night in my case with just a street light across the street.
Yeah, I think they thought 1/2.7" is larger than 1/1.8" (as I asked for 1/1.8" or larger). And when I asked for larger than 1/2.7" they suggested 1/2.8" because the number 2.8 is larger than 2.7... Maybe I should ask them for smaller sensors... Anyways, below is a night shot of my temporarily mounted Hikvision DS-2CD2132F-IS 2.8mm. It's a 1/3" from 2015. The glass also seems dirty. But would a cheap cam like a work for this scenario (see where the dog is, motion detection of animals/humans, etc but no face recognition necessary).
Btw, I prefer dome over turret cams because the dome cams don't look quite as intrusive for indoor usage. Maybe I am wrong with this but that's my current thinking.
Btw, I prefer dome over turret cams because the dome cams don't look quite as intrusive for indoor usage. Maybe I am wrong with this but that's my current thinking.
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Mark_M
Known around here
This chart for the size to resolution (pixel density). Where does the special size per pixel come from?
8MP at 1/1.2" is about 25.6 µm^2 per pixel.
4MP at 1/1.8" is about 22.5 µm^2,
2MP at 1/2.8" is about 18.1 µm^2.
CCTVCam
Known around here
- Sep 25, 2017
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Probably the manufacturer. It's probably going to be the active sensor area divided by the total number of pixels including any space or boundaries in between each pixel.