looney2ns
IPCT Contributor
Yeah, IMOU app sucked from day one, really pitiful. DMSS still needs lots of work.
A New Doorbell
- Thread starter EMPIRETECANDY
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EMPIRETECANDY
IPCT Vendor
Like others I do along with two pairs of CAT-6 shielded vs not, 22-4 wire for 12 VDC.
CCTVCam
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Is that Dahua who are targetting that market or simply those companies coming to Dahua to try to source a better quality product than the competition or becasue they don't have R&D or manufacturing cnetres themsleves?? I would have thought Dahua would probably have an eye on both markets.How many people have POE going to the doorbell? Dahua also isn't building cameras to sell to us. They are building cameras to sell to lorex, amcrest, la view, RCA, etc. Those companies are trying to make in-roads into rings' market. We know this because both Amcrest and Lorex are selling this camera rebranded already from the looks of it. Lorex for sure. I am 99% sure the amcrest ad410 is this with a different face. Dahua does make POE doorbells if you want one and they are professional like you said.
When you think of all the businesses out there, how many would benefit from having a good quality doorbell camera? I would have thought a lot given most external door cameras are mounted high up and so aren't so great for capturing faces. Think of all the businesses, especially offices that have visitors who use a doorbell to gain access that would benefit from having a surveillance doorbell. There's got to be a market out there for a professional product. As for RIng etc. I think it's going to be very difficult for any company to penetrate that market now. Ring have an excellent consumer level product that does exactly what most consumers want - be smart and easy to install. Along with their competition who are following them, there's little room for a brand to push into a market that's already pretty saturated with brands that are big houshold names and synonymous with the video doorbell.
I am sure it's a bit of both. Companies coming to Dahua and dahua making those products to sell. That doesn't change that they are building these cameras for companies that are trying to break into rings market.
There is a market for business doorbells, they are access control systems and usually come along with things like badge access. See unifi's access control. The facts are no matter how many of you here have poe to your doorbell or how many people want it. It is still a niche market that will only ever see repurposed professional gear like access control systems or one-off products from smaller companies. This forum has a few thousand members and a few hundred that are active, compare that to ring that has sold several hundred thousand doorbells. The market just isn't there to support it. Those that do want it probably also don't mind the ascetics of an ip camera mounted at their door either. There isn't a market large enough to justify the tooling to offer a POE solution when the company can tool for wifi, doorbell powered/battery and access control and make more money on those products.
UniFi Door Access - Ubiquiti
A modern access control system with touchscreen readers, live video, and mobile app credential support. Manage your physical access like never before.
sebastiantombs
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I see the problem of the door access style being far more than is needed in many, many, commercial applications. Yeah, all the bells and whistles, card readers and such, can be handy in some cases, just being able to see and talk is what I think is the overwhelming case. The problem with the current crop is they are WiFi which just isn't very reliable for real surveillance systems. PoE would solve the whole thing at a minimal cost increase for the doorbell but would require a CAT, or two, to the door to work. Being most people are too lazy to run that cable, or don't want to pay a professional for the installation, or they are ignorant of the problems when using WiFi, my SIL is a prime example, the WiFi will still be king.
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CCTVCam
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I agree entirely Sebastian.
Not every business wants a big metal box plastered next to the door nor an intercom or complex entry system considering many can simply look at the CCTV and see who's there. Many office businesses simply have an ordinary doorbell next to the door. I worked for 3 large office companies in the past. Everyone had a consumer doorbell next to the door. Price is a big factor for many companies. So I see a big market for a Ring type doorbell with professional picture quality, relaibility and durability in the same sort of slick professional finish for a still reasonable price.
@Duh987:
As for the expense of POE tooling, I'm not sure I quite follow your thinking. Dahua already fit poe to all their cameras apart from their coaxial line, so what kind of extra tooling is needed for parts? They already have the ability to fit poe to their circuit board in house. What they don't have is wireless because their cameras don't use wireless, so arguably fitting wireless would cost far more both in tooling and parts than poe. A well worn point of wireless from this forum is it's lack of reliability as a means of connection.
One final point, most wireless doorbell cameras still require a wired power supply. POE is no more difficult to wire and supplies both power in and signal out in the one cable.
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flynreelow
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I do as well.How many people have POE going to the doorbell? Dahua also isn't building cameras to sell to us. They are building cameras to sell to lorex, amcrest, la view, RCA, etc. Those companies are trying to make in-roads into rings' market. We know this because both Amcrest and Lorex are selling this camera rebranded already from the looks of it. Lorex for sure. I am 99% sure the amcrest ad410 is this with a different face. Dahua does make POE doorbells if you want one and they are professional like you said.
and many houses are wired with cat5/6 to the doorbell for the regular old school doorbell wire, so it can always be converted to POE if necessary.
flynreelow
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not from Andy
If you are using Blue Iris, you can use this camera on BI and have BI do the MQTT duties. If you are using NVR...dunno's about that.
I use DMSS app on my Android. Well...rarely do I use it. Setup was a chore with firewall rules and such. But so far, DMSS works as it is suppose to. I get notified, see video and can do 2 way conversations when someone hits the buzzer. I also added in my Dahua SD4 series PTZ which I can also control with it AOK. I guess I have no complaints as I use it for simple purposes.
Newer construction is using ethernet for cabling to the doorbell. It's not to be converted in most cases its because it on hand and works. It doesn't go somewhere useful, it goes to the chime.
flynreelow
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and if you have access to the chime and can get the wire, you can extend this and then route it where-ever you want (yes, every house is different, and may bot be possible in yours)
DarkHelmet
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hopeful for this. been looking to ditch my ring to have something that plays nicer with BI and something i can actually customize. hope it has a decent API so i can control it outside the app. turning its light on, triggering the chime, and everything else.
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CCTVCam
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POE is power over ethernet....
If it goes to the chime the chime it's probably already using poe to the doorbell. It's not going to be hard if that is the case to swap out the doorbell for one as described above and redirect the ethernet to your router so long as the ethernet is of a reasonable standard for data transfer. That can be done by an extension if short or by cutting the cable adding a plug if it goes past or near the router location. It's not hard these days to make a doorbell with poe for power and with a wireless chime so far as I can see.
In the EU, almost all doorbells sold are wireless chime and have been for a couple of decades thanks to the extensive use of upvc doors. My current door pushes are battery powered (previously they were wired from a transformer) and I have 3 separate chime unit distributed around the house that are wirelessly connected to the doorpushes and either are battery powered or plug into the mains for power. That's pretty typical for a UK home .
They usually use their own wireless frequency 585mhz (from memory), although with the advent of wireless router connectivity I understand companies such as Ring have done away with the chime units in favour of a chime on your mobile phone by push messaging. No reason why a more advanced camera shouldn't take that route albeit for commercial use, the company probably will want a physical chime rather than sending it to the receptionists mobile. A more modern alternative to a physical chime for company use might be a chime app on the receptionists pc similar to the one Ring have on their mobile app so it rings on the pc rather than a phone.
I think I just redesigned the CCTV doorbell in the last paragraph for commercial use.
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user8963
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I have only seen these setups in selfmade setups from lazy people who prefer wifi
Battery-powered doorbells with RF-battery-powered chimes are a nogo.
Many companies (including hik/dahua) have 2-wire systems which uses a gateway to reach the lan. This is available for most bus systems. Sure you will never have great speed, but for a doorbell its enough.
What many do not know.. you need only 4 wires/2 pair for PoE and data. So a cheap twisted pair 4 wire telephone cable is enough for any doorbell-poe-lan application.
any camera have just 2 pairs (orange/green) connected inside. Only PTZ with higher power (poe+/+) need 4 pairs.
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ronoob
n3wb
I have the Dahua Vto2211g-wp () which has ethernet with poe and wifi and I know there are plugins to integrate it over HA but haven’t done it yet.
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CCTVCam
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Like I said the defacto chime type in the EU eg:I have only seen these setups in selfmade setups from lazy people who prefer wifi
Battery-powered doorbells with RF-battery-powered chimes are a nogo.
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Pretty much everything is rf wireless with little issue provided you get the lower fo the two availabel frequencies (the upper has less penetration of dense walls and most UK houses unlike the US are brick walls even internally). They even come with multiple channels, usually at least 8 so you can avoid being on your neighbours channel.
My only complaint is there's no warning of low battery power in the bell push which means it can go down without you knowing althouigh batteries usually last a year.
However, this isn't going to be an issue for a poe powered camera door push as the power will be supplied over poe.
when you are ready, this integration is what I am happily using.
Looking for feedback and testing of my Dahua Home Assistant integration (via HACS)
This is the initial release, you’ll have to manually add the repo to your HACS integration until it’s officially added (that’s pending a PR review) It doesn’t support PTZ yet becaise I don’t have a cam to test with. Seeking feedback on anything that’s broke and missing features/services you’d...