flynreelow
Known around here
- Dec 12, 2016
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def could prob dial that in a bit better from the pros (talk to them), but that looks damn good for a nighttime image
Dahua 4k color X
- Thread starter Cameraguy
- Start date
def could prob dial that in a bit better from the pros (talk to them), but that looks damn good for a nighttime image
Mike A.
Known around here
- May 6, 2017
- 4,164
- 6,972
That's not too bad. A little dialing in and could still be very good at faster shutter and less NR.
If you want any help dialing in just reach out, happy to help.
flynreelow
Known around here
- Dec 12, 2016
- 1,352
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talk to this Cat....
he is the pro, and would love to see your dialed in motion night captures
- Feb 15, 2017
- 1,502
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Sphinxicus
Getting comfortable
- Feb 15, 2017
- 1,502
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Looks like gain is too high.
In my opinion, shutter (exposure) and gain are the two most important and then base the others off of it. Shutter is more important than FPS. It is the shutter speed that prevents motion blur, not FPS. 15 FPS is more than enough for surveillance cameras as we are not producing Hollywood movies. Match iframes to FPS.
Many people do not realize there is manual shutter that lets you adjust shutter and gain and a shutter priority that only lets you adjust shutter speed but not gain. The higher the gain, the bigger the noise and see-through ghosting start to appear because the noise is amplified. Most people select shutter priority and run a faster shutter than they should because it is likely being done at 100 gain, so it is actually defeating their purpose of a faster shutter.
But first, run H264, smart codec off, CBR, and 8192 bitrate to start.
Go into shutter settings and change to manual shutter and start with custom shutter as ms and change to 0-8.3ms and gain 0-50 (night) and 0-30 (day)for starters. Auto could have a shutter speed of 100ms or more with a gain at 100 and shutter priority could result in gain up at 100 which will contribute to ghosting that we kinda saw here.
Now what you will notice immediately at night is that your image gets A LOT darker. That faster the shutter, the more light that is needed. But it is a balance. The nice bright night image results in Casper during motion LOL. What do we want, a nice static image or a clean image when there is motion introduced to the scene?
So if it is too dark, then start adding ms to the time. Go to 10ms, 12ms, etc. until you find what you feel is acceptable as an image. Then have someone walk around and see if you can get a clean shot. Try not to go above 16.67ms (but certainly not above 30ms) as that tends to be the point where blur starts to occur. Conversely, if it is still bright, then drop down in time to get a faster shutter.
You can also adjust brightness and contrast to improve the image.
You can also add some gain to brighten the image - but the higher the gain, the more ghosting you get. Some cameras can go to 70 or so before it is an issue and some can't go over 50.
But adjusting those two settings will have the biggest impact. The next one is noise reduction. Want to keep that as low as possible. Depending on the amount of light you have, you might be able to get down to 40 or so at night (again camera dependent) and 20-30 during the day, but take it as low as you can before it gets too noisy. Again this one is a balance as well. Too smooth and no noise can result in soft images and contribute to blur.
Do not use backlight features until you have exhausted every other parameter setting. And if you do have to use backlight, take it down as low as possible.
After every setting adjustment, have someone walk around outside and see if you can freeze-frame to get a clean image. If not, keep changing until you do. Clean motion pictures are what we are after, not a clean static image.
But this camera is so good that you should be able to run a higher shutter. I am shocked how much faster I can run this shutter compared to my other cameras - like double the speed.
In my opinion, shutter (exposure) and gain are the two most important and then base the others off of it. Shutter is more important than FPS. It is the shutter speed that prevents motion blur, not FPS. 15 FPS is more than enough for surveillance cameras as we are not producing Hollywood movies. Match iframes to FPS.
Many people do not realize there is manual shutter that lets you adjust shutter and gain and a shutter priority that only lets you adjust shutter speed but not gain. The higher the gain, the bigger the noise and see-through ghosting start to appear because the noise is amplified. Most people select shutter priority and run a faster shutter than they should because it is likely being done at 100 gain, so it is actually defeating their purpose of a faster shutter.
But first, run H264, smart codec off, CBR, and 8192 bitrate to start.
Go into shutter settings and change to manual shutter and start with custom shutter as ms and change to 0-8.3ms and gain 0-50 (night) and 0-30 (day)for starters. Auto could have a shutter speed of 100ms or more with a gain at 100 and shutter priority could result in gain up at 100 which will contribute to ghosting that we kinda saw here.
Now what you will notice immediately at night is that your image gets A LOT darker. That faster the shutter, the more light that is needed. But it is a balance. The nice bright night image results in Casper during motion LOL. What do we want, a nice static image or a clean image when there is motion introduced to the scene?
So if it is too dark, then start adding ms to the time. Go to 10ms, 12ms, etc. until you find what you feel is acceptable as an image. Then have someone walk around and see if you can get a clean shot. Try not to go above 16.67ms (but certainly not above 30ms) as that tends to be the point where blur starts to occur. Conversely, if it is still bright, then drop down in time to get a faster shutter.
You can also adjust brightness and contrast to improve the image.
You can also add some gain to brighten the image - but the higher the gain, the more ghosting you get. Some cameras can go to 70 or so before it is an issue and some can't go over 50.
But adjusting those two settings will have the biggest impact. The next one is noise reduction. Want to keep that as low as possible. Depending on the amount of light you have, you might be able to get down to 40 or so at night (again camera dependent) and 20-30 during the day, but take it as low as you can before it gets too noisy. Again this one is a balance as well. Too smooth and no noise can result in soft images and contribute to blur.
Do not use backlight features until you have exhausted every other parameter setting. And if you do have to use backlight, take it down as low as possible.
After every setting adjustment, have someone walk around outside and see if you can freeze-frame to get a clean image. If not, keep changing until you do. Clean motion pictures are what we are after, not a clean static image.
But this camera is so good that you should be able to run a higher shutter. I am shocked how much faster I can run this shutter compared to my other cameras - like double the speed.
I am using the 3.6 for a night sky cam in B/W. One can make out the Milky Way even in a not
so dark sky.
Andy's big cam has a 4/3 8MP sensor.
so dark sky.
Andy's big cam has a 4/3 8MP sensor.
yes, damn delay at Long Beach, this model we have to ship from HONGKONG directly for BF discount.I just checked Andy's Amazon store and I see this message on the side. " Fastest delivery: Jan 15 - 18 ". It's this true?
Why CBR, please? Will VBR do any odd artefacts during the night? Or is it for later playback compatibility with other players? Thanks!
I guess it's 1/10ms and 1/12ms, right?
Don’t use VBR as you will lose detail while the camera processes motion across a scene. While VBR algorithms have come on a long way the time it takes to adjust the bitrate up means you run the risk of ruining key areas of an image / cap. Therefore I personally only ever recommend people use CBR for those critical areas to ensure you get usable captures.
10ms would be 1/100 shutter and 12ms would be 1/83 shutter
Hi, what is the model part number? 5849 ase led?
Andy's modle number on Amazon is
IPC-Color4K-X
IPC-Color4K-X
Enjoy, and reach out if you need any help dialing in
I will definitely take you up on that offer if I have any troubles. I read and appreciate all of your reviews and pointers on the settings. I've learned TONS from coming to these forums, it blows my mind how much you and some of the others know about these things!
A few questions, as I'm working to dial in the same cameras.
1. what is iframes? I've seen the setting for FPS, but not iframes.
2. Why H264 over H265. Does the additional compression impact video quality in a way that is noticeable.