Having issues with crime, thinking about a camera solution, but total noob.

[dstep]

Hey guys, I have been reading and reading and reading. It seems like this is a topic in which there are so many products, so many opinions, and many conflicting thoughts that I thought I would just post to get your feedback.

The short story is that I am involved with the management of an apartment building (16 units, 500ft long by maybe 40 ft wide). We have had robberies, thefts, drug related crimes, car jackings... you name it. Needless to say, it's not in the best of neighborhoods.

That being said, I would like to show the tenants some sort of proactive action by installing a security camera system. Seeing as how I am not the expert, I went to a local shop that specialized in electronics that did another apartment building in the same area to receive a bid. I have seen this system in action (last week the news even used footage from it on live TV) and I am not impressed. This is what they recommended:

(2) IR, 700TVL, 2.8~12mm, D/N
(1) CCD, 600TVL 2.8~11mm
(1) CCD, 550TVL 6-50mm
as well as a recording device and all the cords and stuff to connect everything.
The cameras are made by Nuvico and it is all done with COAX and is not IP based.
Total quote came out to around ~2600, which fits the budget nicely.

I'm looking to cover the front and rear of the building, the parking lot, and the one drive entrance (to get license plate #s), and to focus on nighttime activities.

I just can't help but think that going IP based would allow me to get much higher quality video. Am I correct in this thinking, or should I go ahead with the system that has been quoted?

I have a background in IT and I am well qualified to do the installation. I just have zero experience working with any camera systems. Other important information might be that the building itself has 1gbit internet fiber uplinks.

Thanks,
Dave

 

[networkcameracritic]

So 4 cameras + DVR installed for $2,600, sounds cheap actually. The equipment probably doesn't add up to $600, but $2,000 for a proper install of 4 cameras is pretty good. Figure an IP system that is 1080P or 3MP, varifocal lenses may cost about a $1,500 with 4 cameras & NVR. So it depends if you want someone to do the install for you, you want to do it all yourself or you want an electrician to run the wires, mount the cameras but you'll do the configuration, aiming/focusing and such yourself.

 

[fenderman]

Dont get that system. It is old school and as you already can see the footage is horrible. If you can do the install yourself or as networkcamera says just have someone run the cable. The great thing about ip systems is that if you get one that supports POE (power over ethernet) you only need to run 1 cable to the camera that will transmit data and supply power. Make sure its quality ethernet cable that is solid copper not copper clad aluminum. Check out theses systems below.
http://www.costco.com/Swann-8-Channel-HD-3MP-NVR-Security-System-with-2TB-HDD-and-4-1080p-Cameras.product.100070789.html
http://www.costco.com/Swann-16-Channel-HD-3MP-NVR-Security-System-with-3TB-HDD,-6-1080p-Cameras-and-2-Vari-Focal-Cameras.product.100070310.html

 

[icerabbit]

I'd say get more bids. It can be quite time consuming to install stuff properly, but you should avoid analog like the plague and go two (or 3) megapixel ip based instead. It is like watching vhs or hi8 ten years ago vs high def now.

As fenderman said, if you are handy or have a maintenance guy / handyman with some electrical experience, you can run the conduit (assuming exterior surface mount) yourself or have it done. With just a single network cable per camera it could not be any simpler. Or you can even get exterior ethernet cable, provided you can run it where it isn't easily cut or damaged. It is pretty straightforward.

 

[dstep]

Thanks guys,

I am going to further investigate IP solutions. The bid did include installation, at a cost of 700, but I would rather do it myself (and I am perfectly qualified to do so)

Networkcameracritic, I found your blog and it has been quite insightful.

Going to start to try to build a list of good cameras for nighttime to have a few options. The area is lit pretty well, but... I know cameras have difficulty.

Furthermore, the choice of software seems to also be a big choice, but is sometimes dependent on the cameras I choose (looks like some camera manufacturers have their own software?)

I am hesitant to buy a package system, I'd rather have my own computer doing the recording anyways.

Feel free to shoot my any other suggestions or thoughts you may have!

 

[fenderman]

700 for the install is cheap so they must of jacked the prices of the equipment to compensate.
Just so you know those swann systems are rebranded hikvisions cameras and NVR's.
You can always use pc software in conjunction with a cheap 100 dollar NVR as backup or get cameras with SD card slot build in so you can backup there.
The best values out there are hikvision and dahua.

 

[icerabbit]

If you use the free camera software from a manufacturer - like hikvision ivms 4200 for hikvision cameras - then you will only see that manufacturer's camera. I've tried to get it to see a couple foscams, but it wouldn't budge. (By the way: I'd avoid foscam) So, if you go that route, you are pretty much locked into that manufacturer. And that software can be a valid recording means, to get started. There is a bit of wiggle room with rebranded cameras that share the same hardware (dahua - hikvision - ...) but no guarantees from what I gather.

If you use a third party software such as BlueIris, Axxon Next, Xprotect, etc. they typically are compatible with most major camera brands. All I can say here is that Axxon Next has a bit of a learning curve (cough) due to lack of intuitiveness and does require some CPU power as you need two or three kinds of motion analytics per camera.

If you use a NAS system like Synology or QNAP, their surveillance module is also compatible with most major manufacturers. Between the two (having used Syno over time and trialed QNAP recently) my vote is for Synology. If they'd had more powerful cpus in their regular DS line I'd have been able to avoid a lot of trials and turbulations with software. They told me I needed an enterprise model to the tune of several $k EMPTY + n x $$$ HDD + n x $50 license :/ Sorry. Rather spend money differently.

The latter two categories (3rd party & NAS) may need a software update or camera pack update to become compatible with the newest cameras that leverage some new technologies, different protocols, ...

 

[dr.]

...
The short story is that I am involved with the management of an apartment building (16 units, 500ft long by maybe 40 ft wide). We have had robberies, thefts, drug related crimes, car jackings... you name it. Needless to say, it's not in the best of neighborhoods.

That being said, I would like to show the tenants some sort of proactive action by installing a security camera system...

Cameras aren't going to fix what sounds like a tenant/area problem. Invest in deterrents like lights for the grounds and fencing that creates choke points for entry/exit. You may even be able to kill two birds with one stone if you have pole lights installed as you could run wires for the cameras at the same time.

 

[bp2008]

I agree with what has been said above. If you install it all yourself, you will save a lot of money. If you look here, you will find prices that are pretty much unbeatable, 3 year warranties, shipped and sold from the USA: http://www.ipcamtalk.com/showthread.php?257-Good-source-to-buy-Hikvision-items-at - FYI his Hikvision stuff is rebranded but that isn't really a problem.

I personally prefer Hikvision's stuff since every Dahua I've ever used has had firmware issues, and Dahua doesn't publish their firmware - you have to go through the vendor you bought the cameras from, or get lucky with google.