Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage solut

[grimloktt]

Hello, all. Thanks again for letting me be part of your forum. I've read through a number of threads and have identified some possibilities, but I was wondering what the pros recommend. We are getting ready to move into a new home (already built) and want to setup another security camera system applying lessons learned from current set-up (D-Link DCS-5222L using powerline adapters). Here are the capabilities we are looking for:

• Cameras
  • POE powered
  • Designed so cable is invisible/goes through the ceiling
  • >=30m night vision IR
  • Indoor: Dome or fish eye (?)--not much familiarity with fish eyes...audio built in...and preferably audio out
  • high quality video
  • Outdoor cameras: Good IR, quality, range...
  • Access to view cameras remotely via smart phone
• Switch
  • Will be used for home internet...not just cameras
  • Estimating ~ 8 cameras--both indoors and outdoors
  • Would estimate Ethernet ran to 5/6 places--in addition to camera locations--for regular internet use.
    • I understand I can use small switches at terminations for multiple Ethernet devices, e.g. TV and media devices?
  • Provide PoE power
• Software
  • Software that permits monitoring all cameras at once when desired
  • Remote access
• Storage
  • I would like storage for not only security footage but also personal "stuff" (movies, data, pictures, home videos, etc)
• Backup Battery UPS
  • Any recommendations? We already have some simple ones for our current NVRs (which we won't be using)
• Performance
  • With my current set-up and some of the youtube videos I've viewed, I see stuttering when quality is too high. I want NO stuttering--especially when watching locally through Ethernet cable.

So, the switch will be in a closet and cables ran through the attic to rooms.

Thoughts? Thank you in advance!!!

 

[PSPCommOp]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

I'm new here and still taking alot of the stuff in but it seems like Blue Iris is the common software. Seems to offer the most for the least amount of money.

Also as far as the storage, I considered an NAS build as the NVR for a very short time until i found out that they don't have very fast processors to handle the software. I like the idea of NAS for my music and movies and ive since found out u can use it for automatic cloud backup of photos and stuff on your phone. I decided to go with an actual PC for the BI and security camera stuff and then purchase a NAS to use strictly for file storage. I'm going to have 6-8 cameras on my system as well and given what i want for video quality, I decided a separate system for backup of other files is a better option. You may want to look into that as well since it basically seems to only require one extra open port on your switch to connect it to your network.

Also for a PoE switch, if you only want to purchase one switch, you're gonna need at least a 16 channel.

 

[grimloktt]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

Thank you. So, for camera storage you will use Blue Iris and record directly to your computer? I wonder if the hard drive read/write speed must meet certain criteria in order to record the camera's highest quality footage feed?

 

[PSPCommOp]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

For storage i'm going to use a WD Purple HDD, most likely 6TB. I will also be using a SSD for the OS of the PC and also to run the Blue Iris program, however from what i've read its best to set the software up to record direct to the HDD. This cuts down on CPU usage and energy usage. Again i'm still new here but it seems like that is what most every does and suggests you do.

 

[grimloktt]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

For storage i'm going to use a WD Purple HDD, most likely 6TB. I will also be using a SSD for the OS of the PC and also to run the Blue Iris program, however from what i've read its best to set the software up to record direct to the HDD. This cuts down on CPU usage and energy usage. Again i'm still new here but it seems like that is what most every does and suggests you do.

Why not SSD for video versus HDD--cost? I'm assuming you're going to use a designated purpose for video? If so, any recommendations?

Edit: I read it's designed specifically for video, constant use... Will you put it in a computer tower or some other enclosure?

 

[PSPCommOp]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

SSD for OS and software, HDD for video files because yes, its much more cost effective at this point. There's some comments here about the longevity of SSD's under constant use, that they are more susceptible to fail earlier then HDD, however alot of the literature coming out on that fact is showing it isn't necessarily true. But the cost for a reputable 2TB SSD drive on Amazon right now with a quick search shows it close to $700. A 4 TB WD Purple at 5400 rpm (lower RPM is better for energy consumption btw), is around $144 and you can prob find them on sale for a little cheaper if you're patient and feel like searching. I'm sure after a few years once the cost drops it'll be much easier for me to move away from HDD to an all SSD system.

I'm currently trying to figure that location questionactually.. I bought a SFF Optiplex meaning its very small and i'm told will be pretty hard to add much inside, although i've also read elsewhere that it is possible to remove the CD/DVD drive (if you have one) and purchase a caddy to hold a 2.5" SSD in the same spot where the optical drive should be. The PC hasn't arrived yet but i have ordered some parts to see if this method will work on mine. I've also read that its possible to literally velcro or double sided sticky tape the SSD into the tower as well. fenderman is an admin on here and i've found him to be a great source of information with regards to PC capabilities. There are a few others that seem to really know what they are talking about so i'd browse around and take some notes. Thats pretty much what i've done.

 

[grimloktt]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

SSD for OS and software, HDD for video files because yes, its much more cost effective at this point. There's some comments here about the longevity of SSD's under constant use, that they are more susceptible to fail earlier then HDD, however alot of the literature coming out on that fact is showing it isn't necessarily true. But the cost for a reputable 2TB SSD drive on Amazon right now with a quick search shows it close to $700. A 4 TB WD Purple at 5400 rpm (lower RPM is better for energy consumption btw), is around $144 and you can prob find them on sale for a little cheaper if you're patient and feel like searching. I'm sure after a few years once the cost drops it'll be much easier for me to move away from HDD to an all SSD system.

I'm currently trying to figure that location questionactually.. I bought a SFF Optiplex meaning its very small and i'm told will be pretty hard to add much inside, although i've also read elsewhere that it is possible to remove the CD/DVD drive (if you have one) and purchase a caddy to hold a 2.5" SSD in the same spot where the optical drive should be. The PC hasn't arrived yet but i have ordered some parts to see if this method will work on mine. I've also read that its possible to literally velcro or double sided sticky tape the SSD into the tower as well. fenderman is an admin on here and i've found him to be a great source of information with regards to PC capabilities. There are a few others that seem to really know what they are talking about so i'd browse around and take some notes. Thats pretty much what i've done.

Thnx, man. You've pointed me in the right direction for drives. Since your recommendation, I've been reading up on WD Purple and it sounds promising. I'd have to buy a computer...need to figure out what would be optimal. Thnx!

P.S. I'm moving from FL next week to Williamsport, PA. Where do you hang your hat?

 

[PSPCommOp]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

Ya there are other brands out there designed for surveillance and while i've seen some argue that you can go with a regular HDD with the same results, i know people who use these drives for NAS systems and security systems and have had good luck so i'm gonna stick with those. There are others out there to consider tho if you have time and feel like browsing.

And I'm around the WB/Scranton area, about an hour and a half to your east. You're moving to the home of the Little League World Series. I've been there a few times, also had fun. Good luck with the system and your move!

 

[grimloktt]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

Ya there are other brands out there designed for surveillance and while i've seen some argue that you can go with a regular HDD with the same results, i know people who use these drives for NAS systems and security systems and have had good luck so i'm gonna stick with those. There are others out there to consider tho if you have time and feel like browsing.

And I'm around the WB/Scranton area, about an hour and a half to your east. You're moving to the home of the Little League World Series. I've been there a few times, also had fun. Good luck with the system and your move!

Yea...you're out there in the Poconos...and..."The Office." eaceful:

 

[PSPCommOp]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

Not quite the Poconos, thats about 45 minutes to the south of me, i was stationed at a barracks there for almost a year though. Nice area if you like hiking and trails and stuff. They are more to the south. I'm to the west of "The Office" tho hahaha.

 

[nayr]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

• Cameras = Dahua, 2.8mm Turrets/Domes indoors, 6mm and up LXIR Turrets/Bullets Outdoors, all with IVS Smart Features (LineCross/Intrusion detection), paired with a 16ch Dahua Non-PoE NVR (4216-4k), 2MP or 4MP.. the latter if your willing to install additional lighting to help at night, former if its just really f'n dark.
• Switch = 24P GigE w/12 PoE, lots avilable check used listings on ebay too (Dlink/Linksys/Cisco/etc)
• Software = Dahua SmartPSS for Live Monitoring and Playback on Windows/Mac, gDMSS on Android and iDMSS on iOS
• Storage = 6TB WDD Purple, with room for a 2nd if you need more recording capacity.. Record continuously outdoors, record indoors when security system is armed.. you'll probably get >2 weeks of archive.
  • Do not store personal 'stuff' with video surveillance, your personal stuff you'll want to recover if a disk fails, your surveillance stuff you dont care about backing up
• Backup Battery UPS = Get a 1000VA at minimum, run just your switch, cable modem, and nvr off it.. Dlink switches seem to be the most power & cost efficient for best runtime, hardware NVR takes very little power.
• Performance = Wont be a problem, you'll be at well under 50% load @ highest quality on the NVR.

 

[PSPCommOp]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

• Backup Battery UPS = Get a 1000VA at minimum, run just your switch, cable modem, and nvr off it..

Never considered this but if the power goes out, is cable usually still connected for internet?

 

[nayr]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

I suppose it depends on the outage, if the infrastructure is still intact then.. yes.. if a storm took out all the power poles, not likely.

many provide voip services and the modem has to be on backup for 911 compliance.. since hardlines dont require power.

 

[tangent]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

Never considered this but if the power goes out, is cable usually still connected for internet?

Generally yes, but it depends on the duration of the outage. You have to provide backup power to your own devices.

 

[grimloktt]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

• Cameras = Dahua, 2.8mm Turrets/Domes indoors, 6mm and up LXIR Turrets/Bullets Outdoors, all with IVS Smart Features (LineCross/Intrusion detection), paired with a 16ch Dahua Non-PoE NVR (4216-4k), 2MP or 4MP.. the latter if your willing to install additional lighting to help at night, former if its just really f'n dark.
• Switch = 24P GigE w/12 PoE, lots avilable check used listings on ebay too (Dlink/Linksys/Cisco/etc)
• Software = Dahua SmartPSS for Live Monitoring and Playback on Windows/Mac, gDMSS on Android and iDMSS on iOS
• Storage = 6TB WDD Purple, with room for a 2nd if you need more recording capacity.. Record continuously outdoors, record indoors when security system is armed.. you'll probably get >2 weeks of archive.
  • Do not store personal 'stuff' with video surveillance, your personal stuff you'll want to recover if a disk fails, your surveillance stuff you dont care about backing up
• Backup Battery UPS = Get a 1000VA at minimum, run just your switch, cable modem, and nvr off it.. Dlink switches seem to be the most power & cost efficient for best runtime, hardware NVR takes very little power.
• Performance = Wont be a problem, you'll be at well under 50% load @ highest quality on the NVR.

Thank you. I'm doing research and will post back but one thing that's unclear to me is what do I use to record to the hard drives: computer or some kind of "server?"

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

 

[JuliusTheodore]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

To record to the hard drives, he's recommending a stand-alone Network Video Recorder (similar to your cable's DVR): 16ch Dahua Non-PoE NVR (4216-4k)

 

[grimloktt]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

To record to the hard drives, he's recommending a stand-alone Network Video Recorder (similar to your cable's DVR): 16ch Dahua Non-PoE NVR (4216-4k)

Gotcha.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

 

[Del Boy]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

Hey I'm curious why you recommend Non-POE, "paired with a 16ch Dahua Non-PoE NVR"? I was leaning toward the PoE cause I only have to run one cable per camera. Then you went with a PoE switch, is that because you run the cat5 from the cameras to the switch and then run the switch to the NVR? I'm new to this and really appreciate all the advice.
Thanks.

He's not. He's recommending PoE cameras connected to a PoE switch connected to a non-PoE NVR. One cable only to the Swi7tch.

I personally prefer built in switch to NVR to make it easier (especially for noobs). Something like Hikvision DS-7604NI-E1/4P or Dahua NVR4204-P, the P signifies built in PoE switch.

 

[JBoyle]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

• a 16ch Dahua Non-PoE NVR (4216-4k), 2MP or 4MP.. the latter if your willing to install additional lighting to help at night, former if its just really f'n dark.
• Switch = 24P GigE w/12 PoE, lots avilable check used listings on ebay too (Dlink/Linksys/Cisco/etc)

Hey I'm curious why you recommend Non-POE, "paired with a 16ch Dahua Non-PoE NVR"? I was leaning toward the PoE cause I only have to run one cable per camera. Then you went with a PoE switch, is that because you run the cat5 from the cameras to the switch and then run the switch to the NVR? I'm new to this and really appreciate all the advice.
Thanks.

 

[JBoyle]

Re: Help me select hardware: dome cameras; POE switch; monitoring software; storage s

He's not. He's recommending PoE cameras connected to a PoE switch connected to a non-PoE NVR. One cable only to the Swi7tch.

I personally prefer built in switch to NVR to make it easier (especially for noobs). Something like Hikvision DS-7604NI-E1/4P or Dahua NVR4204-P, the P signifies built in PoE switch.

Ok, thanks! What about off-site storage? Can the Hikvision DS-7604NI-E1/4P or Dahua NVR4204-P, upload to the cloud in real time?