Help with networking decision

D

Dmchan1

Young grasshopper
May 12, 2021
61
21
Us
Ok folks I have a task to complete for my aging parents (a few hundred miles away) and I am not sure what the best route is. Bear with me here this is a bit of a novel (sorry)
My goal is to have 7 cameras operating with as little maintenance/ complication as possible. I have been maintaining their system but I'm not often on site and they don't do technology very well. I'd like them to have a stable system that they don't have to fuss with much, if at all. I can be there 2x a year to fix and maintain but it would be best if they don't have to touch it.

Currently they have a handful of older POE cameras and one wifi camera (more on that in a bit). The cat5 is very old and degraded from rodents and UV. I am going to install new cameras, and if necessary run new POE cable. Before I get into the actual question(s) let me paint the current situation:

They have an ancient amcrest NV2108E NVR. A handful of 5-7 year old amcrest POE cams run into it. This connects to their network via an amazon wifi extender (Brostrend AC1200 dual band wifi extender) because the router was relocated too far away to run a cable and it does not have wifi capability. They have one location that needs a camera 120' away. The cat5 died somewhere underground so I hacked together a solution (this is where it gets wacky). From the wifi extender I run a hard line into a 5 port switch. From that switch I connect the NVR and a Netgear AC1750 model R6400 nighthawk. Somehow my undereducated persistence managed to get the wifi camera ( ) to hit the nighthawk as an access point(I think), which then sends the signal to the NVR via ethernet. It works....somehow.

Questions:
1-Would removing the POE cameras and dropping in several new wifi cameras (via the nighthawk) work?
1a- Can the router handle multiple wifi signals in and out to the NVR via ethernet?
1b -Will this be unstable?
2- If that is even viable, are there wifi cameras available that will transmit the signal 60' through a two story house to that router? (the 120' distance only has one large window between camera and router)
3- If this is still on the table are there doorbell cams that will play nice with this setup?

4- If that is a terrible plan, I will run all new ethernet for POE- unless one of you more experienced folks has some kind of better solution? (maybe a new NVR with wifi capability can handle all wifi cams at these distances?)
4a- If you have a more elegant solution should I run a separate standalone doorbell cam entirely or will something in the same amcrest/dahua family work with this solution?

money is *a factor, but it is not a huge factor. They're old but are willing to spare a bit of change for a stable, long lasting system.
**I do NOT want to run new ethernet... but I will (the 120' run is underground and hits salt-groundwater about 80' into the run).

any help you folks can offer would be incredibly appreciated.
 
As an Amazon Associate IPCamTalk earns from qualifying purchases.
  • Like
Reactions: mat200
There’s only one or two people here who would argue against using Ethernet, and only because someone else said it. Screw them. Think for yourself, if you have to make an important phone call, would you rather both ends be cellular or landline?

If they’re that remote, you want the least points of failure so if they/you, have to troubleshoot, it’s flipping one switch.
If you’re going to consider wireless, think about attenuation. Metal siding and studs with 1940-70’s metal mesh plaster, vs thin wood and 1/2” drywall.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mat200 and Dmchan1
I definitely prefer Ethernet myself. I half-assed hoped there would be a good argument for wifi since I might be able to troubleshoot digitally from afar vs having no option to put hands on unless I'm on site.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mat200
Wouldn't remote troubleshooting work the same with a cabled or a wi-fi solution?

Is there power at each of the current/proposed camera locations to support wi-fi cameras?

You mentioned some of the CAT5 has UV damage, so consider better runs to keep the cabling inside the house. Is the rodent damage to the CAT5 outside, under the house, or in the attic? Conduit would help protect the new runs.

Is the camera system just to monitor the area/property, or are there security concerns?
 
  • Like
Reactions: mat200
WiFi can run into interference from so many sources... can be ok sometime, but if reliability is a goal, you don't want to use WiFi in most circumstances.
  • Troubleshooting actual WiFi issues is beyond most folks (don't have RF monitoring capability, etc)
  • Yes, multiple video signals on same WiFi channel can cause problems, there are ways around this... but with complexity comes increased challenges with troubleshooting

Again, going with reliability/low-maintenance priority
  • Yes, replace the UV degraded CAT5 with newer cable. And cover it up this time ... cheapest possible conduit/PVC pipe will be fine. And for limited price premium you may want to consider Shielded cables depending on awareness of neighboring power circuits (ie rule about crossing only in perpendicular, not running in parallel except for very short distances (less than 12inches), recommended separation distances, etc.)
  • if rodents an issue, seal either end of those conduits (and properly seal all junction points)
  • as for the 120' underground cable run... if that was in conduit, something went wrong. If not in sealed conduit, that was the issue.
A common mistake with underground conduit runs is to point either end up towards the sky (creating a water ingress point)

A single WiFi camera (or 2) depending on resolution/bitrate, can be fine with right Access Point. A quality Access Point (not something consumer level) can handle much more...
but think of ALL WiFi devices, which channel/bands they are on, etc. The security cameras are one thing, but phones, tablet, smart devices, etc will all compete for limited bandwidth ... there are ways to deal with this, but there are LOTS of 'it depends' factors.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mat200
then see other threads here referencing dielectric grease on any outdoor RJ45 connections
as well as cable types for outdoor ratings... some with direct burial option... but I'm of the opinion, if you are going to dig a trench, why not spend a few dollar more and do it right (something where you could pull out old CAT5/6 cable and pull through new at same time... so no need to trench again, regardless)

Are you SURE the cable 5 cable that died underground isn't bad at one of the exposed ends? did you cut off the end and re-terminate (new RJ45 end) to check?
 
  • Like
Reactions: mat200
there is conduit in the ground for the long run already. Hard to say what killed it. Its been many years. In theory I can pull new with the old line in the ground. It has a 15' vertical drop over that distance and it definitely hits the water table as the house is on a canal. Im investing in good cable, direct burial, solid core, etc. good call on th dielectric grease. I will very likely do that for the high corrosion areas
 
  • Like
Reactions: mat200
Dmchan1 said:
Ok folks I have a task to complete for my aging parents (a few hundred miles away) and I am not sure what the best route is. Bear with me here this is a bit of a novel (sorry)
My goal is to have 7 cameras operating with as little maintenance/ complication as possible. I have been maintaining their system but I'm not often on site and they don't do technology very well. I'd like them to have a stable system that they don't have to fuss with much, if at all. I can be there 2x a year to fix and maintain but it would be best if they don't have to touch it.

Currently they have a handful of older POE cameras and one wifi camera (more on that in a bit). The cat5 is very old and degraded from rodents and UV. I am going to install new cameras, and if necessary run new POE cable. Before I get into the actual question(s) let me paint the current situation:

They have an ancient amcrest NV2108E NVR. A handful of 5-7 year old amcrest POE cams run into it. This connects to their network via an amazon wifi extender (Brostrend AC1200 dual band wifi extender) because the router was relocated too far away to run a cable and it does not have wifi capability. They have one location that needs a camera 120' away. The cat5 died somewhere underground so I hacked together a solution (this is where it gets wacky). From the wifi extender I run a hard line into a 5 port switch. From that switch I connect the NVR and a Netgear AC1750 model R6400 nighthawk. Somehow my undereducated persistence managed to get the wifi camera ( ) to hit the nighthawk as an access point(I think), which then sends the signal to the NVR via ethernet. It works....somehow.

Questions:
1-Would removing the POE cameras and dropping in several new wifi cameras (via the nighthawk) work?
1a- Can the router handle multiple wifi signals in and out to the NVR via ethernet?
1b -Will this be unstable?
2- If that is even viable, are there wifi cameras available that will transmit the signal 60' through a two story house to that router? (the 120' distance only has one large window between camera and router)
3- If this is still on the table are there doorbell cams that will play nice with this setup?

4- If that is a terrible plan, I will run all new ethernet for POE- unless one of you more experienced folks has some kind of better solution? (maybe a new NVR with wifi capability can handle all wifi cams at these distances?)
4a- If you have a more elegant solution should I run a separate standalone doorbell cam entirely or will something in the same amcrest/dahua family work with this solution?

money is *a factor, but it is not a huge factor. They're old but are willing to spare a bit of change for a stable, long lasting system.
**I do NOT want to run new ethernet... but I will (the 120' run is underground and hits salt-groundwater about 80' into the run).

any help you folks can offer would be incredibly appreciated.
Click to expand...

Hi

Sounds like conduit and good quality cables and junction boxes will be your friend in this case.

Remember a drop of dielectric gel in the rj45 boot .. and drip loops on cable runs if not going in conduit.

Wifi imho you are asking for more trouble down the line
 
As an Amazon Associate IPCamTalk earns from qualifying purchases.
Dmchan1 said:
there is conduit in the ground for the long run already. Hard to say what killed it. Its been many years. In theory I can pull new with the old line in the ground. It has a 15' vertical drop over that distance and it definitely hits the water table as the house is on a canal. Im investing in good cable, direct burial, solid core, etc. good call on th dielectric grease. I will very likely do that for the high corrosion areas
Click to expand...
If the connection is outdoors, it requires Dielectric grease on every connection. Everything outdoors, is in a high corrosion area.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lawrence_SoCal, TonyR and mat200
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom