Long range system

J

jlppilot

n3wb
Feb 19, 2020
26
1
High Plains
I have two farmsteads and each farmstead has multiple buildings I need to monitor as partially described in the picture.

Location B actually had 6 different areas I would like to monitor. Each area needs between 2 and 6 cameras.

Location A actually has 5 areas I would like to monitor. Each area would need between 1 and 6 cameras.

I wouldn’t do it all at once but eventually I’d like to end up with around 30 to 40 cameras total.

I only have a vague idea of what I would need and really no idea if it’s possible. Anyone care to provide a brief rundown of what I would need?

Thanks.
 

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The only internet service either farm has is cellular data from iPhones and iPads.

On the one farmstead where I live I have taken two Linksys WRT54GL routers and installed dd-wrt on them. Then I put one of them in bridge mode so that I could use that one to connect to iPhone or iPad hotspots. Then I connected the LAN port of that one to the WAN port of the second one so the second one serves internet to any device on the network by utilizing the iPhone or iPad hotspot.

I do not have access to any other reasonable form of internet other than satellite. I used to have satellite internet and didn't like a lot of things about it so I switched to cellular but maybe satellite has improved a lot in the last 7 or 8 years.
 
Got line of site between the two sites? Lots of support for the Ubiquity wireless bridges at least to solve that piece of the problem, and they should provide significantly more point-to-point bandwidth to support the larger number of cameras.
 
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I think I can get line of sight. Maybe a thin line of trees to partially obstruct but most likely can clear that too.

That's one thing I was wondering the most about. Let's say I have 20 cameras at the location that is 1.4 miles from the computer that does the recording. How much bandwidth do I need?

I would really like to identify offenders. I'm interested in providing evidence to law enforcement that they can take action on.
 
Almost sounds like you could setup one system at one location and another system at the other. NVR at both location, and continue to send data via cell if you have really good cell service. If you are using BlueIris would think the remote feature might work. Either way you look at it ... not sure cell data is going to get you the bandwidth you need.

You could do a P2P a Mikrotik Wireless Wire kit 60 GHz wireless link 1 Gbit full duplex Link would be nice but I don't think it will travel the distance you are dealing with. Ubiquity or Engenius might work WEP P2P connect.
 
Beefarmer said:
Almost sounds like you could setup one system at one location and another system at the other. NVR at both location, and continue to send data via cell if you have really good cell service. If you are using BlueIris would think the remote feature might work. Either way you look at it ... not sure cell data is going to get you the bandwidth you need.

You could do a P2P a Mikrotik Wireless Wire kit 60 GHz wireless link 1 Gbit full duplex Link would be nice but I don't think it will travel the distance you are dealing with. Ubiquity or Engenius might work WEP P2P connect.
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Thanks. Out of curiosity, why is cellular data not good enough? That statement tells me I don’t understand how BlueIris works.

I thought it worked as follows:

1. All the heavy data use stays on the LAN. Cameras send their data to the BlueIris computer across the network. BlueIris monitors all cameras all the time but only records if it detects motion on one of the cameras. BlueIris stores the recorded data on hard drives to be pulled up later if necessary.

2. If you pay for the mobile app, BlueIris computer sends alerts to your mobile device when it detects movement.

3.You can use the mobile device to look at what was recorded if you so desire.

I assume step 3 would be lower quality video and would not be utilized all that often so hopefully it would not overwhelm a cellular plan but maybe my optimism is misguided due to not understanding the system?
 
Was referring to cellular if you stream all cameras from one location to another and not from just one point. Sorry for the confusion.
 
Remember, line of sight actually only means an unobstructed path. That can be problematic with tall trees but with careful positioning it can be done and a dedicated RF link will work.

Besides the app, BI will also send SMS and emails on triggers, assuming the PC has internet access, of course.
 
If you can provide a rough diagram of the buildings layout at location A and location B it would help drafting a proposal. 30 cameras should be manageable with the right wireless kit and NVR. The cellular network should be fine for remote viewing, alerts and event playback if configured correctly.
 
StewartM said:
If you can provide a rough diagram of the buildings layout at location A and location B it would help drafting a proposal. 30 cameras should be manageable with the right wireless kit and NVR. The cellular network should be fine for remote viewing, alerts and event playback if configured correctly.
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Thanks, I would really appreciate that. This is location B. I'll work on location A next. I drew this up this morning by using a screenshot of Google Earth and then making a new layer over the Google Earth imagine in Paint.NET and drawing stuff over the top of the Google Earth Image and then finally removing the Google Earth Image. I used Google Earth distances for the distance legend. It should be pretty close to scale but it's somewhat ugly since I used the line tool to create buildings rather than the rectangle tool.

I came up with 22 cameras. In reality I would likely start with key cameras first and build on to the system over time. I can imagine wanting more cameras than that eventually, maybe as many as 30 at location B? But initially it's likely it will be more like 10 to get started.

I also hope to set up sensors on various doors and windows that send an alarm to phones when the system is armed. I don't know if there is a different security product that would be good for that or if I need to figure that part out myself? I was thinking even something as simple as a Raspberry Pi on the network that is monitoring network attached switches with a simple program. When one of them trips it could set of an alarm and it could send a a message to mobile devices or something like that. Have not researched that aspect at all, just thinking for now. Maybe would have driveway sensors and that kind of thing too?
 

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Here is the location A layout. Please note that neither location has an LAN capabilities other than a couple of Linksys WRT54GL routers in buidling two at Location A. No ethernet pulled anywhere. Nothing at all really.

Realistically I'm trying to keep the expense for this year under $10,000. My first focus is to get lights and cameras in and around building 2 and building 4.

My priority would be to develop a high bandwidth LAN link between Location A and Location B. If I want to over-build anywhere, I want it to be here because that will probably be the most expensive thing to upgrade in the future?

My 3rd priority would be to get cameras and lights around building 5 and fuel tank 6 at location B.

I don't want for any subsequent additions to require me to undo any previous steps though so if I have to do something to other buildings and locations as I focus on those priorities, that is fine.

Thanks for any thoughts, I really appreciate it!Location_A_Layout.jpg
 
@jlppilot For the link between the two locations I'd definitely look into setting up a long range bridge, the Ubiquity systems seem highly reliable and with high bandwidth. I recall seeing some videos demonstrating their capabilities at several miles away, so 1.5 miles should be no problem assuming you can get decent line of site. Video1 Video2 , Not only will you get superior bandwidth (up to 150 Mbps) but over time you'll save a lot of money by avoiding ongoing cellular fees at location B. I've never used their products but they seem straightforward and reliable, and only a couple hundred for a complete setup from what I can tell.

I'd get a separate NVR at location B, I believe you'd be able to link the entire NVR to Blue Iris running at location A, at that bandwidth you should should be able to live stream all cameras if needed from Location A. For remote viewing (away from either location) you should be able to easily receive notifications and stream alerts or live playback on 1-4 channels (depends on the cellular connection obviously).

Treat each location as a dedicated independent network, wire and use POE lines to as many cameras as possible and do smaller bridges or wifi cameras as sparingly as possible, maintain the bridge between Locations A and B (Should only need to setup one time), for WAN/Internet you should be able to use your current single cellular connection.
 
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Which one, location one or location two, will the "main" setup be at that will be monitored.

Looking at location B, the only way you're going to get to those two tanks, #7, is with a wireless link. The rest of them can be split up using switches as either hubs, branching out to various cameras or linking to additional switches once you get to about 330 feet on any single run. Above all, don't use any WiFi cameras. You'll actually be making the cameras at those tanks WiFi but there is a major difference between that, a dedicated WiFi bridge link with its own encryption and some POS WiFi camera, kind of like apples and rotten oranges.

Don't forget to account for the cable lengths at each location going to cameras, also. Some cameras are "ePoE" rated and can go out to 800 feet. You may want to check with Andy at Empire Tech for Dahua models that will do that for you.

Can you run cable underground between your buildings or are you stuck with overhead runs? Staying away from overhead runs is a very good thing to do, less likely to take damage from nearby or direct lightning strikes.
 
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sebastiantombs said:
Which one, location one or location two, will the "main" setup be at that will be monitored.

Looking at location B, the only way you're going to get to those two tanks, #7, is with a wireless link. The rest of them can be split up using switches as either hubs, branching out to various cameras or linking to additional switches once you get to about 330 feet on any single run. Above all, don't use any WiFi cameras. You'll actually be making the cameras at those tanks WiFi but there is a major difference between that, a dedicated WiFi bridge link with its own encryption and some POS WiFi camera, kind of like apples and rotten oranges.

Don't forget to account for the cable lengths at each location going to cameras, also. Some cameras are "ePoE" rated and can go out to 800 feet. You may want to check with Andy at Empire Tech for Dahua models that will do that for you.

Can you run cable underground between your buildings or are you stuck with overhead runs? Staying away from overhead runs is a very good thing to do, less likely to take damage from nearby or direct lightning strikes.
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I don't know if this changes anything or not but there is 0 chance that any of this will be any wired connections between buildings. It would be a project to get overhead runs high enough that I could get my farm equipment under the lines. I'm simply not willing to trench in ethernet to each building.

So all connections between buildings will have to be wireless. I am willing to run ethernet cables from PoE switches to cameras that are in each building or mounted to the outside of each building but I am not willing to trench in ethernet or go overhead with any ethernet.
 
I should mention that anything I buy needs to operate from minus 15 degrees F to 115 degrees F. All of the buildings other than houses are unheated.
 
Those temps shouldn't be a problem.

I appreciate what you're saying in terms of equipment. My grandparents had a small farm, 30 acres, and a very good friend has a large farm, 500 acres, so I know what kind of investment it can turn into. Where I live, now, is kind of rural with large farms, dairy, horse and crops, all around the area. There has been some vandalism of equipment on a few of those farms which really pissed me off. Why wreck somebodies source of income? If I caught them, in the act, there would be some serious problems for them.

If you're not up for trenching, have you considered renting a trenching machine, the only way to go is with WiFi, Nano Loco, between each building. I'd shop them and see if I could get a bulk rate price because you're going to need a bunch of them. They can be daisy chained to get from building to building if you can't get a good signal back to the house. I'd try not to do that unless I couldn't get a good signal from a specific building. Keep the house as the hub with all the Loco devices linked back to it.
 
Well heck, I finally truly checked line of sight. Does not exist. Really thought I would have it from the top of the barn to the top of one of the grain bins.

I don’t though, the trees block it. I don’t want to cut a tree or 3 down for this.

I think another 15’ or so on each end and I would have line of sight but I feel that would be pretty hard to add in a stable manner and I imagine anything that reaches 1.4 miles has to be aimed precisely which would require a stable mounting system.
 
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