New member working on 1st sec cam project

murphy2u

murphy2u

n3wb
Dec 31, 2016
13
0
Tampa FL
Hello from Tampa. Security camera noob here, trying to get smart enough to do an external camera install after some ongoing crimes in my neighborhood (and a couple of minor ones in my front yard). I am tech conversant and relatively handy (build my own PCs, speak a bit of IP--a home network of a couple of a router bridged to an AP with a couple of NASs and running MAC based wireless authentication, fix my own cars, and do my own home maintenance). For better or worse, I have an systems engineering and nuclear power plant management background, but I've been out of that arena for 10 years.

*** Overall build goals ***
· 30’, night-time face-recognition quality coverage for driveway and adjacent walkway to door
· Need good nighttime coverage due to timing of crimes
· Cameras will be installed on the ceiling of the front porch--relatively protected from weather
· NVR with IVS that can trigger an external audio alarm
· The camera NVR (+POE router) infrastructure will have to be in the garage and will have to have a wireless bridge to my existing network (due to physical arrangements/existing structure)
· Would like to avoid running a computer full-time--I'm down to maintaining an intermittently used workstation and a laptop--I'd like to keep it that way.
· No existing rack--but buying one
· Effectiveness and simplicity are prioritized over price. Budget is $2k
· I do have an eye for expansion--I'm willing to include that in the budget/hardware decisions also (as looney2ns correctly predicted below).

Hardware--existing and prospective: (links to specific discussion threads will be added to each header as I make them):
- Cameras: New System Build--camera selection and installation advice
-- Driveway/walkway (10'-30'): Dahua IPC-HDW5231R-Z Starlight Turret--either two or three of them to cover the area and a distant approach
- NVR:NVR Selection and Configuration Confirmation
-- NVR5216-16P-4KS2 or NVR5216-4KS2
-- 2x WD Black 6TB WD6001FZWX
- POE+ capable router: Ubiquiti US-16-150W
- Wall-mount rack: Tripp Lite 9U Wall Mount Rack Enclosure Server Cabinet, 16.5" Deep, Switch-Depth (SRW9U)
- Cable: Monoprice 500FT Cat 6 Bulk Bare Copper Ethernet Network Cable STP, Solid, In Wall Rated, 550MHz, 23AWG Gray
- Connectors: Monoprice Cat6 Plug Solid W/Insert 50U 100pcs/Bag
- Bridge from NVR/POE router: ASUS RT-N66U (existing)
- Crimping tool: Klein Tools VDV226-107 Compact Ratcheting Modular Crimper
- Connection tester: Tonor TM RJ45 RJ11 RJ12 CAT5 CAT 6 UTP Network Lan Cable Tester Test Tool
- Management Software: Blue Iris

Existing infrastructure:
- Client AP/Router: ASUS EA-N66 (existing)
- NAS: Synology DS211 (don't think I want to use for surveillance storage though--see my NVR thread for why I'm thinking NVR over NAS)
- Laptop: Pavillion DV6 (Core i7-3610QM / 8GB RAM / SanDisk SDSSDXP120G 120GB SSD- Win 7 Premium 64bit)
- Workstation: Core i7 i920 - Gigabyte EX58 Extreme - ATI HD 4870 - 4GB Patriot 1600LL DDR3 @ 540x 7-7-7-20 - Crucial RealSSD C300 - Crucial 750W PS - Antec 1200 case - temp and flow instrumented incl front panel display - Win 7 Premium - fully watercooled: Ehime 1250 - 1/2"ID - Parallel loop CPU/NB/Video - 200mm radiator

I'm totally new to the knowledge needed to make a good decision on purchasing, installing, configuring, and operating the right setup for my needs. I'm forum friendly--spent time on ones for my cars, my table saw, my network, and computer hardware. I'll do my best to do my homework, including using the search function. I've started reading enough threads on here to know I wanted to sign up, so I just have--and I'll resume reading shortly. Thanks to those with threads pointing to good resources (such as Camera Calculator / Design Software). My apologies in advance for any shortfalls in any post at this forum--this group strikes me as very deep into the intricacies of very nice setups.

Happy New Year!
Matt
 
Last edited:
Welcome to the forum!
Lucky for you, lotsa newbies precede you. So there's prior guidance you can pore over....
 
Pouring through it now. Quite useful of course!
 
If I read the forum correctly, there is no single build forum, so I'll use this thread as a master one for my build and have some individual thread for discussion of specific components. I'll be editing my initial post with context and goals for my build and add a link to this thread if people reading my component posts want to know more.
 
While your laptop would work for Blue Iris, you might be better off with a dedicated desktop system. A dedicated system because that is the most reliable way to run it -- no silly humans browsing the web and downloading viruses or running other resource intensive tasks that would make Blue Iris perform poorly. A desktop because you can put in larger hard drives and have it automatically turn back on after a power outage. Something with a Skylake i5-6400 or i5-6500 I think, which you could buy refurbished, complete with Windows license and 2-3 years of manufacturer warranty, for $300-$350. Although Kaby Lake CPUs are about to be released, it will likely be a minimal upgrade over Skylake, and you'd have to wait several months for good deals on refurbished systems. Anyway, put in a nice big (4-8 TB) Western Digital Purple hard drive, and you should be able to record continuously for a couple weeks with only 2 or 3 starlight cameras on the system.

As for your cameras, you can't go wrong with the varifocal starlight. If your street is lit by street lights already and you only want to determine the make/model of vehicles, then I don't think you need the PTZ for your stated purposes. Because you probably won't be watching when criminal activity happens, that PTZ would be no more effective than a fixed camera with extremely long zoom and infrared range. However, if your street is completely dark at night, then it will be hard to light it up well enough even for the starlight camera.

Here are some night-time snapshots from an IPC-HDW5231R-Z I just set up for my dad the other day. There is no lighting except stars, a sliver of moon (look at the moon phase on Dec 30th, 2016), and the camera's built-in IR.

This first image is fully zoomed out. The road/gate starts about 50 feet away and ends about 70 feet away. By 100 feet, it is almost completely black. This is auto exposure, which is something like 1/30th of a second exposure time -- pretty common.



This is fully zoomed in.



Just to show off the crazy low light capability of the camera, this one is at maximum gain (100) and exposure (1/3 second), with infrared turned off but the camera still in black and white mode. In color mode, it can't see nearly as well. You have to remember that with this long of an exposure, anything that moves through the frame will look like a very blurry ghost. But a parked car or something could be identified under just about any lighting.

 
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Reactions: looney2ns and nayr
thanks @bp2008, I was waiting to see how it'd do at night there.. love the long exposure shot, despite all the snow that looks like its an extremely dark environment.
 
bp2008 said:
While your laptop would work for Blue Iris, you might be better off with a dedicated desktop system. A dedicated system because that is the most reliable way to run it -- no silly humans browsing the web and downloading viruses or running other resource intensive tasks that would make Blue Iris perform poorly. A desktop because you can put in larger hard drives and have it automatically turn back on after a power outage. Something with a Skylake i5-6400 or i5-6500 I think, which you could buy refurbished, complete with Windows license and 2-3 years of manufacturer warranty, for $300-$350. Although Kaby Lake CPUs are about to be released, it will likely be a minimal upgrade over Skylake, and you'd have to wait several months for good deals on refurbished systems. Anyway, put in a nice big (4-8 TB) Western Digital Purple hard drive, and you should be able to record continuously for a couple weeks with only 2 or 3 starlight cameras on the system.

As for your cameras, you can't go wrong with the varifocal starlight. If your street is lit by street lights already and you only want to determine the make/model of vehicles, then I don't think you need the PTZ for your stated purposes. Because you probably won't be watching when criminal activity happens, that PTZ would be no more effective than a fixed camera with extremely long zoom and infrared range. However, if your street is completely dark at night, then it will be hard to light it up well enough even for the starlight camera.

Here are some night-time snapshots from an IPC-HDW5231R-Z I just set up for my dad the other day. There is no lighting except stars, a sliver of moon (look at the moon phase on Dec 30th, 2016), and the camera's built-in IR.

This first image is fully zoomed out. The road/gate starts about 50 feet away and ends about 70 feet away. By 100 feet, it is almost completely black. This is auto exposure, which is something like 1/30th of a second exposure time -- pretty common.





This is fully zoomed in.



Just to show off the crazy low light capability of the camera, this one is at maximum gain (100) and exposure (1/3 second), with infrared turned off but the camera still in black and white mode. In color mode, it can't see nearly as well. You have to remember that with this long of an exposure, anything that moves through the frame will look like a very blurry ghost. But a parked car or something could be identified under just about any lighting.

Click to expand...

that last shot is awesome. You can see the stars in the upper right corner.
 
The challenge I'll have is that the target area isn't the parking area for the target vehicle in question--it will be transiting at ~15-20mph and parks in an area that is out of view from my house. The link to the threat I started in the Dahua camera sub-forum will help explain a good bit more.

New System Build--camera selection and installation advice

As for the desktop piece, if I were looking to run BI full-time, that makes perfect sense (and I could build a purpose-built box for that). I'm looking for the NVR to cover down on the recording front, but (having not yet read nearly enough on BI and the software side of this yet), I'm hoping to just use a workstation/laptop interface (via IP) as needed for management and video playback. Given that this system will be in the garage, I'm not looking (nor do I have the room) to sit out there with a dedicated workstation on the surveillance portion of the network.
 
Updated for a draft NVR selection and definitely using a POE router.
 
Updated for cable, connector, POE router, wall rack, and crimping tool selections. Once I get closer to when Andy is shipping my NVR and cameras (after the Chinese New Year unfortunately), I'll purchase the remaining items. Request any thoughts or suggestions.
 
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