New User with no knowledge on home security cameras

dtbrey

n3wb
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
2
Reaction score
0
Location
Mason City, IA
Hello,

As my subject line indicates, I have NO knowledge about security cameras and registered with this forum to get some help. I have a strong knowledge of computers and have been using them long before there was a PC. But what I need help with is finding a camera that will do what I need. So here are my criteria, any thoughts?
1. I do not nor will I own a smart phone (yes I live in a flip phone world)
2. I spend half my week in a town 100 miles west of my home and would like a camera that can show me what is going on at home (acreage outside of town)
3. I am not worried about security since our home has a monitored security system (intrusion and fire).
4. I have Honeywell WiFi thermostats and can adjust the HVAC through their portal from any internet connected computer (again no smart phone)
5. Is there a camera that can connect to my WiFi and allow me to log onto an application or portal to look at the camera?
6. I would like a hard wire powered camera but want it to be WiFi so I do not need to drag network cables through the structure.

I conclude with the thought that every advertisement I look at shows and talks about smart phone and notices, They all want me to talk to people in front of my home, I have no need of this and would ignore it if it was part of the device. This camera would allow me to check how much snow is piled up in the drive, is the garbage container blown over and headed for the next county from the wind, and other such environmental things.

I would appreciate any help from those that understand this technology.
 

mat200

IPCT Contributor
Joined
Jan 17, 2017
Messages
13,670
Reaction score
22,775
Hello,

As my subject line indicates, I have NO knowledge about security cameras and registered with this forum to get some help. I have a strong knowledge of computers and have been using them long before there was a PC. But what I need help with is finding a camera that will do what I need. So here are my criteria, any thoughts?
1. I do not nor will I own a smart phone (yes I live in a flip phone world)
2. I spend half my week in a town 100 miles west of my home and would like a camera that can show me what is going on at home (acreage outside of town)
3. I am not worried about security since our home has a monitored security system (intrusion and fire).
4. I have Honeywell WiFi thermostats and can adjust the HVAC through their portal from any internet connected computer (again no smart phone)
5. Is there a camera that can connect to my WiFi and allow me to log onto an application or portal to look at the camera?
6. I would like a hard wire powered camera but want it to be WiFi so I do not need to drag network cables through the structure.

I conclude with the thought that every advertisement I look at shows and talks about smart phone and notices, They all want me to talk to people in front of my home, I have no need of this and would ignore it if it was part of the device. This camera would allow me to check how much snow is piled up in the drive, is the garbage container blown over and headed for the next county from the wind, and other such environmental things.

I would appreciate any help from those that understand this technology.
HI @dtbrey

I believe you can view many of the consumer cloud cameras via desktop browers... Ring, Arlo, Wyze. Nest, .. etc..

Did you look at those cloud dependent cameras?
 
Last edited:

sebastiantombs

Known around here
Joined
Dec 28, 2019
Messages
11,511
Reaction score
27,690
Location
New Jersey
:welcome:

Cameras can be a funny addiction. I started out the same way, wanting a wireless camera to monitor one, specific, area. That lasted a whole two weeks before things changed. Generally speaking WiFi and security, especially cameras, are mutually exclusive terms. WiFi was never meant to be able to support video streaming as it is used by a security camera. Sure, you can stream a movie, which is essentially a download that gets buffered in the device memory, but video upload is a constant, never ending, data transfer with no buffering. The result is frequent dropouts and loss of signal, information, and it always seems to happen at the worst possible moment.

Cloud based cameras are a big PITA. The delay between uploading the original video to the cloud and then being downloaded from the cloud results in very significant delays. Then there is the added security vulnerabilities of using n outside service to store that video plus, usually, some charge for storing that video for you. That can easily make an inexpensive camera cost more than installing a good camera and an NVR or VMS.

That said, any good wired camera can be made wireless using an encrypted, dedicated, RF link system. I have two cameras running from a RF link in a shed and never have any problems with drop outs or lost video feeds. It saved me trenching, burying conduit and using fiber converters for electrical isolation of the equipment.

While you may not own, or plan to own, a smart phone, a camera on your network, WiFi or wired, does present significant security concerns. Almost all of them, no matter who made them or whether they're wired or WiFi, have security flaws in their firmware that rarely gets addressed by the manufacturers. That leaves them vulnerable to hacking, not necessarily to watch your video but to use them in denial of service attacks, a "bot net", by hackers. Your ISP will not find that entertaining to say the least.

We all want "plug and play" but in todays world of technology that just isn't possible. It takes some level of attention to make sure things are as safe as can be reasonably configured.

My standard welcome -

Welcome to the enchanted land of video surveillance lunatics, good guys, nut jobs and miscreants (yes, I fit into at least three categories). There are a lot of knowledgeable people on here and knowledge and experience are shared constantly. That's how I got to be a lunatic (already a nut job and miscreant).

Start out by looking in the WiKi in the blue bar at the top of the page. There's a ton of very useful information in there and it needs to be viewed on a computer, not a phone or tablet. The Cliff Notes will be of particular interest although the camera models listed there are a generation old at this point. The best way to determine what kind of camera you need in each location and where each location should really be is to buy one varifocal camera first and set up a test stand for it that can be easily moved around. Test using that, viewing using the web interface of the camera, during the day and at night. Have someone walk around behaving like a miscreant and see if you can identify them. There is also information for choosing hardware and securing the system along with a whole bunch of other good stuff.

Don't chase megapixels unless you have a really BIG budget. General rule of thumb is that a 4MP camera will easily outperform an 8MP camera when they both have the same sensor size. Reason being that there are twice as many pixels in the 8MP versus the 4MP. This results in only half the available light getting to each pixel in an 8MP that a pixel in the 4MP "sees".

A dedicated PC doesn't need to be either expensive to purchase or to run. A used business class machine can be had from eBay and various other sources. The advances made in Blue Iris make it easily possible to run a fairly large system on relatively inexpensive hardware which also makes power consumption low, as in under 50 watts in many cases. The biggest expenses turn out to be hard drives for storing video and a PoE switch to power the cameras and, of course, the cameras themselves.

Three rules
Rule #1 - Cameras multiply like rabbits.
Rule #2 - Cameras are more addictive than drugs.
Rule #3 - You never have enough cameras.

Quick guide -

The smaller the lux number the better the low light performance. 0.002 is better than 0.02
The smaller the "F" of the lens the better the low light performance. F1.4 is better than F1.8
The larger the sensor the better the low light performance. 1/1.8" is better (bigger) than 1/2.7"
The higher the megapixels for the same size sensor the worse the low light performance. A 4MP camera with a 1/1.8" sensor will perform better than a 8MP camera with that same 1/1.8" sensor.

Don't believe all the marketing hype no matter who makes the camera. Don't believe those nice night time captures they all use. Look for videos, with motion, to determine low light performance. Any camera can be made to "see" color at night if the exposure time is long enough, as in half a second or longer. Rule of thumb, the shutter speed needs to be at 1/60 or higher to get night video without blurring.

Read the reviews here, most include both still shots and video.

Lens size, focal length, is another critical factor. Many people like the wide, sweeping, views of a 2.8mm lens but be aware that identification is problematic with a lens that wide. Watch this video to learn how to analyze each location for appropriate lens size and keep in mind that it may take two cameras to provide the coverage you need or desire. Another factor that effects view angles is the sensor size. Typically larger sensors will have a larger field of view in any given lens size.

The 5442 series of cameras by Dahua is the current "king of the hill". They are 4MP and capable of color with some ambient light at night. The 2231 series is a less expensive alternative in 2MP and does not have audio capabilities, no built in microphone, but is easier on the budget. The 3241T-ZAS has similar spcs as the 2231 and has audio. There are also cameras available from the IPCT Store right here on the forum and from Nelly's Security who has a thread in the vendors section.

5442 Reviews

Review - Loryata (Dahua OEM) IPC-T5442T-ZE varifocal Turret

Review - OEM IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP AI Varifocal Bullet Camera With Starlight+

Review-OEM 4mp AI Cam IPC-T5442TM-AS Starlight+ Turret

Review IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED (Turret, Full Color, Starlight+)

Review: IPC-HDBW5442R-ASE-NI - Dahua Technology Pro AI Bullet Network Camera

2231 Review
Review-OEM IPC-T2231RP-ZS 2mp Varifocal Turret Starlight Camera

3241T-ZAS Review

Less expensive models -

VPN Information Thread
 

dtbrey

n3wb
Joined
Feb 15, 2021
Messages
2
Reaction score
0
Location
Mason City, IA
HI @dtbrey

I believe you can view many of the consumer cloud cameras via desktop browers... Ring, Arlo, Wyze. Nest, .. etc..

Did you look at those cloud dependent cameras?
I have searched for the cameras but always get lost when it does not say directly that I can view it on a desktop or laptop computer. I realize I am a dinosaur when it comes to my choice of cell phones but simply see no need to be connected 24/7 in that manner. I did find this camera in the store that is attached to this forum. I had wanted an outdoor camera but suspect I may be able to construct and enclosure for it so that it would not be exposed to weather, assuming it could take a wide range of temperatures.

 

wittaj

IPCT Contributor
Joined
Apr 28, 2019
Messages
24,448
Reaction score
47,576
Location
USA
You would be much, much better off to do what most of us here do, and that is to use OpenVPN to VPN back into your home network and view the camera like you are sitting at home. OpenVPN does not cost money - it is standard on many routers, especially ASUS brand. Not to be mistaken with a paid VPN service that is to hide your IP to view porn and illegal netflix lol.

OpenVPN will work on a laptop.



You do not want to use a cloud-based camera or port forward or P2P or UPnP on any camera and keep the cameras isolated from the internet as was mentioned above or it will be hacked and not for someone to simply watch your video...


 

Teken

Known around here
Joined
Aug 11, 2020
Messages
1,521
Reaction score
2,747
Location
Canada
I have searched for the cameras but always get lost when it does not say directly that I can view it on a desktop or laptop computer. I realize I am a dinosaur when it comes to my choice of cell phones but simply see no need to be connected 24/7 in that manner. I did find this camera in the store that is attached to this forum. I had wanted an outdoor camera but suspect I may be able to construct and enclosure for it so that it would not be exposed to weather, assuming it could take a wide range of temperatures.

This is a great all around indoor camera but isn't designed for the outdoors. This camera runs hot so any extra heat will surely impact its service life. As @looney2ns provided use a outdoor rated camera - whatever brand you like. :thumb:

One thing to consider if you intend to view this camera remotely is the upload speed at that site. One camera at 2MP (1080P) on DSL will be fine but don't expect real time video without delay. If all you are doing is checking for snow, hall tall the grass is, no problem. But, if you intend to leave the terminal open 24.7.365 insure your internet service is capable of supporting the requirement.

Let us know what you end up doing once its in place . . .
 
Top