Paranoid LEO Need Installation in Small House

[Alex76]

Hi guys,

I have been silently stalking these threads for a few weeks. A little background. I am in law enforcement and have a few personal and work guns inside my house and I would like to protect them. I live in what always was a quiet neighborhood in a small town and never felt I needed added security. Well my truck has been broken into right in my driveway twice in the past 2 years. This last time I was home, I heard my dog going crazy and being LEO, I grabbed my gun and went outside to investigate. The dog must have scared them away because all I could see was a car speeding off. The steering column on my truck was broke. They tried to steal it and must have panicked and aborted the mission. I am an under cover LEO and keep my unmarked vehicle in the driveway as well. So a camera that can see far enough to cover my entire driveway in detail is a must. (Yes, i finally put an alarm in my old Chevy) As for the unmarked work car it has no alarm and doubt my department would pay for one. Before this incident I sometimes kept a gun in the lock box in the trunk. I would just like some help/input on what cameras/brand/type/resolution I should go with. I am thinking about an 8 camera system running on blue iris so it can be upgraded in the future as my paranoia increases. Thoughts or suggestions?

 

[tangent]

Cameras aren't a substitute for a normal alarm system. You can get cellular alarm monitoring for about $15/mo. You'd have to DIY the install or pay a bit more for the install but in the long run it's cheaper. It isn't that hard to install an alarm system.

Outdoor motion sensors yield far fewer false alerts than video based analytics. I'd probably wire a magnetic contact to the gate and a motion sensor at the front door and driveway, maybe the back patio depending on where your dog sleeps.

The current crowd favorite camera belongs to the Dahua Starlight Varifocal Turret (IPC-HDW5231R-Z) the newer ZE model is basically the same just the aesthetics have changed a bit. There's a less expensive fixed focus model, but being able to adjust the zoom is very helpful. You're fairly well positioned to try to capture license plates of passing cars, especially to the west. ALPR requires a dedicated camera generally with more zoom.

There's an online camera calculator that's worth playing with: IPVM Camera Calculator V3

Here's a mockup I made for you in a photoshop knockoff of what I'd consider some of the more important locations:

It's always a good idea to play with the actual camera a bit before you decide on exactly where you're going to mount it. Moving as little as a few inches can have a big impact. Keep walls, doors, fascia board, windows, etc out of frame as much as possible.

 

[bababouy]

What's your budget?

 

[Alex76]

@tangent thanks! That dose seem to be a very popular camera. Would you recommend the same camera as a plate reader as well? If it is focused further down the street? I just started playing with the camera calculator. It is very cool. I will look into security systems. Not sure why but I just assumed the price was astronomical.
@bababouy my budget is about $500 on cameras. I have to consider I will be investing on hardrive and blue iris on top of that.

 

[tangent]

@tangent thanks! That dose seem to be a very popular camera. Would you recommend the same camera as a plate reader as well? If it is focused further down the street? I just started playing with the camera calculator. It is very cool. I will look into security systems. Not sure why but I just assumed the price was astronomical.
@bababouy my budget is about $500 on cameras. I have to consider I will be investing on hardrive and blue iris on top of that.

No for LPR, you'd need one of the bullet's with more zoom like the IPC-HFW5231E-Z5E/IPC-HFW5231E-Z5 or IPC-HFW5231E-Z12E/IPC-HFW5231E-Z12. The Z12 would be the safer choice and it's only about $25 more.

The actual hardware costs for a typical Honeywell or DSC alarm would run $300-600 depending on the number of keypads (you'll want at least one full English keypad for progamming) and sensors and if you add a cellular or internet communicator.

As for cameras, your budget of $500 won't buy that many good cameras. You're better off with fewer good cameras than a large number of sub-par cameras.
For the front door I'd use either the HDBW wedge style of camera or one of the HDW starlights (5231/4231). Here's one of many thread on it: Front door ID camera IPC-HDBW4231F? (I'd go for the 3.6mm)
For the driveway I'd stick to the IPC-HDW5231R-Z, I like overlapping coverage but you could also put one centered over the garage.
Those 3 cameras would get you close to $500.

The Z12 for LPR would be a nice addition but costs more.
Inside the garage, you could use another IPC-HDW5231R-Z, an IPC-HDW-4231EM-AS, another IPC-HDBW4231, or some other less expensive camera. It's nice to be able to check if the garage is closed and see if somebody human or animal wanders in. An electronic lock is a good option on the door to the inside if you don't always lock it yourself.

The fixed focus starlight turret is a bit less: Dahua Starlight Fixed Lens Turret (IPC-HDW4231EM-AS) and could be used in other outdoor locations.

 

[bigredfish]

I'll let the Pro's here go on about the many benefits of Dahua Starlights and camera placement.. I'm a believer myself
See some of my video examples here: bigredfish59

Beyond the cameras and need for a home alarm system that is monitored, being LE, how can you store guns at home without locking them up in a safe? C'mon man...

As to car beak-ins yeah good cameras will help you see who did it after you wake up the next morning, but better yet is to spend $99 on one of these and catch the shitbag in the act. Guardline Alarm/Detector - they work as advertised.https://www.amazon.com/Guardline-Wireless-Driveway-Weatherproof-Detector/dp/B00HFZUKGM/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1514686407&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=guardline+wireless+driveway+alarm&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/Guardline-Wireless-Driveway-Weatherproof-Detector/dp/B00HFZUKGM/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1514686407&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=guardline+wireless+driveway+alarm&psc=1

 

[tangent]

As to car beak-ins yeah good cameras will help you see who did it after you wake up the next morning, but better yet is to spend $99 on one of these and catch the shitbag in the act. Guardline Alarm/Detector - they work as advertised.
https://www.amazon.com/Guardline-Wireless-Driveway-Weatherproof-Detector/dp/B00HFZUKGM/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1514686407&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=guardline+wireless+driveway+alarm&psc=1

I think there are better motion detector options that I'd either wire to the alarm system as chime only zones or to the nvr / computer using other devices. Personally I like the GE RCR-REX, @nayr likes the Optex OP-08. Depending on exactly what you want to cover there are lots of options like the DSC LC-151 or the cheap dual pir sensor model Paradox makes.

I have to consider I will be investing on hardrive and blue iris on top of that.

Blue Iris really should run on its own dedicated pc. Refurbished dell, hp, and lenovo i5 and i7 machines work well for around $400-600, sometimes $300 (i5) if you catch a good sale. You also need a PoE switch. NVRs are cheaper but a bit less versatile.

Also it would be a good idea to rotate the front door camera 90 degrees so the image is taller than it is wide.

 

[code2]

Listen to the boys posting above they are good at this stuff even the one or two on this board i cant stand still know their stuff


A family member being a narcotics officer aka you would never even know she was the police has a regular vehicle as a take home and not the typical standard issue kind, they are actually smart about it and use rental cars so if the plate is ran it comes back to a bogus address for a major city Im gonna go out on a limb and say your probably not under cover to the extent she is if you're taking home a normal unmarked car which stickers or not every one know who you are

She always said this

#1 give no fucks about the city owned car
#2 you're not undercover if you park it in your own driveway it DOESN'T TAKE long for people to figure it out.
#3 never park your city owned vehicle on your property WHY you may ask cause you then are responsible along with your home owners insurance if the city truly wanted to get technical if something should ever happen.

Its a city vehicle park that thing down the street or if you must have it use the garage you have in the picture out of site out of mind.

 

[fenderman]

#3 never park your city owned vehicle on your property WHY you may ask cause you then are responsible along with your home owners insurance if the city truly wanted to get technical if something should ever happen.

No...there is no theory of liability that would make OP more responsible by parking in his driveway.

 

[code2]

No...there is no theory of liability that would make OP more responsible by parking in his driveway.

You're missing the point the city insurance can and will find every way out of paying if they can make someone else pay they would go after the home owners insurance after all thats why you have it and it happens all the time. They can also look to see if the cause of what ever might happen be from negligence of the property owner etc etc. If you don't shovel your side walk and a person fall guess what you are responsible and liable. Bear in mind its not just about having the car broken into or stolen either if there is a fire etc etc.

Been there done that but then again I forgot you're not a lawyer.

 

[fenderman]

You're missing the point the city insurance can and will find every way out of paying if they can make someone else pay they would go after the home owners insurance after all thats why you have it and it happens all the time. They can also look to see if the cause of what ever might happen be from negligence of the property owner etc etc. If you don't shovel your side walk and a person fall guess what you are responsible and liable. Bear in mind its not just about having the car broken into or stolen either if there is a fire etc etc.

Been there done that but then again I forgot you're not a lawyer.

You are missing the point...every insurance company will try to avoid paying for a loss. ...if the loss is caused by operation of the car, damage to the car or theft from the car the homeowners policy will not cover it..this is covered under the vehicles liability and comprehensive portion of the policy....it wont matter one bit if the vehicle is parked in his driveway or down the block..

Not sure what shoveling the snow has to do with this...and actually in many states, if you are a residential home owner (as opposed to a commercial business owner or multifamily or rental property owner) you will not be liable for not shoveling in fact, poorly shoveling the snow to create a more dangerous condition could make you liable (you may be fined by the municipality for not shoveling but that is separate and distinct)..
Actually if you read the forums you would know that I AM a lawyer....and that I hate bullshitters who vomit advice...

 

[Q™]

...I hate bullshitters who vomit advice...

Vomit smiley!

​

 

[tangent]

The dog must have scared them away because all I could see was a car speeding off.

How big your dog is and where it spends its days and nights are relevant to the alarm system design and outdoor sensors. Kids could have an impact on what kind of coverage you want in the back yard.

We're happy to offer more advice, but the key is to participate in the discussion. Take your time, read, learn, and ask questions.

We also don't really have a clue as to how tech savvy or handy you are with power tools/construction. All we know is you found your way here. I've seen first hand what an overconfident LEO can do to their house, thinking the training they received on tapping phone lines and using fiber optic cameras was all they needed to know about computer networking.

Is your unmarked car equipped with lights (in the visors / headlights) and sirens or more discrete than that? The antennas are usually a dead giveaway. In an undercover situation two of the things I'd be most worried about would be tacking devices placed on my vehicle and phone malware.

 

[Alex76]

I'll let the Pro's here go on about the many benefits of Dahua Starlights and camera placement.. I'm a believer myself
See some of my video examples here: bigredfish59

Beyond the cameras and need for a home alarm system that is monitored, being LE, how can you store guns at home without locking them up in a safe? C'mon man...

As to car beak-ins yeah good cameras will help you see who did it after you wake up the next morning, but better yet is to spend $99 on one of these and catch the shitbag in the act. Guardline Alarm/Detector - they work as advertised.https://www.amazon.com/Guardline-Wireless-Driveway-Weatherproof-Detector/dp/B00HFZUKGM/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1514686407&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=guardline+wireless+driveway+alarm&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/Guardline-Wireless-Driveway-Weatherproof-Detector/dp/B00HFZUKGM/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1514686407&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=guardline+wireless+driveway+alarm&psc=1

Thanks @bigredfish I will look into the motion sensors. Is there some that can be integrated with blue iris or is that a total different deal?

I do have my guns in a safe. Over the years I have heard of many coworkers get their safes popped open and guns stolen.


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[Alex76]

Listen to the boys posting above they are good at this stuff even the one or two on this board i cant stand still know their stuff


A family member being a narcotics officer aka you would never even know she was the police has a regular vehicle as a take home and not the typical standard issue kind, they are actually smart about it and use rental cars so if the plate is ran it comes back to a bogus address for a major city Im gonna go out on a limb and say your probably not under cover to the extent she is if you're taking home a normal unmarked car which stickers or not every one know who you are

She always said this

#1 give no fucks about the city owned car
#2 you're not undercover if you park it in your own driveway it DOESN'T TAKE long for people to figure it out.
#3 never park your city owned vehicle on your property WHY you may ask cause you then are responsible along with your home owners insurance if the city truly wanted to get technical if something should ever happen.

Its a city vehicle park that thing down the street or if you must have it use the garage you have in the picture out of site out of mind.

Hi @code2 It sounds like I am the same level of under cover as your relative. I drive a regular car that is just leased and comes back registered to the rental company.

I just got back from vacation Thursday night. My car was broken into last night. I guess I will find out about the liability issues soon enough. I had nothing of value in the car. They took my $10 flashlight but they went through all my things and made a mess. It appears they jimmied the door because there are no signs of a break in and I know the car was locked. After returning from vacation I was so tired I didn't even hear my dog bark "assuming he did".

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[Alex76]

How big your dog is and where it spends its days and nights are relevant to the alarm system design and outdoor sensors. Kids could have an impact on what kind of coverage you want in the back yard.

We're happy to offer more advice, but the key is to participate in the discussion. Take your time, read, learn, and ask questions.

We also don't really have a clue as to how tech savvy or handy you are with power tools/construction. All we know is you found your way here. I've seen first hand what an overconfident LEO can do to their house, thinking the training they received on tapping phone lines and using fiber optic cameras was all they needed to know about computer networking.

Is your unmarked car equipped with lights (in the visors / headlights) and sirens or more discrete than that? The antennas are usually a dead giveaway. In an undercover situation two of the things I'd be most worried about would be tacking devices placed on my vehicle and phone malware.

Hi @tangent thank you for your continued input.

My dog is a Labrador about 100lbs and he sleeps in the garage with the garage door closed but he has a doggy door to the outside.

I would say I am above average tech savvy just not with security cameras. I did help install a 16 camera dvr unit years ago on my family ranch but that was so long ago and totally different technology as it was analog.

Also I have no kids so the backyard is just the dogs.

Sorry I was bot very active in the thread recently. I was enjoying Cancun.

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[Alex76]

Hi @tangent thank you for your continued input.

My dog is a Labrador about 100lbs and he sleeps in the garage with the garage door closed but he has a doggy door to the outside.

I would say I am above average tech savvy just not with security cameras. I did help install a 16 camera dvr unit years ago on my family ranch but that was so long ago and totally different technology as it was analog.

Also I have no kids so the backyard is just the dogs.

Sorry I was bot very active in the thread recently. I was enjoying Cancun.

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Also I am very handy with power tools. I grew up on a farm having to them constantly.

Other than the few weeks I have spent reading these forums I am totally new to the ipcam world.

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[Alex76]

The current crowd favorite camera belongs to the Dahua Starlight Varifocal Turret (IPC-HDW5231R-Z) the newer ZE model is basically the same just the aesthetics have changed a bit. There's a less expensive fixed focus model, but being able to adjust the zoom is very helpful. You're fairly well positioned to try to capture license plates of passing cars, especially to the west. ALPR requires a dedicated camera generally with more zoom.

is https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B073XLFHD4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
much different from the turret version? I notice there's a big difference in price. What is the catch?

 

[tangent]

The current crowd favorite camera belongs to the Dahua Starlight Varifocal Turret (IPC-HDW5231R-Z) the newer ZE model is basically the same just the aesthetics have changed a bit. There's a less expensive fixed focus model, but being able to adjust the zoom is very helpful. You're fairly well positioned to try to capture license plates of passing cars, especially to the west. ALPR requires a dedicated camera generally with more zoom.

is https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B073XLFHD4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
much different from the turret version? I notice there's a big difference in price. What is the catch?

very different. it's a dome camera, domes suck outside. it's a 4mp non-starlight camera which has much worse night performance. More megapixles often isn't a good thing especially at night. you just end up with a noisier lower quality image.

 

[Alex76]

very different. it's a dome camera, domes suck outside. it's a 4mp non-starlight camera which has much worse night performance. More megapixles often isn't a good thing especially at night. you just end up with a noisier lower quality image.

Ah so stick to 2mp turret outside? Maybe a bullet cam for license plate reading? Will that be better in 2mp form as well?