PoE Switch Suggestion List

[Teken]

A senior member suggested this to me - it seems to have a lot of good features so I wanted to share it:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08YP6Y3WQ?th=1

-16 Gigbit ports
-2 ports are 60w which can be good if you ever acquire a giant 45x PTZ.
-14 ports are 30w
-190w power budget
-competitively priced

If it matters:
-no uplink ports but with 1 gigabit ports it should be fine
-doesn't have a built-in plug
-external power supply
-NOT compatible with Ubiquiti devices which require 24V Passive PoE

Based on the vendors generously published specifications of 190 watts. You'll never ever be able to provide 30 watts per port. Let's just assume you actually had a piece of hardware that consumed 60 watts?!?

Just two of those ports would consume 120 watts . . .

That would leave you with only 70 watts for the remaining 14 ports. That equates to 5 watts left for the remaining 14 ports. Even if you ignore the two 60 watt ports and do some basic math of 190 / 16 = 11.87 watts.

That is a POE (AF) switch not a POE+ (AT) switch.

There isn't magic or fairy dust that will allow a underpowered POE Switch to output 30 watts per port and in this case that's (AT) spec. Anything far above that power output brings it to the POE++ (BT) range. This is why any real POE switch that's so rated as POE+ has no lower than 250 ~ 750 watts depending upon the number of ports. Some try to split hairs by simply denoting X ports can provide POE+ / POE++ but this is normally well called out.

The very first time you try to power anything on your network that comes even close to that rated advert. Expect to see and hear a poof, bang, to a whimper.

Everyone has a budget and few if any of us are made of money . . .

Regardless, lots of folks have spent a lot of time and finances to obtain some of the best in class video security hardware. It's a crying shame the rest of the network infrastructure isn't given the same priority! Nobody has to buy a Enterprise switch as there are countless 2nd tier brands already mentioned in this thread for reference. All of those devices are UL / cUL rated so you know it meets at the minimum of safety standards.

This in a related way means there's a measure of quality and design effort . . .

Everyday there are millions of people buying electronics that are no where close to being safe - never mind well designed. Yet, people are happy to shove these same devices into a hot closet, attic, or under their bed???

Besides the inconvenience of having to spend more time and money to replace the same. There are a percentage of these devices which are just a ticking time bomb about to light your house on fire. Your house burns down to the ground and the insurance company determines the root cause was X switch.

All they are interested to learn is if this thing had any electrical safety markings to support its safe to use in a persons dwelling.

If not, whelps you're truly SOL . . .

The market has tons of options that span 1st tier (Enterprise) to 2nd tier (Consumer) class that it makes very little sense in buying 3rd tier (China Blue Light Special) with no real warranty, support, safety testing etc.

 

[sebastiantombs]

A senior member suggested this to me - it seems to have a lot of good features so I wanted to share it:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08YP6Y3WQ?th=1

-16 Gigbit ports
-2 ports are 60w which can be good if you ever acquire a giant 45x PTZ.
-14 ports are 30w
-190w power budget
-competitively priced

If it matters:
-no uplink ports but with 1 gigabit ports it should be fine
-doesn't have a built-in plug
-external power supply
-NOT compatible with Ubiquiti devices which require 24V Passive PoE

I'm a member and pretty "senior" at my age. I can't recommend BVTech switches at all. I owned a 16 port, bought based on price and rating by the manufacturer. It did support 11 cameras well until there was a momentary power drop. It would not start under load and I had to unplug all the cameras then plug them back in, one at a time, to get it running again. That happened three more time and the last time it would not start at all, even with zero load other than the switch itself.

Looking at the insides it looks like they use a cheap switching power supply that isn't capable of handling startup loading on the PoE side. Unless they've made some big improvements in their power supplies, you may find the exact same behavior.

I'm using IPCamPower 16 port switches. They seem to have a much more robust power supply and easily start up with a dozen cameras plugged into them. Lookin the IPCT store or at Nelly's Security, also a member here for sourcing as well as Amazon.

As with everything YMMV, but be skeptical of BVTech PoE switches or even their non PoE switches. Low end power is built in failure.

 

[TL1096r]

I'm a member and pretty "senior" at my age. I can't recommend BVTech switches at all. I owned a 16 port, bought based on price and rating by the manufacturer. It did support 11 cameras well until there was a momentary power drop. It would not start under load and I had to unplug all the cameras then plug them back in, one at a time, to get it running again. That happened three more time and the last time it would not start at all, even with zero load other than the switch itself.

Looking at the insides it looks like they use a cheap switching power supply that isn't capable of handling startup loading on the PoE side. Unless they've made some big improvements in their power supplies, you may find the exact same behavior.

I'm using IPCamPower 16 port switches. They seem to have a much more robust power supply and easily start up with a dozen cameras plugged into them. Lookin the IPCT store or at Nelly's Security, also a member here for sourcing as well as Amazon.

As with everything YMMV, but be skeptical of BVTech PoE switches or even their non PoE switches. Low end power is built in failure.

Thanks - that helps to have someone who used this product. The IPCamPower are all gigabit ports?

I was simply looking for at least 1 60w port to run a larger 45x PTZ to avoid any power issues. Is this something you are able to do with the suggested switch?

Based on the vendors generously published specifications of 190 watts. You'll never ever be able to provide 30 watts per port. Let's just assume you actually had a piece of hardware that consumed 60 watts?!?

Just two of those ports would consume 120 watts . . .

That would leave you with only 70 watts for the remaining 14 ports. That equates to 5 watts left for the remaining 14 ports. Even if you ignore the two 60 watt ports and do some basic math of 190 / 16 = 11.87 watts.

That is a POE (AF) switch not a POE+ (AT) switch.

There isn't magic or fairy dust that will allow a underpowered POE Switch to output 30 watts per port and in this case that's (AT) spec. Anything far above that power output brings it to the POE++ (BT) range. This is why any real POE switch that's so rated as POE+ has no lower than 250 ~ 750 watts depending upon the number of ports. Some try to split hairs by simply denoting X ports can provide POE+ / POE++ but this is normally well called out.

The very first time you try to power anything on your network that comes even close to that rated advert. Expect to see and hear a poof, bang, to a whimper.

Everyone has a budget and few if any of us are made of money . . .

Regardless, lots of folks have spent a lot of time and finances to obtain some of the best in class video security hardware. It's a crying shame the rest of the network infrastructure isn't given the same priority! Nobody has to buy a Enterprise switch as there are countless 2nd tier brands already mentioned in this thread for reference. All of those devices are UL / cUL rated so you know it meets at the minimum of safety standards.

This in a related way means there's a measure of quality and design effort . . .

Everyday there are millions of people buying electronics that are no where close to being safe - never mind well designed. Yet, people are happy to shove these same devices into a hot closet, attic, or under their bed???

Besides the inconvenience of having to spend more time and money to replace the same. There are a percentage of these devices which are just a ticking time bomb about to light your house on fire. Your house burns down to the ground and the insurance company determines the root cause was X switch.

All they are interested to learn is if this thing had any electrical safety markings to support its safe to use in a persons dwelling.

If not, whelps you're truly SOL . . .

The market has tons of options that span 1st tier (Enterprise) to 2nd tier (Consumer) class that it makes very little sense in buying 3rd tier (China Blue Light Special) with no real warranty, support, safety testing etc.

Ok thanks for explaining. It is always good to have more info. I am not familiar with these switches or ever used them.
I have a 70w port now but I have outgrew it and wanted to search for a more powerful switch:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07LH8R3FH/

The bvtech says AF POE+? How is it able to deliver deliver that much over 1 port if it is not?

I don't think you will ever need that much power per port - the 60w is if you have 1 big PTZ it will work in that 1 port and the rest of the cams should not exceed 60w.

Are you suggesting a different switch instead or did I miss it in a different post?

 

[sebastiantombs]

You don't need gigabit ports for cameras. Even a 4K, 8MP, camera doesn't even approach 10Mb/ps. Gig ports across the board are nothing more than a marketing gimmick in terms of usefulness, or necessity, for surveillance camera use. It's kind of like buying a camera based on megapixels only and ignoring the reality that the sensor size is what counts. Gig ports for cameras just aren't needed now and will probably never be needed. All you need is an uplink port or two to get the aggregated traffic to the NVR/VMS. I have 22 cameras running and see a maximum of 300Mb/ps from them.

 

[TL1096r]

You don't need gigabit ports for cameras. Even a 4K, 8MP, camera doesn't even approach 10Mb/ps. Gig ports across the board are nothing more than a marketing gimmick in terms of usefulness, or necessity, for surveillance camera use. It's kind of like buying a camera based on megapixels only and ignoring the reality that the sensor size is what counts. Gig ports for cameras just aren't needed now and will probably never be needed. All you need is an uplink port or two to get the aggregated traffic to the NVR/VMS. I have 22 cameras running and see a maximum of 300Mb/ps from them.

Excellent - got to unlearn old ways sometimes.

How would your suggested switch work with a 45x PTZ that requires 36w?

 

[sebastiantombs]

You'll need something with a PoE++, 802.3bt, rating. Look at Netgear for one, anyway.

Here's a four port from IPCamPower as an example -

https://www.amazon.com/IPCamPower-802-3bt-Network-Designed-Lighting/dp/B089VDXQRW

 

[Teken]

Thanks - that helps to have someone who used this product. The IPCamPower are all gigabit ports?

I was simply looking for at least 1 60w port to run a larger 45x PTZ to avoid any power issues. Is this something you are able to do with the suggested switch?




Ok thanks for explaining. It is always good to have more info. I am not familiar with these switches or ever used them.
I have a 70w port now but I have outgrew it and wanted to search for a more powerful switch:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07LH8R3FH/

The bvtech says AF POE+? How is it able to deliver deliver that much over 1 port if it is not?

I don't think you will ever need that much power per port - the 60w is if you have 1 big PTZ it will work in that 1 port and the rest of the cams should not exceed 60w.

Are you suggesting a different switch instead or did I miss it in a different post?

I’ll be honest with you if your not willing to spend the money on a 1st / 2nd tier POE switch. You’re better served by using a dedicated low voltage cable or a POE injector to power that power hungry PTZ.

This insures that device is always provided the needed power to operate. Second, it will never ever tax your primary POE switch. Which translates to longer service life and reduces the chance of burning up the main switch for your video security system.

Lastly, this gives you a measure of redundancy if edge recording is present. Imagine the main POE switch goes down (doesn’t matter the why) since the PTZ is still being powers by 120 VAC it will continue to record.

If the camera incorporates the latest technology of ANR (Automatic Network Replenishment) or back fill.

That same data will be uploaded to the NVR / VMS once the network is back on line.

I know it’s all the rage to have a single Ethernet cable to provide data & power. It’s fast, simple, and saves lots of money. The reality is almost every serious installation uses a combination of dedicated POE injector or power cable to supply the needed power.

When a PTZ incorporates a heater, wiper, radar, laser etc. Ethernet cable simply isn’t enough to sustain a high level of reliability and safety.

 

[TL1096r]

I’ll be honest with you if your not willing to spend the money on a 1st / 2nd tier POE switch. You’re better served by using a dedicated low voltage cable or a POE injector to power that power hungry PTZ.

This insures that device is always provided the needed power to operate. Second, it will never ever tax your primary POE switch. Which translates to longer service life and reduces the chance of burning up the main switch for your video security system.

Lastly, this gives you a measure of redundancy if edge recording is present. Imagine the main POE switch goes down (doesn’t matter the why) since the PTZ is still being powers by 120 VAC it will continue to record.

If the camera incorporates the latest technology of ANR (Automatic Network Replenishment) or back fill.

That same data will be uploaded to the NVR / VMS once the network is back on line.

I know it’s all the rage to have a single Ethernet cable to provide data & power. It’s fast, simple, and saves lots of money. The reality is almost every serious installation uses a combination of dedicated POE injector or power cable to supply the needed power.

When a PTZ incorporates a heater, wiper, radar, laser etc. Ethernet cable simply isn’t enough to sustain a high level of reliability and safety.

It wasn't about not spending the money on a top tier POE. POE injector sounds like a better idea - are you suggesting any that you use or with good ratings? It could be good to learn by what you suggest.

Thanks

 

[OICU2]

My goto is Netgear, specifically the GS110TP. Been running them for many years with no issues. I use them with VLANs on my regular network and for POE on my cam network so if a cam gets hung up, I can log in to the switch and bounce the port. They can be snagged on ebay for cheap if you are patient. Even the Netgear GS108PE isn't bad but it only has 4 of the 8 ports with POE.

 

[Teken]

It wasn't about not spending the money on a top tier POE. POE injector sounds like a better idea - are you suggesting any that you use or with good ratings? It could be good to learn by what you suggest.

Thanks

Normally a person would use the included power supply or recommend POE Injector referenced by the PTZ maker.

This is especially important if the hardware uses a proprietary voltage output vs industry standard AF / AT / BT for POE. Lots of makers use crazy voltage that span 12-60 VDC.

Whereas as others use 24 VAC.

You can look up any of the major video security makers to see what POE injectors they offer if any. Assuming you can’t purchase the OEM version from a online vendor.

One example is from Ubiquiti which offers 24/5X VDC which span 15 ~ 65+ watts. TrendNet is a well known consumer brand that offer reliable hardware. Keep in mind almost none of these manufacturers actually make their PSU.

They are all 3rd party which is fine because they all conform to industry best standards and safety.

 

[EvanVanVan]

I ordered a NETGEAR 8-Port Gigabit Ethernet Unmanaged PoE+ Switch (GS308PP) before finding this thread. Now I'm concerned it wont deliver enough power for my needs. Eventually I may want to run a IPC-B5442E-Z4E and two IR illuminator's using PFT1300 splitter/extenders on a single CAT6. I can't find exactly what the max wattage per port is for the Netgear but it's still an unmanaged switch and won't let me manually allocate it.

Now I'm considering the IPCamPower 8 Port POE Network Switch W/ 2 Additional Uplink Ports | IPCP-8P2G-AF2, but it kind of sucks the two uplink ports are only 10/100. As you can see from the attached picture my future plans include a few cameras on the other side of the road (around the barn). I was planning on adding another PoE switch over there and only running one cat6 back to my main switch. If I go with the IPCamPower 16 Port POE Network Switch W/ 2 Gigabit Uplink Ports | IPCP-16P2G-AF2 instead as the main switch, 16 ports seem like overkill but maybe I just run individual cat6s back for all the cameras on barn.

On the other hand, if I go with a NETGEAR 8 Port PoE Gigabit Ethernet Plus Switch (GS308EPP) at least I'm guaranteed at least 30W for a port/the cameras+2x illuminators.

Decisions, decisions. Lol any advice?

edit: lol I should probably just go with the 16 Port IPCamPower and grow in to it, right???
edit2: fixed links

 

[Sybertiger]

Guess my choice is frowned upon because it doesn't have a "brand" name on it. Don't matter...they are all made in China.

Amazon.com

 

[Teken]

I ordered a NETGEAR 8-Port Gigabit Ethernet Unmanaged PoE+ Switch (GS308PP) before finding this thread. Now I'm concerned it wont deliver enough power for my needs. Eventually I may want to run a IPC-B5442E-Z4E and two IR illuminator's using PFT1300 splitter/extenders on a single CAT6. I can't find exactly what the max wattage per port is for the Netgear but it's still an unmanaged switch and won't let me manually allocate it.

Now I'm considering the IPCamPower 8 Port POE Network Switch W/ 2 Additional Uplink Ports | IPCP-8P2G-AF2, but it kind of sucks the two uplink ports are only 10/100. As you can see from the attached picture my future plans include a few cameras on the other side of the road (around the barn). I was planning on adding another PoE switch over there and only running one cat6 back to my main switch. If I go with the IPCamPower 16 Port POE Network Switch W/ 2 Gigabit Uplink Ports | IPCP-16P2G-AF2 instead as the main switch, 16 ports seem like overkill but maybe I just run individual cat6s back for all the cameras on barn.

On the other hand, if I go with a NETGEAR 8 Port PoE Gigabit Ethernet Plus Switch (GS308EPP) at least I'm guaranteed at least 30W for a port/the cameras+2x illuminators.

Decisions, decisions. Lol any advice?

edit: lol I should probably just go with the 16 Port IPCamPower and grow in to it, right???

View attachment 136148

The last switch you referenced

https://a.co/d/i1pJGbJ

has a 123 watt PSU. If all eight ports were utilized that would be 15.37 watts per port which is a POE AF. As was stated in this thread the lowest power anyone should even consider is 250 watts.

If you do the simple math 250 / 8 = 31.25 watts per port . . .

There isn't any magic when it comes to what a POE Switch can or will provide in terms of output power. All these switches do is share (split) the total power among each other. The only difference as it relates to a POE AT (30 watts) is if a port(s) can output 30 watt AT.

You'll see on lower end switches where the company will simply say a single port offers 30 watt (POE AT) but the rest only support 15 watt (POE AF).

In 2022 it absolutely makes no sense buying any POE Switch that isn't 1GB capable. It also makes little sense buying a switch that doesn't offer at least 250 watts. Your going to pay more for said switch but this is an investment into something you already have spent gobs of money and time on.

Everything in the infrastructure from the wire to the switch is important.

No one has to spend tons of money but people do have to research and invest the proper amount of funds on the hardware that's going to be operating 24.7.365! There isn't a soul who has ever bought a cheap POE Switch that didn't have some kind of regret and than had to spend more money later on . . .

Buy once . . . Cry once . . .

 

[sebastiantombs]

If you're running an extra CAT cable just to power auxiliary IR lighting why not just run a 16/2 or 18/2 cable, with the appropriate use rating like CMR, instead. A three amp, 12 volt brick will easily handle a couple of IR lights and cut the load on the switch. All of my IRs, six at the moment, are powered that way.

 

[EvanVanVan]

If you're running an extra CAT cable just to power auxiliary IR lighting why not just run a 16/2 or 18/2 cable, with the appropriate use rating like CMR, instead. A three amp, 12 volt brick will easily handle a couple of IR lights and cut the load on the switch. All of my IRs, six at the moment, are powered that way.

2 questions,

1. I wasn't clear on running low voltage like that along side unshielded cat6 in the same conduit run? Any interference issues? I saw you mention that in another post to someone else and considered it

2. The one run is long enough where I'll need the PFT1300 extenders anyway (at a minimum one). I don't want to bury junction boxes so that longest run is going to pass through a couple of other cameras first. It was just going to work out well that I'd have the extra "split" port in the mount of two of my most "interesting" cameras. I wasn't running a extra CAT6 just for IR illuminators. The negative being I would power 2x IR illuminators and a Z4E on the longest run...

 

[sebastiantombs]

You can run low voltage cables in the same conduit as CAT cables. Interference is minimal at worst and with 12VDC non-existent.

From the sound of things you're going to run into problems no matter how you do it. You're getting past the distance and power levels that PoE+ can supply. Remember those extenders also consume power, they don't operate for free. What kind of distance approximately, in feet, are we talking about here?

 

[EvanVanVan]

You can run low voltage cables in the same conduit as CAT cables. Interference is minimal at worst and with 12VDC non-existent.

From the sound of things you're going to run into problems no matter how you do it. You're getting past the distance and power levels that PoE+ can supply. Remember those extenders also consume power, they don't operate for free. What kind of distance approximately, in feet, are we talking about here?

Sorry, I know this is not really the correct thread for this discussion but thanks for the help. The total distance of my farthest camera is only approximately 475' (Camera 1 switched locations a little bit from my original diagram.)

Whoops a little typo in that quick diagram...technically, both (2) cables will terminate at Camera #2 (@ approximately 225'), one for the camera and the other for the PFT1300, that will then extend on to Camera #3...

 

[EvanVanVan]

Back on the subject, I am not really not finding many/any consumer grade PoE+s that meet @Teken 's advice of total watts/ports >= 30W.

The only one on the suggestion list I'm seeing is this one: IPCP-8P2G-AT - 8 Port POE Plus Switch W/ 2 Gigabit Uplinks which would be exactly what I'm looking for but it doesn't seem to be a real IPCamPower switch. That's the only result for it on google and it says "By ICOMTECH" at the end of the listing

 

[jmltech]

I’ve been using this POE switch. It is manage, so you can see what the wattage is for each port, as well as adjust the POE++ ports into POE+ or just plain POE. The only thing I don’t like is that there isn’t a separate lan port. 8 ports, 230 watts
Netgear POE++ and POE+ switch

 

[sebastiantombs]

Even if you go to PoE++, and that IPCamPower switch seems pretty decent by the specs, you're really pushing the power limits over that total distance. That also assumes, and we know what that can do, that the extender will actually pass PoE++ power levels and I'm not sure that they do that.

At that distance 16/2 wouldn't be sufficient, either. I'd say more like 12/2 or even 10/2 to cut the voltage drop. You're getting really far out from the power source. Whatever you decide to try I'd say string the cables on the ground temporarily, and test to make sure everything works before going to the trouble of conduit and pulling cable. I sure hope you have access to a trencher at a cheap price!